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Trey
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Joined: 26 Apr 2001
Posts: 25928
Location: out there
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 Posted: Mon Mar 06, 2006 11:52 pm Post subject: Kobe's first free throw of the game >>7:28 mark of the FOURTH - His 27th and 28th points... LEGIT? *wanna hear from the purists |
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Was that LEGIT
Was that reality?
I want to hear from the people who hate the conspiracy talk... I want to know if that was HONEST NON-BIASED OFFICIATING
http://www.nba.com/games/20060306/SASLAL/playbyplay.html
7:28
[LAL 72-87] Bryant Free Throw 1 of 2 (27 PTS)
Ginobili Substitution replaced by Duncan 7:28
7:28
[LAL 73-87] Bryant Free Throw 2 of 2 (28 PTS) |
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statman
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| Posted: Mon Mar 06, 2006 11:57 pm Post subject: Re: Kobe's first free throw of the game >>7:28 mark of the FOURTH - His 27th and 28th points... LEGIT? |
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If you look closely at the box score you so kindly linked in, you'll notice that the entire Spurs team only shot 7 free throws. Kinda takes the oomph out of your argument. |
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STiG909
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Joined: 18 Jun 2005
Posts: 1687
Location: Inland Empire
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| Posted: Mon Mar 06, 2006 11:58 pm Post subject: |
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The refs seemingly changed their mind on how they were going to call the game. It happens all the time and it's a huge problem for the players to try and adjust to it. The flagrant foul call and missed 3 pointer had me going  |
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shnjb
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Joined: 08 Oct 2002
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| Posted: Mon Mar 06, 2006 11:59 pm Post subject: |
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It wasn't anything out of the ordinary.
Ordinary being incompetent officiating that we've become accustomed to. |
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aiel
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Joined: 16 May 2001
Posts: 1211
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| Posted: Mon Mar 06, 2006 11:59 pm Post subject: |
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| The thing that bothers me is when kobe is settling for deep jumpers he doesn't deserve to go to the line. Tonight he attacked the rim and the refs continued to ignore the fouls. I usually don't complain about the refs, but yeah kobe was robbed. |
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aiel
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| Posted: Tue Mar 07, 2006 12:02 am Post subject: Re: Kobe's first free throw of the game >>7:28 mark of the FOURTH - His 27th and 28th points... LEGIT? |
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| statman wrote: |
If you look closely at the box score you so kindly linked in, you'll notice that the entire Spurs team only shot 7 free throws. Kinda takes the oomph out of your argument. |
Wrong. The spurs were shooting and making outside shots, they shouldn't be going to the line. Kobe however, attacked the basket and was fouled repeatedly with no call. |
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Trey
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| Posted: Tue Mar 07, 2006 12:02 am Post subject: Re: Kobe's first free throw of the game >>7:28 mark of the FOURTH - His 27th and 28th points... LEGIT? |
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| statman wrote: |
If you look closely at the box score you so kindly linked in, you'll notice that the entire Spurs team only shot 7 free throws. Kinda takes the oomph out of your argument. |
Damn.. that is odd.. but I still say they let Kobe get knocked around FAR TOO LONG before they ever "chose" to call the foul. |
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CBaller8
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Joined: 17 Feb 2002
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Location: Reseda, CA
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| Posted: Tue Mar 07, 2006 12:04 am Post subject: |
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| Which is why alot of times Kobe doesn't drive to the rim b/c he doesn't get calls. Tonight was a perfect example. Yet you clowns continually piss n moan bout kobe taken jump shots. |
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tgf5
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Joined: 18 Jun 2005
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Location: Canada
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| Posted: Tue Mar 07, 2006 12:11 am Post subject: |
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| Kobe attacks and gets fouled 3-4 times with no call, then Lamar makes a play on the ball and it was Parker's momentum that threw himself to the floor. That was BS. |
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aiel
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| Posted: Tue Mar 07, 2006 12:12 am Post subject: |
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| The only clowns are those content to watch kobe jack up poor % deep jump shots. |
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CBaller8
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| Posted: Tue Mar 07, 2006 12:16 am Post subject: |
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| aiel wrote: | | The only clowns are those content to watch kobe jack up poor % deep jump shots. |
LOL Kobe's been doing it for years he won't change so deal with it. You all complain bout it way to much. |
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Muad'Dib
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| Posted: Tue Mar 07, 2006 12:21 am Post subject: |
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| aiel wrote: | | The only clowns are those content to watch kobe jack up poor % deep jump shots. |
Yeah, he shot a horrible % tonight.
What was it--just barely over 50%?
He was getting raped on every take (no hyperbole there); and every time he blew by Bowen, Kobe's a) bicep, b) offhand forearm, or c) jersey was being grabbed by Brucey Bruce. No calls. |
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alexjlake_gr8t
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Location: SAN DOG...
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| Posted: Tue Mar 07, 2006 12:23 am Post subject: |
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| aiel wrote: | | The only clowns are those content to watch kobe jack up poor % deep jump shots. |
You mistake content for an unspoken truth...
Kobe has not and continues to not recieve the benefit of the doubt when it comes to him driving to the hole, ie sterns, istons, etc.
As a Laker fan, you should know this by now.
So, not content my friend, but acceptance until it changes...
When will he receive Jordan's protection? :roll:  NEVER...
_________________
Quote from 12/15/15 vs Bucks:
At least this is the last time we'll have to witness it. have at it Kobe. |
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Trey
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| Posted: Tue Mar 07, 2006 12:37 am Post subject: |
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| aiel wrote: | | The only clowns are those content to watch kobe jack up poor % deep jump shots. |
I am going to assume you are saying the clowns are the ones who refuse to acknowledge the reason he sometimes settles for the jumper? Because the league has done all they can to take away Kobes superior inside game by allowing the opponent to foul him, sometimes flagrantly, without a whistle being heard. |
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superboy
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Joined: 01 Dec 2004
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| Posted: Tue Mar 07, 2006 12:50 am Post subject: |
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| Quote: | | If you look closely at the box score you so kindly linked in, you'll notice that the entire Spurs team only shot 7 free throws. Kinda takes the oomph out of your argument. |
I still, to this day, don't understand why the number of free throws one team shoots should have any bearing on the number of free throws the opposing team shoots. If one team fouls 20 times and the other team fouls 10 times, then isn't it fair for one team to shoot twice as many free throws?
If Kobe gets fouled driving to the hole, he should get the free throws. That doesn't mean the Spurs deserve free throws also. It simply means Kobe got fouled and should shoot free throws. Period. It doesn't have to balance out, they have nothing to do with each other.
Now, if you take a large group of games as a whole and analyze the balance of free throws, and there is a big discrepancy, then you have a more legitimate argument.
All of you who take the high and mighty stance, and call us "whiners" out for supposedly acting like Queens fans, you aren't seeing what's right in front of your face. Kobe gets hacked constantly without anything so much as resembling superstar treatment. i would say he gets treated more like a rookie than a superstar most of the time. And on top of the beating he takes, and as much as Kobe tries to ignore it, the refs still are pretty quick to call a technical on Kobe for complaining. If you don't think the refs in general resent Kobe deep down in their gut, you're on crack. Do this test, pull aside a random non-Laker (heck even a typical Laker) fan and ask him if they hate Kobe. He is very much hated universally. That's something he has to deal with forever probably.
Maybe Barry Bonds is hated more than Kobe, but at least Bonds asks for it by consistently being cranky to the media! What has Kobe ever done besides be aloof and withdrawn? DOn't even bring up the rape thing because people hated him long before that, it just gave them a chance to be more vocal.
The hatred for Kobe will never go away, not even with more championships. I've accepted that, and frankly, it has really discouraged me from following the NBA as closely as I used to in years past. |
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stojan
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| Posted: Tue Mar 07, 2006 2:12 am Post subject: |
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| Quote: | Yeah, he shot a horrible % tonight.
What was it--just barely over 50%?
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wow i didnt know 50% was a bad percentage from the field espicially when u rnt scoring inside.
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Jerome James being asked what he thought about his coach calling him selfish, his response was:
"I don't have the first clue who he is talking about, because all I worry about is Jerome." |
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sodapoppenski
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Joined: 24 Apr 2005
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Location: Washington, DC
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| Posted: Tue Mar 07, 2006 2:22 am Post subject: |
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1st half - refs were not very kind to us. Yes, there were virtually no calls
on both sides - but we happened to have been deserving of alot more
which didn't get called - KOBE IN PARTICULAR.
He got flat out wrecked 2 times I can remember in that first half with no
whistle, one other time that would usually get a call but maybe I could
understand with the refs "lettin' 'em play."
2nd half - Duncan and Kobe both got robbed of a couple, but honestly it
was just a loosely called half and was pretty fair to both sides.
As for conspiracy theory though - who do you think a "loosely called game"
benefits more? 
(and no, I'm not calling it conspiracy... just puttin' it on the table)  |
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statman
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| Posted: Tue Mar 07, 2006 3:37 am Post subject: |
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| superboy wrote: |
I still, to this day, don't understand why the number of free throws one team shoots should have any bearing on the number of free throws the opposing team shoots. If one team fouls 20 times and the other team fouls 10 times, then isn't it fair for one team to shoot twice as many free throws? |
You are right, there shouldn't be any expectation for a team or a player to shoot a certain # of free throws on a certain night. Ironically, that is what the originator of this thread is claiming though... that since Kobe didn't get a certain # of free throws obviously the refs were out to get him.
Of course Kobe is going to get robbed of some calls. But that's true of every player in the league and the fact that he is among the tops in FT attempts should prove to all but the most biased homers that he is not treated particularly badly. In fact, if you look at the percentage of shots Kobe takes from the perimeter as opposed to the paint, he is getting very favorable treatment.
Fans see what they want to see. I'm sure Spurs fans can find more than 7 FT attempts that their ENTIRE TEAM deserved over the course of this game, but of course that isn't discussed here because everyone wants to believe that Kobe and the Lakers are so mistreated by the league. The logic behind that is laughable. |
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LakeLakeLake
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| Posted: Tue Mar 07, 2006 3:52 am Post subject: |
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| alexjlake_gr8t wrote: | | aiel wrote: | | The only clowns are those content to watch kobe jack up poor % deep jump shots. |
You mistake content for an unspoken truth...
Kobe has not and continues to not recieve the benefit of the doubt when it comes to him driving to the hole, ie sterns, istons, etc.
As a Laker fan, you should know this by now.
So, not content my friend, but acceptance until it changes...
When will he receive Jordan's protection? :roll: NEVER... |
It's a myth. 
As I pointed out in another thread (some weeks ago), Kobe is on par with Jordans FGA/FTA-ratio (if not slightly better). There's no statistical evidence that the refs give Kobe less protection.
For those who don't believe it:
Jordan 1986-87 (scoring average 37,1 ppg): 2.279 fg-attempts, 972 ft-attempts, ratio: 2,65
Kobe 2005-06 (scoring average 35,1 ppg): 1.544 fg-attempts, 625 ft-attempts, ratio: 2,47 |
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astrallionheart
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| Posted: Tue Mar 07, 2006 4:10 am Post subject: |
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| alexjlake_gr8t wrote: |
When will he receive Jordan's protection? :roll: NEVER... |
Hmm...well if you are referring to "protection" as 13% less free throws as a ratio of points scored...yes, I would prefer Kobe not to have that kind of "protection."
I always thought the "protection" Jordan got was more on the defensive side. The things he got away with to get steals/double teams (reaching in to wrench the ball away, not a "play for the pass" timing type of stealer). Of course if you think about it, most defensive aces get away with these things. Sort of a earn the right to be called lighter because you are more aggressive sort of thing. I mean, Kobe is active occasionally like that (at the beginning of seasons, he usually hustles down the court to make a key block or so), but Jordan did that all season.
Offensively I give the ball to Kobe, I mean he scores anyway he wants. Jordan just recycles a bunch of indefensible pet moves, but like watching Tony Parker's indefensible drive, it gets boring after a while. The defensive intensity and hustle, would be nice to see, especially since Jordan kept that defensive fire going until he hit around 33. Kobes 27...I want to see Kobe hustle on D like he did when he was 21. Of course, they are different people with different bodies. What a fan wants and what a player can do are different things. |
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Car54
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| Posted: Tue Mar 07, 2006 7:57 am Post subject: Re: Kobe's first free throw of the game >>7:28 mark of the FOURTH - His 27th and 28th points... LEGIT? |
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| aiel wrote: | | Wrong. The spurs were shooting and making outside shots, they shouldn't be going to the line. Kobe however, attacked the basket and was fouled repeatedly with no call. |
pretty much |
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Wannabeer
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Joined: 27 Jun 2005
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| Posted: Tue Mar 07, 2006 8:02 am Post subject: Re: Kobe's first free throw of the game >>7:28 mark of the FOURTH - His 27th and 28th points... LEGIT? |
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| statman wrote: |
If you look closely at the box score you so kindly linked in, you'll notice that the entire Spurs team only shot 7 free throws. Kinda takes the oomph out of your argument. |
Exactly. They called in the same on both ends, letting them play. I prefer this type of game to be honest with you. Laker fans might not like it because Kobe normally lives on the free throw line, but I think it made for a very good flowing game...so get over it all ready and get ready for the next opponent. I sure hope the Lakers are not looking ahead to friday.... |
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Muad'Dib
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Joined: 19 Sep 2004
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| Posted: Tue Mar 07, 2006 8:05 am Post subject: |
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| LakeLakeLake wrote: | | alexjlake_gr8t wrote: | | aiel wrote: | | The only clowns are those content to watch kobe jack up poor % deep jump shots. |
You mistake content for an unspoken truth...
Kobe has not and continues to not recieve the benefit of the doubt when it comes to him driving to the hole, ie sterns, istons, etc.
As a Laker fan, you should know this by now.
So, not content my friend, but acceptance until it changes...
When will he receive Jordan's protection? :roll: NEVER... |
It's a myth.
As I pointed out in another thread (some weeks ago), Kobe is on par with Jordans FGA/FTA-ratio (if not slightly better). There's no statistical evidence that the refs give Kobe less protection.
For those who don't believe it:
Jordan 1986-87 (scoring average 37,1 ppg): 2.279 fg-attempts, 972 ft-attempts, ratio: 2,65
Kobe 2005-06 (scoring average 35,1 ppg): 1.544 fg-attempts, 625 ft-attempts, ratio: 2,47 |
Where's the metric for calls that should've been?
When debating how many calls Kobe doesn't get, it's a matter of: how many times is he fouled?--and how many times is it called? As often as Kobe gets to the stripe, he simply should be going there more if the game is called straight up.
Last night was a perfect example. Trey's assertion wasn't that Kobe should've arbitrarily gone to the line more, just because. I counted about 6 And1s that Kobe should've gotten last night, but didn't. |
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OdomX2
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Joined: 25 Nov 2004
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| Posted: Tue Mar 07, 2006 8:19 am Post subject: |
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| A team like the Lakers just can't win these kinds of games against the NBA's elite without a fair shake from the refs. It was obvious in the 3rd quarter that Kobe was not going to get a call, regardless of the transgression. It was also obvious at that point that the Lakers had no chance to win the game. Letting both teams play "straight up" is a huge advantage for the Spurs. Sadly the NBA and it's referees have their own interpretations of the rules and when to enforce them. |
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wolfpaclaker
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Posts: 58344
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| Posted: Tue Mar 07, 2006 8:21 am Post subject: |
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I rareky knock the refs but MY GOD. The Spurs have the refs in their pockets.
It's disgusting to watch how they get all the BOD calls.
Pathetic. |
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