Best defender: Scottie Pippen vs. Michael Cooper

Billy Thompson

Since Pippen's name was brought up frequently during his rumored position on Phil's staff, I've heard him refered to as the "best defensive player of all time" to the best "all around player" in several articles.

Defense-wise, how does he stack up? Before you even consider him, you'd have to immediately think of the standard: Michael Cooper.

At 6'7" 180 lbs, Coop had the length and quickness to shut down opposing point guards, shooting guards, and small forwards. His small frame and quick feet allowed him to slide through picks and chase small guards like Isiah Thomas and John Stockton while having the height and wingspan to cover Larry Bird. During Bird's retirement, he refered to Coop as the best that ever guarded him. One of his trademark defensive highlights was when he would come from behind a player during a fastbreak and block their layup.

Honors
Defensive player of the year: 1 time, 1987
NBA All-defensive 1st team: 5 times
NBA All-defensive 2nd team: 3 times

On the other hand, Scottie Pippen was finally recognized for his defensive abilities after going after Magic Johnson aggressively (and illegally, IMO) in the 1991 finals. After beating the Lakers 4-1, Magic’s inability to dominate was credited to Scottie’s defense. Against the Pacers in 1998, Pippen was able to duplicate his harassment on point guard Mark Jackson and seriously limited him in the Eastern Finals.

Honors
Defensive player of the year: None
NBA All-defensive 1st team: 8 times
NBA All-defensive 2nd team: 1 time

From a certain point of view, this is an apples to oranges comparison. In my opinion, Pippen was a better floating defender while Coop is the best all-time on-the-ball defender. However, if I were to form the best defensive team of all time, it would start with Coop.

Mike@LG · Posted: Fri Jul 22, 2005 1:46 pm Post subject:

What, like Pippen's defense on Magic Johnson in the 1991 Finals wasn't good enough on-the-ball defense?
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djb · Franchise Player Joined: 11 Jul 2004 Posts: 11673

Dennis Rodman
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Billy Thompson · Posted: Fri Jul 22, 2005 2:03 pm Post subject:

Mike@LG · Posted: Fri Jul 22, 2005 2:05 pm Post subject:

Billy Thompson · Posted: Fri Jul 22, 2005 2:20 pm Post subject:

HRE · Posted: Fri Jul 22, 2005 2:22 pm Post subject:

Pip.
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KtotheBryant8 · Starting Rotation Joined: 16 Jul 2005 Posts: 182

chucky atkins is my hero no one competes with his defense, i mean he kept andre emmit from scoring, a point even though he only average like 1.3 mminutes a game and didn't play at all agains tthe lakers, but thats some lock down D if you ask me

macwebb · Star Player Joined: 24 Jun 2005 Posts: 1052

Man, Billy, this is a tough one...where did you get this idea? It's a good one...

Coop is one of my all-time favorites...so I am a little biased...I think if I had to pick one of these guys, I would give Pip a slight edge, mostly because he not only took the hard defensive assignments, but he usually quarterbacked the other guys and directed them in their assignments, even MJ...so with that in mind I would give Pip a slight edge, but not by much...

I love COOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOP!

Billy Thompson · Posted: Fri Jul 22, 2005 2:30 pm Post subject:

On a side note, BOTH got schooled by KOBE.

According to the pro summer league / pickup game reports....

c728 · Star Player Joined: 20 Jul 2002 Posts: 6933

Walter Sobchak · Posted: Fri Jul 22, 2005 3:10 pm Post subject:

From those 3 players, I think it was Pippen. He was a fantastic team defender and on-ball defender. I think it's Pippen's team defense that gives him the edge over Cooper. I don't think that either Cooper or Pippen would be the best SF/G defender of all time though. I would probably put Michael Jordan there, and Gary Payton should probably also get some mention. Someone mentioned Rodman, but he wasn't a small forward or guard; but if you wanted to discuss the greatest defender of all-time at any position I think that you'd have to say it was Bill Russell hands down, with Jordan a distant second, IMO.
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Buck32 · Star Player Joined: 30 Apr 2001 Posts: 7329

PopcornMachine · Franchise Player Joined: 19 Apr 2001 Posts: 10566

I remember Coop handling Larry Bird.

I guess most here didn't see that.
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TIME · Starting Rotation Joined: 23 Sep 2003 Posts: 278

KA_2 · Star Player Joined: 08 Jan 2005 Posts: 1883

Pippen pretty easily.
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lkrsdudugold · Starting Rotation Joined: 13 Jul 2005 Posts: 111

Bird 30 ppg
Thomas 25 ppg
DR J 27 ppg

that is against Pippin's defense

I think a little more of a big deal was made about Pippen because he was the only other player on Jordan's team. If there was another All-Star on Jordan's team you might have never heard of Pippen.

Cooper on the other hand..well you heard it from Bird's own mouth. I voted for Atkins but in my heart it's really Copper jsyk

DNA · Star Player Joined: 14 Feb 2005 Posts: 1694

Those numbers must have came from Pippen's early years, since those guys didn't play much during the 90's. However, Pippen wasn't known for his defense till his first championship. Also, looking at Pippen's PPG against doesn't do justice when one, Pippen also played a lot of help D. Two, the field goal % needs to be taken into account, and three, if the guy is a playmaker, then the assists also need to be taken into account. For example, Kobe averaged 32 ppg against Bowen in 2003, yet one can hardly say that he was anything but average because well he took almost 30 shots and his assists were kept well below average.

Mike@LG · Posted: Fri Jul 22, 2005 5:22 pm Post subject:

elbonian · Starting Rotation Joined: 26 Jun 2005 Posts: 163

I voted for Atkins.

He is not the best on ball defender, but I have to give it to him for his team defense over Coop and Pip.

The way he plays strategic positional defense, forcing him man to blow by him into right into shot blocking monsters like Mihm and Grant. I've never seen a guy who could consistently funnel his man into a trap like that ever.

Money$hot! · Star Player Joined: 18 Dec 2002 Posts: 5911

Pippen had Jordan and Rodman (two of the greatest all time defenders as help) in their prime.

Coop had no help and still locked up the greatest offensive players ever.

Give Coop, MJ and Rodman and he becomes Pippen's equal as a team defender and still is a better on ball defender. It's not even close.

Michael Cooper by a landslide.

Runway8 · Posted: Sat Jul 23, 2005 12:54 pm Post subject:

bambam · Star Player Joined: 03 Jul 2003 Posts: 9013

Normnix · Sixth Man Joined: 18 Mar 2005 Posts: 59

scottie without question. For all of the reasons Mike _at_ LG mentioned.

However, one should note the difference between pre bad boys defense and post bad boys defense. Especially when talking about great perimeter defenders.

before the bad boys, refs pretty much called any and all handchecking out on the perimeter. The paint had always been grimey. Probably moreso than now. But perimeter defenders really had to play defense without their hands. After the bad boys, refs let defenders get away with more.

Now that's not to say Scottie wasn't legitimately locking people down. But there was a difference in officiating.

LA_Lakers_Rule · Posted: Mon Jul 25, 2005 6:34 pm Post subject:

I thought I'd vote Atkins, just as a joke to mess things up, then I find 14 other loggers must have thought the same thing, amazing...

My vote to Cooper !!! I'll take Larry Bird's word for it !!!

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