LAKERS -at- PACERS - 2/2 - Thoughts and :-(( ratings

 
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DancingBarry
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PostPosted: Fri Feb 02, 2007 11:32 pm    Post subject: LAKERS -at- PACERS - 2/2 - Thoughts and :-(( ratings

UGLY Loss... The execution on this roadtrip has been brutal. Other than Kobe having a brilliant game in Boston, the rest of the team has played some horrid ball (even in Boston). Tonight, Kobe played a miserable game and the rest of the team stayed in its offensive funk, losing 95-84.

The Lakers had a 7-point lead going into the fourth quarter. It didn't come easy, but after scratching our way there we sat the guys who were getting it done to start the fourth quarter. There went momentum. After they returned four minutes later, the Pacers continued to steamroll them. Until just over a minute left in the fourth, the Lakers had only scored 6 points in the entire quarter.

Smush and Kobe had 11 steals between the two and that helped the Lakers get some easy points since their perimeter game had completely disappeared. We get a regular Kobe game and we take this one.

It couldn't be more obvious how badly we missed Luke's play making in the Tri and Kwame's strength at times. They have to pull it together or the roadtrip could go south real quick.

"They sucked. That's all I can say," Phil said. That about sums it up.


Kobe -- -- Kobe was completely off all night with his shot and even on some of his decision-making. He scored 22 points on a sad 7-25 shooting (2-8 from three). He had 5 boards, 4 assists with 4 turnovers and 5 steals. When he tried to get into a rhythm with his jumper, it just never came. The way the rest of the team is playing right now that is death for us until we get healthy. He attacked and hit Turiaf who drew FTs. He missed a three and a turnaround in the low post. He drew FTs and made both. He froze Granger with a hesitation move and scored a layup. He tried to thead the needle to Mo on the break and we turned it over. He hit Cook on the break for a short bank. He had O'Neal switch on him and instead of attacking, he bricked a 29-foot three (not smart). He traveled on the next play out on the break. He missed a baseline jumper. He missed a pull-up from the wing. He missed a baseline jumper over Granger. Next possession, he clanked another pull-up jumper. Crafty play with 2 seconds left in the half when the Pacers tried to give a foul, Kobe went up at the three line, tried to shoot as they grabbed him and he drew three FTs, he made all three. He had 7 points on 1-8 shooting and 3 assists in an awful first half of play. He swished a face-up jumper on his first touch. He missed a pull-up jumper from the same spot. After missing a couple of 15-footers, he scored a layup out in transition. He swiped the ball from Granger and it led to a breakaway dunk for Ronny. He attacked the lane, took contact with no call and scored a layup. He missed a pull-up from the wing in transition. Sweet pass around Foster who doubled him in the paint and it led to a Vlad dunk. He anticipated a pass, swiped it and ignited the break. He had a tech FT bounce around the rim before dropping (nothing coming easy). He hit a wing jumper off a kickout. He had another mismatch, this time against Foster and again settled for a three and missed. He missed a layup off an attack to his right. He missed a wing three. Trailing big late, he hit back-to-back 30-foot threes. He dribbled a ball off his foot out of bounds. He missed a couple more desperation threes. Poor game...got to have him on track for us to do anything right now.

Lamar -- -- He was fairly ineffective again offensively, but did a good job on the defensive glass. He scored 10 points on 4-10 shooting, pulled down 12 boards and had 3 assists with 6 turnovers. He did a slightly better job working himself into the post. Their little rub plays with him and Kobe were just awful tonight. The best way he got into the post was flashing from the strongside into the weakside low post as we then swung the ball over to him. We just needed more inside action from him than we got. He missed a pull-up jumper. He posted up out of a timeout and scored easily over his man. He was called for a clear-path foul and picked up a second foul backing Dunleavy down and had to sit. He faced up and swished a wing jumper. He hit Cook across court for a three. He finally started to look at posting up Dunleavy, he kicked out for a missed Vlad three on one, then hit a short jumphook on the his next post attempt. He finger rolled in a layup around Jermaine in transition. He missed a point-blank layup off a post up. He drew a phantom travel call on an attack. He drew FTs in the post and made both. He lost the handle on the ball against a double out of a timeout.

Bynum -- -- He struggled a little bit early on trying to figure out O'Neal, but then started to play him fairly well (O'Neal went 4-4 to start, then made just 3-17...one of those makes came late in the game over Cook). Bynum played only 22 minutes and scored 6 points on 3-8 shooting, grabbed 7 boards, blocked 2 shots and had 4 fouls. He suffered from a little foul trouble, picking up a couple trying to deny penetration and a couple on his man. He missed a point-blank layup that he should have dunked after he rocked Jermaine under the hoop with a post move, he then missed a putback (he had the bump down, but needed the dunk). Jermaine scored with the jumper and off the drive for a dunk and foul against Bynum and Phil quickly put Drew to the bench for Turiaf just two minutes into the game. Perhaps someone got into Bynum's head on the bench about how to defend Jermaine because he came back in much better. After Ronny drew a couple of fouls, Bynum returned shortly later. He posted up O'Neal, used his body well to get Jermaine backing up then hit a short jumphook. Two good defensive sequences where he moved his feet without using a handcheck to shut off Jermaine's drive (he did that twice, blocking the second one...he's done this more and more in the past few games). He swatted a shot in the lane to ignite a break. He overpowered Diogu with a dribble and a spin, finishing easily with his left. He took an offensive board and missed an easy shot with his left. He picked up his third foul with 15 seconds left in the half trying to contest dribble penetration. He missed a hook. He tipped in a Kobe miss from behind O'Neal. He picked up his fourth foul early in the third contesting penetration. Nothing else much to report for the rest of the game. Despite the loss, these games are valuable for him.

Smush -- -- Smush had a season-high 6 steals (his career high is 7) and scored 20 points on 8-15 shooting. His ability to get steals allowed us to get a few easy points in transition, which were much needed. He did give up some easy penetration at times, however, and that had him sitting early. He had a big, 9-point third quarter where we took the lead by 7 points before Smush sat to start the fourth and we lost that lead and momentum. Early on, he hit a wing jumper coming off a screen. He missed a bank when he got caught in the air. After giving up some easy penetration, he got benched midway through the first quarter for Farmar. Nice attack off the handoff, Smush sold out the body to take contact on Diogu under the hoop, got leveled but got up and made both FTs. Nice reach on a double to knock a ball loose and draw a foul. He charged not running the offense on a sequence in the first half. He swished a three after the Lakers worked the ball around. He hit an odd-looking turnaround over Jermaine from the baseline. He scored 9 points on 3-6 shooting and had 2 steals at the half. He reached while defending his man in the post and was forced to foul Tinsley to save a layup (not a time when you want to go for a steal). He got swatted trying to attack off the dribble. He missed a wide open three after taking all day to measure it. He drilled his next three on a quick catch and shoot. He missed a finger roll in the lane. Nice steal when Vlad came over to double and Smush took it the distance for a dunk. Strong cut off of Cook in the mid post, he took the return feed and scored a reverse. He swiped the ball from Armstrong and took it in for a reverse dunk. He gambled and lost on the next possession and it led to a layup. He had 9 points in the third and 18 points overall. After sitting for four minutes, he attacked to his right off a quick first step and finger rolled in a layup. He missed a corner three and charge trying to cut back to his right off the dribble.

Radmanovic -- -- Vlad scored 11 points on 4-8 shooting and pulled down 7 boards. He also managed 2 steals. It looked like they tried to feature him on a couple pre-arranged Tri sequences in the game. He has looked a little more comfortable out there the past few games (he's still prone to error, but his execution has improved). Defensively, he's still a bit soft, but the Lakers had him gambling quite at times off of his man to try to pressure the Pacers. We had mixed results with that. He swished an elbow jumper off the double screen. Nice strip on Jermaine under the hoop to save a basket. He telegraphed an entry pass, threw it late and it was picked off. He tried to push out the break instead of giving it to a guard next to him and he threw it away. He got swatted trying to finish off a curl. He gave up an offensive board and score to Foster. He hit a jumper right in Dunleavy's grill. He was fouled in transition and made one FT. He missed a three. He hit Turiaf with an extra pass for an uncontested dunk on the break. He missed a three from the wing. He dunked when Kobe drew the D in the paint and wrapped a pass around Vlad's man. He missed a wing three. He scored picking up a missed Kobe shot late in the game.

Turiaf -- -- Ronny had 4 fouls in just 8:37 of action. So, his impact was limited. He scored 6 points on 2-4 shooting and didn't pull down a board. He came in early for Bynum and he swished a baseline jumper on his first touch. He hit two FTs when Kobe set him up with a drive and dish. He was blocked at the rim on another attempt. Both he and Bynum had trouble with O'Neal early in the game.

Evans -- -- Evans was pretty much MIA in this one. He scored 2 points on 1-4 shooting in 22:32 of action. He missed a pull-up jumper. He cleaned up a Turiaf miss with a short putback jumper. He missed a corner three. Granger beat him off the dribble for an easy layup. We will need him to step up in the next game.

Farmar -- -- Ugly game from Farmar. He didn't score on 2 attempts in 13 minutes and had 3 turnovers without an assist. He came in midway through the first quarter for Smush. He telegraphed a pass for a turnover. He was called for a carry trying to get control of an outlet pass on the break. He missed an open three. He missed a pull-up jumper trying to beat the shotclock. He lost the handle attacking.

Cook -- -- Not too much to talk about in this one. Cook tied Kobe for the team lead with 4 assists to go along with his 5 points on 2-5 shooting in 21 minutes. He banked in a short jumper out on the break with Kobe. He swished a wing three on his next touch. He swatted Jermaine in the post but was called for the foul. He had to sit with three fouls in the first half. He hit Smush cutting off of him out of the Tri for a reverse layup. Jermaine scored easily over him late in the game.

Vujacic -- -- He was active, but ineffective. He stole the ball in the backcourt and scored a layup. He blew an easy layup attacking down the paint. In 8 minutes, he scored 2 points on 1-3 shooting.

Shammond -- -- He played 2 minutes as Phil was looking for some kind of spark. He didn't score. Foster pushed him in the backcourt for a foul. That's about it.

Phil -- -- The Lakers struggled badly with Jermaine to start the game. Not enough speed or strength it seemed and Phil didn't send the double. We started to gamble a little more, but our guys played him better. After O'Neal's initial flurry he ended up with 14 points on 4-12 shooting in the first half. He missed 11 straight after making his first 4... Both teams shot in the high 30's in the first half. The Pacers won the battle of the paint 26-12 (we chipped away a little at that and ended the game down 44-36 on scores in the paint). The Laker coaches told the team to "shoot better" at half time. The sage advice didn't have any impact as we ended up shooting 38 percent for the night... Late in the third, the Lakers started to get more aggressive with their D. A lot of traps, doubles, gambles and they had turned the game in their favor. With Kobe and Smush driving the Lakers to a 7-point third-quarter lead, Phil sat both to start the fourth. You just knew the Farmar, Sasha, Evans, Lamar, Cook lineup wasn't going to hold that lead. Total momentum kill. They went scoreless in 4-straight minutes before we called a timeout with the score tied. He then brought Kobe, Smush and Bynum back in. After trading a few hoops, the offense stalled again and the Pacers pulled away... The Lakers had an impressive 16 steals, but 84 points isn't going to beat anyone...
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dubaholic1
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PostPosted: Sat Feb 03, 2007 12:04 am    Post subject:

"You just knew the Farmar, Sasha, Evans, Lamar, Cook lineup wasn't going to hold that lead. Total momentum kill. "


Is it a normal substitution pattern to sit kobe and smush to start the 4th?

I dunno. But I caught the game at the start of the 4th and quickly shut it off after watching our boys literally deflate.

the lakers are their own worst enemy.
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DancingBarry
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PostPosted: Sat Feb 03, 2007 12:13 am    Post subject:

dubaholic1 - Phil sometimes toggles Kobe from sitting on the bench to going a minute or two, for the most part he rests him. He usually has Smush out at that point.

But the thing is that these were the guys who were the engine for the team. They were the clear driving force after we had been struggling all game long. That lineup that he brought in were a bunch of guys who have been passive and MIA all game. You could see it coming in this one. LO is the one who should have put the team on his shoulders at that point (he would have earlier in the season), but he seems like he is still trying to find his way again in the offense right now.
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ForTheWin
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PostPosted: Sat Feb 03, 2007 12:26 am    Post subject:

He's doing this cause his bench was doing it all at the begging of season. Now that line up will never work. He plays ours 2nd string players against starting material. Even thought we are kind of deep there still needs to be starters i nthe game which phil never does any more....
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PostPosted: Sat Feb 03, 2007 2:55 am    Post subject: Re: LAKERS -at- PACERS - 2/2 - Thoughts and :-(( ratings

DancingBarry wrote:
With Kobe and Smush driving the Lakers to a 7-point third-quarter lead, Phil sat both to start the fourth. You just knew the Farmar, Sasha, Evans, Lamar, Cook lineup wasn't going to hold that lead. Total momentum kill. They went scoreless in 4-straight minutes before we called a timeout with the score tied. He then brought Kobe, Smush and Bynum back in. After trading a few hoops, the offense stalled again and the Pacers pulled away... The Lakers had an impressive 16 steals, but 84 points isn't going to beat anyone...
One would think that it was more important to have either Kobe or LO on the court since lineup the start of the 4th quarater (except for Cook) play good defense while providing acceptable offense on most occasions. It is hard to find much blame on Phil's decisions since the team, as he stated - just "sucks"
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AllorNothing
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PostPosted: Sat Feb 03, 2007 3:55 am    Post subject:

What has happened to our offense? It seems kind of weird that our offense would stall and the defense picked up a little?
You would think Lamar would give us a more offensive punch.
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PostPosted: Sat Feb 03, 2007 4:24 am    Post subject:

thanks, DB...
in the last eight games we are 2-6, and we won only against warriors and celtics... maybe it's time to ask what is wrong with this team...
1- personally, i don't want to tell again and again that most of these players are soft... but that's a soft team...
2- motivations... it's not only about losing against bad teams... the body language of these players is too often horrible... they don't react, don't have any fire... we have on the bench the greatest motivational coach ever... or maybe we have on the bench the ex greatest motivational coach?...
3- we are demanding too much from bynum... too many times we give him the ball... too many times we let him one on one defensively... he will become a great player, maybe a dominant player... but now he's not ready for such important role...
4- after a season and half we can't defend the p&r, don't have decent defensive rotations, don't play constant d... do these players -most of them- lack defensive skills, or our coach is not able to teach defensive fundamentals and attitude?...
5- we finally play like a team... that's good... it's a pity that now we play like a bad team... it's wonderful that kobe is the great facilitator.... but now kobe plays even too much into the team concept... every system is really good only when promotes his own exceptions... is really a good thing that kobe is becoming so philjacksonian, or maybe their discrepancies are a source of energy?...
6- how far "let the players learn from their mistakes" is a wonderful concept and where it only reflects a slow and lazy attitude of our coach?... it seems to me that too often we lose momentum and call a time-out only when it's too late...
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AllorNothing
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PostPosted: Sat Feb 03, 2007 4:36 am    Post subject:

Maybe Bynum getting touches is because that Phil knows that we can't get far into the playoffs without an inkling of a low post game.
If we are to meet some of the playoff contenders this year, they have better perimeter players overall than us. THis includes Dallas, Phoenix, and SA. We need Bynum to at least open up the offense giving Kobe more leeway to attack in the playoffs.
Like last year, we counted on Kwame and Lamar to expose Phoenix's frontline and they just couldn't get it done. With the addition of Amare, that would be next to impossible to see Kwame post up Amare. However, Bynum does have height on Amare and can give him some foul troubles.
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ElginBaylor
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PostPosted: Sat Feb 03, 2007 5:36 am    Post subject:

Really depressing. This game literally gave me nightmares. Living in Indiana, I get one chance a year to watch these guys and for some reason they always play like crap at Canseco in spite of the fact that there's a surprising number of Laker faithful in attendance. Where we were sitting it seemed like everyone around us had Laker garb on. But aside from that, Kobe's game was just not on at all. It honestly had nothing to do with how well Granger was playing him, he was getting his looks and just not hitting and your analysis about the rest of the team just playing flat hits the nail on the head. I don't know what the solution for this is other than maybe looking for another player that would put some fire in the belly of this team, which, for those who know my philosophy, isn't something I've really advocated. I've always thought team chemistry was more important and yes, this team has it, but does it have enough talent as well to put us over the top?
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PostPosted: Sat Feb 03, 2007 7:38 am    Post subject:

The last 12 games coincided with Luke's game collapsing. Then when Lamar returned, Odom is still out of sync and playing like a triangle novice. Cook has been completely ineffective (although during Lamar's absence every third game he would light it up). AND you have now Evans and Farmar (by the way who kidnapped the Farmar we saw at the beginning of the year and replaced him with Tierre Brown?) going through a horrible stretch. Farmar is finally playing like a wide-eyed rookie and Sasha is playing worse. This current team will only win if Kobe is smoking and he was plainly horrible last night.
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wolfpaclaker
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PostPosted: Sat Feb 03, 2007 8:22 am    Post subject:

Once LO gets back to being LO .. things will be fine. This team is average at best on the road anyway. The two losses they had going into the road trip were OT losses.

They are in a slump obviously but if they can get some wins against good teams like Washington and Detroit it will re-boost their confidence.

Offensively Odom has hurt this team because they had figured out how to play without him. Now it's up to this team to figure out how to play with him again. Phil's a great coach and should put it back together again.

Liked that Drew is getting more oppurtunities. As always, he needs to go up stronger and stay out of FT. Those 2 are his glaring weaknesses right now but considering his age+experience it is amazing at what he's able to carry the C position for over a month now.
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Klone_dd
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PostPosted: Sat Feb 03, 2007 10:17 am    Post subject:

I agree that lately the execution has been horrible. A lot of that is due to the absence of Luke as well as the rustiness of LO.

So the rollercoaster continues. It seems like the guys are gasping just to get to the all-star break. Listness, sloppy play and poor decision making. Kobe can carry them thru this by his lonesome, but when he's off, it gets pretty ugly.
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PostPosted: Sat Feb 03, 2007 10:40 am    Post subject: Re: LAKERS -at- PACERS - 2/2 - Thoughts and :-(( ratings

DancingBarry wrote:


<snipped>

Lamar -- -- He was fairly ineffective again offensively, but did a good job on the defensive glass. He scored 10 points on 4-10 shooting, pulled down 12 boards and had 3 assists with 6 turnovers. He did a slightly better job working himself into the post. Their little rub plays with him and Kobe were just awful tonight. The best way he got into the post was flashing from the strongside into the weakside low post as we then swung the ball over to him. We just needed more inside action from him than we got. He missed a pull-up jumper. He posted up out of a timeout and scored easily over his man. He was called for a clear-path foul and picked up a second foul backing Dunleavy down and had to sit. He faced up and swished a wing jumper. He hit Cook across court for a three. He finally started to look at posting up Dunleavy, he kicked out for a missed Vlad three on one, then hit a short jumphook on the his next post attempt. He finger rolled in a layup around Jermaine in transition. He missed a point-blank layup off a post up. He drew a phantom travel call on an attack. He drew FTs in the post and made both. He lost the handle on the ball against a double out of a timeout.


Welcome back, Lamar.

It's been awhile...
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PostPosted: Sat Feb 03, 2007 10:42 am    Post subject:

Vlad has no bball IQ it seems. Over the past several games, at critical points, he has doubled at the wrong times, and it has cost us. For example, in the game against the Knicks, it was clear that when Curry picked up his dribble, he was going to have to take a tough shot, instead Vlad fouled him(when we were down by 2 with about 40 sec left.)

Yesterday, when JO passed the ball out to Darrell Armstrong(who made the three), without even attempting to make a move, I thought, okay guys, they're catching on, they're expecting the doubles now, mix it up a bit. Sure enough, after the timeout, Foster cut to the hoop, almost before Vlad mindlessly went to double(as in, he knew exactly that we were going to double), and got a layup.

Now I wouldn't say that Bynum didn't need double help yesterday. However, there are three different type of mismatches, the first is the Shaq-like mismatch, where the offensive player and his teammates know that you absolutely have no choice but to double. The second is the Duncan-like mismatch, where the advantage is not great enough that you can mix up the doubles. The third is the Kwame-like mismatch, this is where you know you don't have to give any doubles help whatsoever(the term mismatch here applies to the other end, but it could also be applied to Kwame offensively).

Watching yesterday's game, it was clear that the Bynum and O'Neal matchup belonged to the 2nd category. This means that we could have waited till O'Neal made his move, or at least put his head down for the drive(so that he can't just survey the floor), before doubling. Instead, O'Neal didn't even have to do anything but pass, because Vlad treated him like Shaq.

These are the types of details that this team has to iron out, if they're going to go anywhere in the playoffs.
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PostPosted: Sat Feb 03, 2007 10:58 am    Post subject:

wolfpaclaker wrote:
Once LO gets back to being LO .. things will be fine. This team is average at best on the road anyway. The two losses they had going into the road trip were OT losses.

They are in a slump obviously but if they can get some wins against good teams like Washington and Detroit it will re-boost their confidence.

Offensively Odom has hurt this team because they had figured out how to play without him. Now it's up to this team to figure out how to play with him again. Phil's a great coach and should put it back together again.

Liked that Drew is getting more oppurtunities. As always, he needs to go up stronger and stay out of FT. Those 2 are his glaring weaknesses right now but considering his age+experience it is amazing at what he's able to carry the C position for over a month now.


That's what bothers me about Bynum. I know he was going against a pretty good shotblocker, yet when you're going against a shotblocker like Jermaine, you can catch him off guard by going straight up right at him, because you're finishing at an angle that he doesn't expect.

When a guy expects you to kiss it off the glass, you don't try to be even more cute by shooting a 5-foot left-handed hook shot, because even though it put you out of the shotblocker's reach, it's also more difficult. In that event, it's better to just go straight up.
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PostPosted: Sat Feb 03, 2007 11:04 am    Post subject:

ProjectAB wrote:
Vlad has no bball IQ it seems. Over the past several games, at critical points, he has doubled at the wrong times, and it has cost us. For example, in the game against the Knicks, it was clear that when Curry picked up his dribble, he was going to have to take a tough shot, instead Vlad fouled him(when we were down by 2 with about 40 sec left.)

Yesterday, when JO passed the ball out to Darrell Armstrong(who made the three), without even attempting to make a move, I thought, okay guys, they're catching on, they're expecting the doubles now, mix it up a bit. Sure enough, after the timeout, Foster cut to the hoop, almost before Vlad mindlessly went to double(as in, he knew exactly that we were going to double), and got a layup.

Now I wouldn't say that Bynum didn't need double help yesterday. However, there are three different type of mismatches, the first is the Shaq-like mismatch, where the offensive player and his teammates know that you absolutely have no choice but to double. The second is the Duncan-like mismatch, where the advantage is not great enough that you can mix up the doubles. The third is the Kwame-like mismatch, this is where you know you don't have to give any doubles help whatsoever(the term mismatch here applies to the other end, but it could also be applied to Kwame offensively).

Watching yesterday's game, it was clear that the Bynum and O'Neal matchup belonged to the 2nd category. This means that we could have waited till O'Neal made his move, or at least put his head down for the drive(so that he can't just survey the floor), before doubling. Instead, O'Neal didn't even have to do anything but pass, because Vlad treated him like Shaq.

These are the types of details that this team has to iron out, if they're going to go anywhere in the playoffs.


I very much agree with your points, good analysis. I would like to chalk this slump up to just that, a mid season slump. We all know these guys have the fire inside. Look at that game against Denver. It was beautiful to watch. Even the first 4 games of the season were pretty.

Keep the faith, people!
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PostPosted: Sat Feb 03, 2007 12:56 pm    Post subject:

Thanks DB!

It was a missed opportunity and a disappointment.
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PostPosted: Sat Feb 03, 2007 12:59 pm    Post subject:

I continue to grieve, because of the poor play of Farmar... I, especially grieve, because I can see that we really need an "on-court floor general", that is an expert at ballhandling, setting the team's rhythm, and keeping the team together... At the beginning of the season, Farmar looked like a lock, to fill all our needs, in those areas mentioned.

I just don't know what could be going on... Is Jordan being asked to play a completely different style??... Is Jordan not fitting into the triangle? It seems like Jordan's game just went downhill, within the last month, or so... How can someone's game go bad, so fast?

It looked like too many people were trying to instigate the offense, at the same time, like a multi-headed dragon, with each head going in a different direction. :roll:
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angel
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PostPosted: Sat Feb 03, 2007 1:50 pm    Post subject:

Life is over at 20? I don't think so! Jordan Farmar hasn't even been all the way around the league yet. He's still a rookie, so he won't get any breaks. We should start seeing the payoff next season.
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Mr. EiGhTy-OnE
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PostPosted: Sat Feb 03, 2007 1:54 pm    Post subject: Re: LAKERS -at- PACERS - 2/2 - Thoughts and :-(( ratings

DancingBarry wrote:


Phil -- --

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