Posted: Fri Dec 21, 2007 9:48 am Post subject: Clevland Loss might be Good!
We have a young team, and i think that this team gets carried away like we do with our success. It's good for them once in a while to lose a game because now the coaching staff will have the players attention. We lost the game yesterday mainly because:
- bench got 3 point happy
- defensive rebounding
The bench lost our lead in the 4th because they mainly settled for long jumpers (Sasha was still on a heat check from the Chicago game). the reason why the bench has been so good is because they passed the ball, got inside layups, then stretched the D from long range. They can't just come in and hoist jumpers. They need to go back to what got them here.
Also, starters didn't hustle down the strech until the last 1 min mark. Varejao and co got way too many second opps for cleveland.
Yesterday, we showed that we are clearly a better team than Clevland, but lost because we made some mistakes down the stretch. It was by no means a demoralizing loss, but it definetly was a cautionary loss. the message was: Don't get too high on the success and focus on what got you there.
Joined: 12 Feb 2002 Posts: 3829 Location: South Orange County
Posted: Fri Dec 21, 2007 10:23 am Post subject:
I'm glad you started this thread. I was going to start one titled, "This was a good loss."
Clearly, every loss is a bad one, but if you have to lose, at least let there be valuable things which can be learned from the loss. The second unit has to have learned from that experience. Hoisting three after three will not get it done on most nights.
They also learned that Phil is not going to bail them out, something that helps to build teams that can handle the pressure of the playoffs. And something which drives those fans who can't understand this philosophy nuts.
I think Phil learned something about how many minutes he can effectively play Bynum. And Bynum learned what it means to be on the line in a hostile environment with the game on the line. He choked badly, but that is to be expected until he is put in that situation enough times to no longer get rattled.
This Laker team had control of the ball game for almost the entire game. The system works, the team was able to compete, and they made some mistakes which are easily correctable. As far as losses go...this was a good one.
I couldn't agree more guys. We have shown the ability to control ball games for almost the full 48 minutes. We need to work on closing out quarters and finishing games. We've lost some key games in the 4th recently because Kobe has been injured, but other players need to learn how to step up when Kobe cannot close.
I would like to see us finish off this road trip at 17-10. I will be pleased with that as I expected at least one loss to either the Cavs or the Bulls.
Joined: 14 Apr 2001 Posts: 144461 Location: The Gold Coast
Posted: Fri Dec 21, 2007 11:11 am Post subject:
When handicapping this road trip I figured this to be a loss, so it was no surprise. Just as long as they win the next two on the road, I will be happy with 3-1. _________________ RIP mom. 11-21-1933 to 6-14-2023.
hmm, obviously the team didn't learn anything from prior losses (gsw, mil etc.), so why do you think they will do it this time?
i am sure, (unforutnately) this wasn't the last time we lose a game this way
They won't. The lessons Phil is teaching them takes players YEARS to understand. This team is being built into a contender years down the road.
Did you honestly expect this team to be able to contend this year? If you did you are foolish and only have yourself to blame for your anger at this team's performance.
We're a 4th-5th seed in the WC if we play the way we are right now.
Joined: 13 Jan 2006 Posts: 2197 Location: Temecula border of San Diego
Posted: Fri Dec 21, 2007 11:12 am Post subject:
Cardom wrote:
lakerboy wrote:
hmm, obviously the team didn't learn anything from prior losses (gsw, mil etc.), so why do you think they will do it this time?
i am sure, (unforutnately) this wasn't the last time we lose a game this way
They won't. The lessons Phil is teaching them takes players YEARS to understand. This team is being built into a contender years down the road.
Exactly, it took three years for the Jordan Bull to win their first championship then the dynasty. Our three-peat, well, the guys are ready but they just needed a good coaching. _________________ "Now it came to me, let the Mamba loose" - KB24 after the game winner Olympic gold interview.
"If you are a LAKER FAN, you are LAKERS FOR LIFE" - Doc Buss
Nope. W's>>>>>>>>>>>L's. We have gotten jobbed the last few years it seems by being a few games out of a better position in the playoffs.
L's suck and they arent good for teams claiming to want to be a contender
i just want to say ' no disrespect" but your wrong!! _________________ "Never try to teach a pig to sing,
it makes one look stupid
and it irritates the pig."
Maybe it'll remind these guys that they are primarily shooters and Kobe needs to at least touch the ball late in games so he draws the defense.
I just shook my head when Fish came down the floor about 3 times in the 4th and pulled up for a jumper (to his credit, he made one). I won't even comment on Luke's last shot lol _________________ "My thirst for domination is fed only by the game. I refuse to get distracted by outside forces." - Kobe Bryant
Maybe it'll remind these guys that they are primarily shooters and Kobe needs to at least touch the ball late in games so he draws the defense.
I just shook my head when Fish came down the floor about 3 times in the 4th and pulled up for a jumper (to his credit, he made one). I won't even comment on Luke's last shot lol
I know a lot of ppl knock on Fish for driving to the hoop instead of passing to Kobe, but you have to give the defense different looks. You can't keep running the same plays or else it becomes Kobe vs the other team. We all know how that situation ends up turning out.
hmm, obviously the team didn't learn anything from prior losses (gsw, mil etc.), so why do you think they will do it this time?
i am sure, (unforutnately) this wasn't the last time we lose a game this way
They won't. The lessons Phil is teaching them takes players YEARS to understand. This team is being built into a contender years down the road.
Did you honestly expect this team to be able to contend this year? If you did you are foolish and only have yourself to blame for your anger at this team's performance.
We're a 4th-5th seed in the WC if we play the way we are right now.
I expect them to play hard. They didn't yesterday.
I know a lot of ppl knock on Fish for driving to the hoop instead of passing to Kobe, but you have to give the defense different looks. You can't keep running the same plays or else it becomes Kobe vs the other team. We all know how that situation ends up turning out.
I wouldn't complain if that was one of his strengths but it's not... _________________ "My thirst for domination is fed only by the game. I refuse to get distracted by outside forces." - Kobe Bryant
Joined: 28 Nov 2007 Posts: 11277 Location: Bay Area
Posted: Fri Dec 21, 2007 12:18 pm Post subject:
What about the "no calls" once again. Lakers could have won this, should have won this......it does seem that with every step this team takes backward, it takes 2 more forward. In that respect yes, it was a good loss but still a loss none the less
There are "levels of losing" (Sporst guy credit). Some losses are worse than others.
1) There are those how the F did we lose this game: like GSW, NJ -bad losses, heartbreakers
2) There are losses to clearly better teams: Boston, San Antonio losses
3) There are "we didn't show up losses" : at Utah
4) then there are 'cautionary" or 'blessing in disguise " losses where we learn a great deal about what we need to improve on : MIL, ORL, CLE, NO, HOU
What we learned from those losses:
1) HOU: we can't have a one man show team (which we've fixed for the most part)
2) NO: we need to work on guarding the 3 pt line better (which we have since)
3) Can't overlook weaker opponents or look ahaed (i think we still struggle with this)
4) ORL: turnovers can kill you (we are much better in that dept today than at the beg of season0
5) CLE: we got complacent with our own success and didn't do the small things to win the game ( let's see if we fix this, starting tonight)
Now, I'm not saying that those losses were the only way we learned to fix our mistakes, but it definetly helps the ocaching staff get their points across. If we avoid stupid losses like the GSW or NJ (where we control the game for 45-46 mins and brain fart at the worst possible time), we're a 50 win team.
Joined: 14 May 2003 Posts: 4520 Location: Hollywood, Ca.
Posted: Fri Dec 21, 2007 1:53 pm Post subject:
I think this is a good thread. If you look at the previous game against Chicago it was a game that was similarly sloppy and lethargic by the Lakers through most of it. The team just went through the motions for three and a half quarters without ever putting together a solid run, and then they pulled it together at the end and finally put the Bulls away. Games like that are fools gold for the Lakers as they start to think they can conserve energy and cut corners and still win, and you could see that yesterday once they built that 11 point lead. The passion and focus was just not on display at all yesterday, and I think the Lakers were just victims of their own success. While every loss is bad, I do think the Lakers can learn something from this loss and hopefully it will re-focus them and let them go in to Philly and NY tonight and Sunday with purpose and come home 3-1 for the road trip.
The Lakers are a young team and are going to have lapses like these. Nobody wins every game, and even the best teams will occasionally lose games that they have no business losing. As long as the the team is able to learn from their mistakes, then it's all part of the process. _________________ "People don't think it be like it is, but it do." - Oscar Gamble
Just a reminder folks: "a lot" is two words. So is "no one".
I agree. These loses are also used by Phil to get the guys understanding what they did wrong. Sometimes, when you win a game even while doing so many things wrong...the players brush it off because they won. They will at least notice their mistakes as they lost, and learn from it.
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