Holy crap... GAS PRICES??!!?
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Mike@LG
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PostPosted: Mon Aug 15, 2005 5:28 pm    Post subject:

http://www.eere.energy.gov/cleancities/hev/cost_calc.html
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angel
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PostPosted: Mon Aug 15, 2005 6:07 pm    Post subject:

I know in Europe at one time had a 2.0L engine displacement as the cutoff for gas guzzler taxes. I don't know if they would ever do anything like that here.
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PostPosted: Mon Aug 15, 2005 9:14 pm    Post subject:

Experimental Hybrid Cars Get Up to 250 Mpg

CORTE MADERA, Calif. - Politicians and automakers say a car that can both reduce greenhouse gases and free America from its reliance on foreign oil is years or even decades away. Ron Gremban says such a car is parked in his garage.

It looks like a typical Toyota Prius hybrid, but in the trunk sits an 80-miles-per-gallon secret — a stack of 18 brick-sized batteries that boosts the car's high mileage with an extra electrical charge so it can burn even less fuel.

Gremban, an electrical engineer and committed environmentalist, spent several months and $3,000 tinkering with his car.

Like all hybrids, his Prius increases fuel efficiency by harnessing small amounts of electricity generated during braking and coasting. The extra batteries let him store extra power by plugging the car into a wall outlet at his home in this San Francisco suburb — all for about a quarter.

Complete article


LINK
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Mike@LG
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PostPosted: Tue Aug 16, 2005 7:27 am    Post subject:

angel wrote:
I know in Europe at one time had a 2.0L engine displacement as the cutoff for gas guzzler taxes. I don't know if they would ever do anything like that here.


No way. Dodge, Ford, and Chevrolet are market driven to have huge V8s to drive sales, whether it's the LS1 motor, Hemi, or 4.6L V8 from Ford. Their most popular models have those motors inside.

It would cost them huge to recover from a law like that and may take US car business out.
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Mike@LG
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PostPosted: Tue Aug 16, 2005 7:34 am    Post subject:

100mpg
http://www.autoexpress.co.uk/news/34225/bold_new_astra_shows_its_class.html

Quote:
Performance car fans are certain to be excited by the promise of the 250bhp GSi edition, which will be powered by a 2.0-litre Saab-derived four-cylinder turbo. At the other end of the range is a new four-cylinder 1.3-litre diesel that could power an ultra-frugal 'Eco 3'-style car capable of offering nearly 100mpg. However, the top-selling diesel is likely to be a revised edition of the 1.7-litre DTi that proves so popular today.


If a hatchback looked like that with that great gas mileage and a 0-60 of 10 sec., I'd buy it.

http://www.autoexpress.co.uk/news/15980/radical_lotus_concept_car.html

Quote:
The environmentally-conscious team produced the vehicle using a hybrid engine combining electric and natural gas, giving the car amazing performance whilst meeting stringent pollution targets with ultra-low emissions. A fuel consumption figure of 100mpg is claimed.

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PostPosted: Tue Aug 16, 2005 7:36 am    Post subject:

Mike@LG wrote:
angel wrote:
I know in Europe at one time had a 2.0L engine displacement as the cutoff for gas guzzler taxes. I don't know if they would ever do anything like that here.


No way. Dodge, Ford, and Chevrolet are market driven to have huge V8s to drive sales, whether it's the LS1 motor, Hemi, or 4.6L V8 from Ford. Their most popular models have those motors inside.

It would cost them huge to recover from a law like that and may take US car business out.


I agree that I don't see a US gas guzzler law like that but I will not be surprised when Huge engines go the way of the Dodo bird simply because of market pressure. Gas is starting to be very expensive. If it hits $4.00 you can be sure American habits are going to change and change quickly.

Coupled with the general rise in prices (due to larger transporation and shipping cost), rising interest rates, less wealth (due to the erosion of housing prices), lack of personal savings, etc. you can be sure that Americans will be trying to find ways to save money and spending less on gas will be one very obvious choice.
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pokoy
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PostPosted: Tue Aug 16, 2005 7:39 am    Post subject:

Is it below $2 anywhere? My father-in-law said he went to Pennsylvania (neighboring state) and said gas there was $1.66.

I thought he might be mistaken and it must've been $2.66. I didn't think anybody had gas under $2 nowadays.

That's insane in Canada. $3.86...
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PostPosted: Tue Aug 16, 2005 7:44 am    Post subject:

I can remember 18.9 cents a gallon.(late 60's)
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Mike@LG
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PostPosted: Tue Aug 16, 2005 8:01 am    Post subject:

Quasiturbine engine:
http://auto.howstuffworks.com/quasiturbine.htm
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PostPosted: Tue Aug 16, 2005 8:25 am    Post subject:

It just keeps getting better ...

http://money.cnn.com/2005/08/16/news/economy/gasoline/index.htm
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PostPosted: Tue Aug 16, 2005 10:43 am    Post subject:

angrypuppy wrote:

Global shortages abound, as production is bottle-necked with insufficient refinery capacity. The demand curve has shifted out, as China no longer has the domestic production to meeting her rapidly expanding needs.

Yup. Those are the real reasons for this. We haven't built a new refinery in 30 years. Meanwhile, China and India are growing at rapid paces, causing much greater demand for oil.

Whether gas prices will stay this high isn't a given. I imagine much of the spike is caused due to speculators and day traders bidding up prices, and at some point the bubble will burst. But that doesn't change the underlying issues of lack of refineries and greater world demand.
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lakersfreak
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PostPosted: Tue Aug 16, 2005 10:50 am    Post subject:

Star wrote:


If it hits $4.00 you can be sure American habits are going to change and change quickly.



Yep, then there will be a glut of oil, prices will fall and the cycle will repeat.

Unless....

new players like China keep the demand up
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Mike@LG
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PostPosted: Tue Aug 16, 2005 1:58 pm    Post subject:

Quasiturbines:

Quote:
Finally, in Type IV, the best attributes of gasoline and diesel engines are combined. A premixed fuel-air charge undergoes tremendous compression until the fuel self-ignites. This is what happens in a photo-detonation engine, and because it employs a homogenous charge and compression ignition, it is often described as an HCCI engine. HCCI (Homogeneous Charge Compression Ignition) combustion results in virtually no emissions and superior fuel efficiency. This is because photo-detonation engines completely combust the fuel, leaving behind no hydrocarbons to be treated by a catalytic converter or simply expelled into the air.

http://auto.howstuffworks.com/quasiturbine4.htm


Quote:
What all this amounts to in the Quasiturbine engine is increased efficiency and performance. The four chambers produce two consecutive circuits. The first circuit is used to compress and expand during combustion. The second is used to expel exhaust and intake air. In one revolution of the rotor, four power strokes are created. That's eight times more than a typical piston engine! Even a Wankel engine, which produces three power strokes per rotor revolution, can't match the performance of a Quasiturbine.

http://auto.howstuffworks.com/quasiturbine6.htm


Quote:
Advantages and Disadvantages
Obviously, the increased power output of the Quasiturbine engine makes it superior to Wankel and piston engines, but it has also solved many of the problems presented by the Wankel. For example, the Wankel engines leads to incomplete combustion of the fuel-air mixture, with the remaining unburned hydrocarbons released into the exhaust. The Quasiturbine engine overcomes this problem with a combustion chamber that is 30 percent less elongated. This means that the fuel-air mixture in the quasiturbine experiences a greater compression and a more complete burn. It also means that, with less fuel going unburned, the Quasiturbine increases fuel efficiency dramatically.

Other significant advantages of the Quasiturbine include:

* Zero vibration because the engine is perfectly balanced
* Faster acceleration without a flywheel
* Higher torque at lower rpm
* Nearly oil-free operation
* Less noise
* Complete flexibility to operate completely submerged or in any orientation, even upside-down
* Fewer moving parts for less wear and tear

Finally, the Quasiturbine can run on different kinds of fuel, including methanol, gasoline, kerosene, natural gas and diesel. It can even accommodate hydrogen as a fuel source, making it an ideal transitional solution as cars evolve from traditional combustion to alternate fuels.


As we'll see in the next section, the biggest problem with the Quasiturbine engine is its lack of testing in real-world environments.


http://www.quasiturbine.com/QTImages/SuzukiENet.jpg
Chart of power output.
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angel
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PostPosted: Tue Aug 16, 2005 2:27 pm    Post subject:

Formula One cars have small displacements. Of course they do extreme things to maximize the output to weight ratios. I'm sure if it became a priority, American engineers can make us self-sufficient. We have some great automotive engineers.
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PostPosted: Tue Aug 16, 2005 3:14 pm    Post subject:

Mike@LG wrote:
100mpg


http://www.autoexpress.co.uk/news/15980/radical_lotus_concept_car.html


Quote:
The concept's unique suspension system allows the vehicle to lean into bends, motorcycle-style.


Cool!
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Mike@LG
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PostPosted: Tue Aug 16, 2005 4:23 pm    Post subject:

angel wrote:
Formula One cars have small displacements. Of course they do extreme things to maximize the output to weight ratios. I'm sure if it became a priority, American engineers can make us self-sufficient. We have some great automotive engineers.


And those motors get chucked after whatever number of races and only get 5-10mpg.

It's a lot easier to make power out of an internal combustion motor, especially one with short life.

Making it last 300,000 miles and having it get 30-40mpg with adequate power to get around town? Different story.
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angel
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PostPosted: Wed Aug 17, 2005 2:26 pm    Post subject:

Toyotas seem to have a good combination of mileage and long lasting engines.
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Mike@LG
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PostPosted: Wed Aug 17, 2005 2:51 pm    Post subject:

angel wrote:
Toyotas seem to have a good combination of mileage and long lasting engines.


Yup. It helps the engines run on rich mixtures as well to keep the longevity of the motor.
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PostPosted: Wed Aug 17, 2005 3:28 pm    Post subject:

gas is 5 cents/gallon in Iraq
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PostPosted: Wed Aug 17, 2005 4:25 pm    Post subject:

I miss the old days

http://goodoldays.ytmnd.com/
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angel
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PostPosted: Thu Aug 18, 2005 4:17 pm    Post subject:

The funny thing is it wasn't that long ago. Even the part with the free car washes wasn't uncommon.
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PostPosted: Thu Aug 25, 2005 3:42 pm    Post subject:

Gas prices seem to be dropping now. It comes after there is some policy to improve gas mileage.
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PostPosted: Sat Aug 27, 2005 6:52 am    Post subject:

Yesterday -- 15 gallons.

Over $41.

<bleep>

Thank heaven I only have to fill up every TWO weeks now. Three months ago, I was commuting 50 miles a day, round-trip, with evening rush hour traffic. Even with me driving a '98 Accord which I maintain fairly well, that was a fill-up a week.

Of course, three months ago, that was ONLY $140 a month.

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PostPosted: Sat Aug 27, 2005 10:33 am    Post subject:

angel wrote:
Toyotas seem to have a good combination of mileage and long lasting engines.


I love what they do for me.
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PostPosted: Sat Aug 27, 2005 11:23 pm    Post subject:

It's time to start drilling oil in Alaska and opening refineries again in America. There have been no refineries or nuclear plants opened since the 1970s. The evironmentalists have screwed things up long enough.
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