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PostPosted: Mon Oct 29, 2007 11:59 am    Post subject:

pjiddy wrote:
Gawd I hope this deal happens. ARENAS!!!



can someone please explain to me how a guy that takes thirty foot jump shots and plays zero defense is supposed to fill KB' shoes?

Maybe I am missing something here but I cant see people paying staples center prices to see the likes of Gilbert Arenas.
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PostPosted: Mon Oct 29, 2007 12:17 pm    Post subject:

Kobe>T-mac wrote:
pjiddy wrote:
Gawd I hope this deal happens. ARENAS!!!



can someone please explain to me how a guy that takes thirty foot jump shots and plays zero defense is supposed to fill KB' shoes?

Maybe I am missing something here but I cant see people paying staples center prices to see the likes of Gilbert Arenas.
There's nobody in the L that can fill KB's shoes.... so if you are waiting for that trade, it's going to be a while...

Last edited by TACH on Mon Oct 29, 2007 12:40 pm; edited 2 times in total
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PostPosted: Mon Oct 29, 2007 12:18 pm    Post subject:

Kobe>T-mac wrote:
pjiddy wrote:
Gawd I hope this deal happens. ARENAS!!!



can someone please explain to me how a guy that takes thirty foot jump shots and plays zero defense is supposed to fill KB' shoes?

Maybe I am missing something here but I cant see people paying staples center prices to see the likes of Gilbert Arenas.


It is because of his blog
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PostPosted: Mon Oct 29, 2007 12:39 pm    Post subject:

Maybe the deal Kobe for Arenas and Blatche is already in place.

Remember this article from a while back from OCRegister: OCRegister

In it there is a quote:
Quote:

Perhaps, but it's more likely Bryant will be playing for the Lakers until at least mid-December, one team insider said Tuesday, because of the contract status of one player the Lakers are interested in acquiring.


Now that one player would be Aundray Blatche, he was a FA this past summer and just signed and is available for trade by December.

Just my theory. I think this is a win-win situation for both teams under the condition that the Lakers are resigned to let Kobe go (because keeping Kobe is obviously the best route). Lakers get a star in return, Kobe goes to the east and teams up again with his buddy Caron.
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PostPosted: Mon Oct 29, 2007 12:42 pm    Post subject:

Laker7 wrote:
davidse wrote:
ok - a more balanced deal:


kobe, odom, farmar, mihm, mo, 2nd
for
arenas, jamison, blatche, young, mason(filler), 1st


Mihm cannot be traded. Signed a one year deal. Under CBA, cannot sign for one year then be traded.

Blatche (whom I absolutley would love to have on the team) is BYC. Will be difficult to work that one.



mihm signed a 2 year deal and can be traded dec. 15.
month and a half from now.
won't be a problem.

neither will blatche's byc. too much salary involved. his 3 million or so - byc - will be almost a none issue for a 40 mil $ deal.
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PostPosted: Mon Oct 29, 2007 12:46 pm    Post subject:

Laker7 wrote:
IMO this Wiz/Gil talk is a smoke screen to get Pax to add Deng to the deal. Someone in the FO is trying to apply pressure to the Bulls to ante up.



there is no "adding" deng.

any bulls deal starts with deng, or the lakers take their chances that a better deal comes along in the next 2 years - and it will.
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PostPosted: Mon Oct 29, 2007 12:46 pm    Post subject:

Kobe>T-mac wrote:
pjiddy wrote:
Gawd I hope this deal happens. ARENAS!!!



can someone please explain to me how a guy that takes thirty foot jump shots and plays zero defense is supposed to fill KB' shoes?

Maybe I am missing something here but I cant see people paying staples center prices to see the likes of Gilbert Arenas.


No one can fill Kobe's shoes, so if you're hoping for that, get over it.

Arenas is a legit superstar with the talents to become a very good defender. He can also take over games, which will be crucial as our young core develops and needs that from time to time. If you can acquire a superstar, you have to do it even if it isn't the one we regrettably lose in Kobe. Superstars have other levels they can reach that regular players, including all-stars, cannot achieve.

Arenas + Blatch for Kobe is never going to be good enough, but that's never been a possibility in any trade regardless, so it's the best one out there.
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PostPosted: Mon Oct 29, 2007 12:51 pm    Post subject:

ElginBaylor wrote:
Laker7 wrote:
davidse wrote:
ok - a more balanced deal:


kobe, odom, farmar, mihm, mo, 2nd
for
arenas, jamison, blatche, young, mason(filler), 1st


Mihm cannot be traded. Signed a one year deal. Under CBA, cannot sign for one year then be traded.

Blatche (whom I absolutley would love to have on the team) is BYC. Will be difficult to work that one.


Aside from the fact that Mihm cannot be traded, why would Kobe go to the Wiz to play with a bunch of the same guys he's playing with here in L.A.? Just to get away from Laker Mgmt.? I don't think so, and the Wiz without Arenas, Jamison, and Baltche even if they did have Kobe wouldn't do any better than the Lakers. If Kobe won't go to Chicago w/o Deng, he won't got the Wiz, period.



yes they would.
odom is better than jamison - defenetly at pf
in case you haven't noticed - the wizards have an allstar and a very good friend of kobe's waiting for those two
AND they play in the east.

and again - in 90 days mihm can be traded. not a problem.
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PostPosted: Mon Oct 29, 2007 12:53 pm    Post subject:

wolfpaclaker wrote:
Yeah I agree with Sky + davidse. If the Lakers were offered Arenas, and Kobe was willing to be a Wizard - he'd be one already.

The thing stopping this would be Kobe.

No suprise. Kobe is a Laker for a reason. He has been trying to screw Lakers out of the best possible deal through dictating where he goes and on what terms. That is his right and he has that power in his contract with the no trade clause. Unlike with Shaq, the Lakers are actually willing to wait and go into the season with him like that. This is why I'm saying the game being played right now is between Kobe + LA. Not LA + other franchises.

I am actually now thinking to get Kobe to actually back his statement of willing to play on Pluto, how about actually playing him 25 mpg. Screw with his legacy and stats. He wants to screw with trades - not letting the Bulls offer Deng, not going to Washington - lets screw with his stats. That would be a great way to encourage him to take a deal wherever the Lakers want.
Wow. Could ya'll possibly be any more immature or irrational?

Yeah "screw with his stats" and "screw with our winning %." Sure, play him 25mpg, keep him as fresh as possible, and motivate him even MORE. Seriously, not only does it do us bad and the team that acquires him good, but Kobe has got so much of our dirty laundry at his finger tips ALREADY doing that would be tantamount to media suicide.

God, some of you need to read Kobe's interview with Jim Gray. This is not the same scenario as Shaq, not even close. I wonder if you wanted to "screw with Magic's legacy" when he asked out. Wow.

As for Arenas and Blatche, I don't like Arenas's game, but it's a good enough deal. Blatch has stud qualities, and I wanted him at 37 in the 05 draft. Arenas, while he has an Iverson-esque shot selection, and plays little defense, does have potential. If he can be motivated to defend and corralled into a more system-centric offensive player, this is the best we can get.

If we proceed to trade Odom for Marion, we've got a nice little future core of...

Arenas/Farmar
Javaris
Marion
Blatch/Turiaf
Bynum
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PostPosted: Mon Oct 29, 2007 1:00 pm    Post subject:

D Nice wrote:
wolfpaclaker wrote:
Yeah I agree with Sky + davidse. If the Lakers were offered Arenas, and Kobe was willing to be a Wizard - he'd be one already.

The thing stopping this would be Kobe.

No suprise. Kobe is a Laker for a reason. He has been trying to screw Lakers out of the best possible deal through dictating where he goes and on what terms. That is his right and he has that power in his contract with the no trade clause. Unlike with Shaq, the Lakers are actually willing to wait and go into the season with him like that. This is why I'm saying the game being played right now is between Kobe + LA. Not LA + other franchises.

I am actually now thinking to get Kobe to actually back his statement of willing to play on Pluto, how about actually playing him 25 mpg. Screw with his legacy and stats. He wants to screw with trades - not letting the Bulls offer Deng, not going to Washington - lets screw with his stats. That would be a great way to encourage him to take a deal wherever the Lakers want.
Wow. Could ya'll possibly be any more immature or irrational?

Yeah "screw with his stats" and "screw with our winning %." Sure, play him 25mpg, keep him as fresh as possible, and motivate him even MORE. Seriously, not only does it do us bad and the team that acquires him good, but Kobe has got so much of our dirty laundry at his finger tips ALREADY doing that would be tantamount to media suicide.

God, some of you need to read Kobe's interview with Jim Gray. This is not the same scenario as Shaq, not even close. I wonder if you wanted to "screw with Magic's legacy" when he asked out. Wow.

As for Arenas and Blatche, I don't like Arenas's game, but it's a good enough deal. Blatch has stud qualities, and I wanted him at 37 in the 05 draft. Arenas, while he has an Iverson-esque shot selection, and plays little defense, does have potential. If he can be motivated to defend and corralled into a more system-centric offensive player, this is the best we can get.

If we proceed to trade Odom for Marion, we've got a nice little future core of...

Arenas/Farmar
Javaris
Marion
Blatch/Turiaf
Bynum


The only way the Suns give up Marion for Odom is if the "Incompetence air" that our F.O. has been breathing somehow invades the Suns F.O.
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PostPosted: Mon Oct 29, 2007 1:05 pm    Post subject:

Don't like Arenas. He is kobe lite and makes worse decisions than kobe. I mean, he goes out of his way to predict his scoring.
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PostPosted: Mon Oct 29, 2007 1:07 pm    Post subject:

Kobe>T-mac wrote:
pjiddy wrote:
Gawd I hope this deal happens. ARENAS!!!



can someone please explain to me how a guy that takes thirty foot jump shots and plays zero defense is supposed to fill KB' shoes?

Maybe I am missing something here but I cant see people paying staples center prices to see the likes of Gilbert Arenas.


Because gilbert arenas, unlike kobe, wants to play in LA. simple.

Kobe's still the best player in the league, but half assing it he's nowhere near there.
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PostPosted: Mon Oct 29, 2007 1:09 pm    Post subject:

LakerJam wrote:
Kobe>T-mac wrote:
pjiddy wrote:
Gawd I hope this deal happens. ARENAS!!!



can someone please explain to me how a guy that takes thirty foot jump shots and plays zero defense is supposed to fill KB' shoes?

Maybe I am missing something here but I cant see people paying staples center prices to see the likes of Gilbert Arenas.


No one can fill Kobe's shoes, so if you're hoping for that, get over it.

Arenas is a legit superstar with the talents to become a very good defender. He can also take over games, which will be crucial as our young core develops and needs that from time to time. If you can acquire a superstar, you have to do it even if it isn't the one we regrettably lose in Kobe. Superstars have other levels they can reach that regular players, including all-stars, cannot achieve.

Arenas + Blatch for Kobe is never going to be good enough, but that's never been a possibility in any trade regardless, so it's the best one out there.


It's not the 'best one out there', because it's not 'out there'.

Even if it is 'out there' it's not happening. Kobe says no. Trade go bye bye and in this case, I would thank him kindly for that.

Arenas fills seats and nothing else. Whether or not he has the potential to be a good defender or not is irrelevant. He's going into his 7th season. He is what he is.
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PostPosted: Mon Oct 29, 2007 1:20 pm    Post subject:

No. 1: No trade clause!
No. 2: Needs 3 team trade, ie. Chicago, New York, Pheonix and Dallas
No. 3: Washington trades Arenas for talent volume instead of Bryant?
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PostPosted: Mon Oct 29, 2007 1:33 pm    Post subject:

LakerJam wrote:
Kobe>T-mac wrote:
pjiddy wrote:
Gawd I hope this deal happens. ARENAS!!!



can someone please explain to me how a guy that takes thirty foot jump shots and plays zero defense is supposed to fill KB' shoes?

Maybe I am missing something here but I cant see people paying staples center prices to see the likes of Gilbert Arenas.


No one can fill Kobe's shoes, so if you're hoping for that, get over it.

Arenas is a legit superstar with the talents to become a very good defender. He can also take over games, which will be crucial as our young core develops and needs that from time to time. If you can acquire a superstar, you have to do it even if it isn't the one we regrettably lose in Kobe. Superstars have other levels they can reach that regular players, including all-stars, cannot achieve.

Arenas + Blatch for Kobe is never going to be good enough, but that's never been a possibility in any trade regardless, so it's the best one out there.



Will someone tell Jim Buss to make this trade happen. MJ played for WAS. Kobe would welcome this trade. Jameson and Butler looks nicer then Odom and Bynum right now. Kobe's in the East avg 35pt a game, lovin' life.

LA and Arenas is a match made in heaven. Imagine 60 pt games with Arenas bowing out at the end of LA WINS.
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PostPosted: Mon Oct 29, 2007 1:34 pm    Post subject:

So far, Agent 0 is the only all-star name that has been mentioned in a Kobe trade.
(I know J5 was an all-star last year, but Gil is a perennial all-star.)

And he just so happens to play the same position that our out-going player plays.

We lose an all-star/all-nba 1st scoring option 2G,
we gain an all-star/all-nba 1st scoring option 2G.

That's the best trade idea I've heard yet.
Plus, if we can get another young, stud potential big-man out of the deal (Andray), even better.


At this point, I look at this trade idea as "addition by subtraction."
Sure, we lose Kobe's "other-worldlyness moments," but we could be gaining better chemistry - if Gil is down with the FO's plan of developing Drew as a centerpiece.

And... maybe Gil would just fit better.
Who knows??

If Gil can play more effectively with our youth than Kobe has been able to (and if better chemsitry = raising their level of play), then we could actually win more games this year and develop our young talent at the same time.

Most likely we'd be right where we are right now - a borderline playoff team... but we'd have a brighter future.


Drew/Ronny/Blatche could be AWESOME.
With Arenas, JC and Farmar in the backcourt.
Could be fun.
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PostPosted: Mon Oct 29, 2007 2:03 pm    Post subject:

Hector the Pup wrote:
wolfpaclaker wrote:
Yeah I agree with Sky + davidse. If the Lakers were offered Arenas, and Kobe was willing to be a Wizard - he'd be one already.

The thing stopping this would be Kobe.

No suprise. Kobe is a Laker for a reason. He has been trying to screw Lakers out of the best possible deal through dictating where he goes and on what terms. That is his right and he has that power in his contract with the no trade clause. Unlike with Shaq, the Lakers are actually willing to wait and go into the season with him like that. This is why I'm saying the game being played right now is between Kobe + LA. Not LA + other franchises.

I am actually now thinking to get Kobe to actually back his statement of willing to play on Pluto, how about actually playing him 25 mpg. Screw with his legacy and stats. He wants to screw with trades - not letting the Bulls offer Deng, not going to Washington - lets screw with his stats. That would be a great way to encourage him to take a deal wherever the Lakers want.


And that would be a great way of completely destroying the chances of the Lakers signing any respectable FA for a very very very long time. Take a look at every player associated with Team USA and immediately cross them off any wish list you might have, then look at those guys' friends in the league and cross them off the list too.

Wow, wolf, I would have never pegged you for the vindictive scorned ex type.


Agreed. This is a classic example of letting one's personal bias distort the "bigger picture".
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PostPosted: Mon Oct 29, 2007 2:04 pm    Post subject:

wolfpaclaker wrote:
Quote:
Wow, wolf, I would have never pegged you for the vindictive scorned ex type

Don't go SGH on me Hector, it isn't about being vindictive .. it's about gaining the chances of making a better trade.

You start labelling me, well I have one for you.

Kobe comes first, Kobe only sort of thinking.

Teams have suspended players and still not had trouble signing FA's. There isn't an issue with FA's .. most of them are smart enough to realize that when you sign a contract it's all about money + best oppurtunity. Not about what they did to Kobe. Who cares what the Lakers did with Kobe? This isn't a brotherhood.


Said Jerry Krause.
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PostPosted: Mon Oct 29, 2007 2:11 pm    Post subject:

venturalakersfan wrote:
The Lakers have little to gain by trading Kobe, and lots to lose by doing so. Their best bet is to develop the young players and for them to show that they can be a good team in the future.


In a perfect world we let this happen, but a franchise dealing with turmoil among its star, coach, and management is not the best environment to develop young players especially when the most important thing for them at this point is in-game experience. It was enough to frustrate grizzled veterans like Horace and Malone.

My preference is to keep Kobe and hope for the best as well, but there are ramifications that may be less obvious.
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PostPosted: Mon Oct 29, 2007 2:14 pm    Post subject:

Does anyone think that we can pry away JO with Odom and Blatche?

Bynum
JO
Luke/Vlad
Crit
Zero

could be a formidable in a couple of years.
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PostPosted: Mon Oct 29, 2007 2:15 pm    Post subject:

Just a crazy thought..

Deng to Washington
Kobe to Chicago
Arenas to L.A.

Of course, there would be surrounding pieces involved.. but I have a feeling Washington is more involved in making sure they get something for Arenas who is 50/50 to walk as a free agent after the season.
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PostPosted: Mon Oct 29, 2007 2:16 pm    Post subject:

Bleh, Gilbert.

Just. Say. No.

Hang up the phone Dr. Buss, Jim, whoever. Please.
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PostPosted: Mon Oct 29, 2007 2:16 pm    Post subject:

LakerFan4L wrote:
Just a crazy thought..

Deng to Washington
Kobe to Chicago
Arenas to L.A.

Of course, there would be surrounding pieces involved.. but I have a feeling Washington is more involved in making sure they get something for Arenas who is 50/50 to walk as a free agent after the season.
Walk to whom? He said it was strictly business, about getting max money. Who is going to be able to pay him the max?
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PostPosted: Mon Oct 29, 2007 2:17 pm    Post subject:

LakerFan4L wrote:
Just a crazy thought..

Deng to Washington
Kobe to Chicago
Arenas to L.A.

Of course, there would be surrounding pieces involved.. but I have a feeling Washington is more involved in making sure they get something for Arenas who is 50/50 to walk as a free agent after the season.


Chicago will be at square one where it doesn't want to trade Deng.
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PostPosted: Mon Oct 29, 2007 2:21 pm    Post subject:

Tony Almeida wrote:
Bleh, Gilbert.

Just. Say. No.

Hang up the phone Dr. Buss, Jim, whoever. Please.


Do you really think that Dr. Buss and Jim will listen to us.
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