Lakers in the Mix for Deng (UPDATE:more teams jump in pg .18)
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king255
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PostPosted: Wed Jul 23, 2008 12:12 pm    Post subject:

A guy like Farmar can easily be found late in the 1st round. He definitely should not be the hold up. If Delonte West is available, then he's definitely someone to consider.

I say make the deal as quickly as possible, before all the free agents get signed up.
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PostPosted: Wed Jul 23, 2008 12:12 pm    Post subject:

Sky wrote:
Having to look at free agency. What's more important, starting 3 for next 10 years locked in or having to shop for backup 1?

I don't see Buss paying 4 max or near-max players, let's be realistic. If we got Deng, then Pau is probably out the door when we get the first great offer for him that includes younger players on better contracts (and I'm not necessarily opposed to that, would have to think about it a bit).

Either way, Deng clearly wouldn't solve the spacing issues that have been so direly presented as a problem with Odom at the 3 for 16 minutes per game.
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PostPosted: Wed Jul 23, 2008 12:16 pm    Post subject:

Critical Beatdown wrote:
Sky wrote:
Having to look at free agency. What's more important, starting 3 for next 10 years locked in or having to shop for backup 1?

I don't see Buss paying 4 max or near-max players, let's be realistic. If we got Deng, then Pau is probably out the door when we get the first great offer for him that includes younger players on better contracts (and I'm not necessarily opposed to that, would have to think about it a bit).

Either way, Deng clearly wouldn't solve the spacing issues that have been so direly presented as a problem with Odom at the 3 for 16 minutes per game.


This entire thread is unrealistic. What makes you think the Bulls have any interest in Deng for Lamar Odom? When they had reservations on trading Deng for Bryant? If the Lakers were to somehow steal Deng from Chicago, I'm absolutely sure that Buss would be willing to pay for a Bryant/Deng/Gasol/Bynum core. We could fill in the remainder with MLE players.


Last edited by JUST-MING on Wed Jul 23, 2008 12:17 pm; edited 2 times in total
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PostPosted: Wed Jul 23, 2008 12:16 pm    Post subject:

If anything, maybe we should be thinking about dealing Pau for Deng and Hinrich, because then we could include Farmar (though I'd rather keep Farmar, so maybe we go for somebody else on the Bulls along with Deng).

It's still kinda questionable how well Pau will defend the 4 spot anyway...would we be better off with Deng and Lamar as our forwards next to Bynum and Kobe, while we still retain Farmar?

Farmar
Kobe
Deng
Odom
Bynum

That looks like a dynasty to me, especially since it frees up more space for Kobe to post up as he ages.
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PostPosted: Wed Jul 23, 2008 12:16 pm    Post subject:

Critical Beatdown wrote:
Sky wrote:
Having to look at free agency. What's more important, starting 3 for next 10 years locked in or having to shop for backup 1?

I don't see Buss paying 4 max or near-max players, let's be realistic. If we got Deng, then Pau is probably out the door when we get the first great offer for him that includes younger players on better contracts (and I'm not necessarily opposed to that, would have to think about it a bit).

Either way, Deng clearly wouldn't solve the spacing issues that have been so direly presented as a problem with Odom at the 3 for 16 minutes per game.


Actually, Deng is very good at instinctively finding the open spaces to get his shot. He would thrive in the Tri with most of the attention located in the paint and on Kobe.
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PostPosted: Wed Jul 23, 2008 12:17 pm    Post subject:

king255 wrote:
A guy like Farmar can easily be found late in the 1st round.

No he can't, the guy keeps better every season, and has turned into a 3-point sniper when that was supposed to be his biggest weakness. Farmar was a steal for us, and only because he went into the draft too early.
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PostPosted: Wed Jul 23, 2008 12:18 pm    Post subject:

Critical Beatdown wrote:
If anything, maybe we should be thinking about dealing Pau for Deng and Hinrich, because then we could include Farmar (though I'd rather keep Farmar, so maybe we go for somebody else on the Bulls along with Deng).

It's still kinda questionable how well Pau will defend the 4 spot anyway...would we be better off with Deng and Lamar as our forwards next to Bynum and Kobe, while we still retain Farmar?

Farmar
Kobe
Deng
Odom
Bynum

That looks like a dynasty to me, especially since it frees up more space for Kobe to post up as he ages.


Because? Bryant and Gasol just lead us to the NBA Finals. Gasol defending Boozer, Duncan and Garnett.
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PostPosted: Wed Jul 23, 2008 12:22 pm    Post subject:

Beatdown- The Lakers have been after Deng for two years. They've already contacted his agent about S&T scenarios. That can only realistically happen in an Odom deal and only if Buss was already ok with the fiscal ramifications. The decision has already been made, if the Lakers can make a deal where Odom and Deng are the principals they are pulling the trigger without any hesitation whatsoever.

Raise all the negatives you want CB, the Lakers have already made the call on this one. They do it.


Last edited by Sky on Wed Jul 23, 2008 12:23 pm; edited 1 time in total
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PostPosted: Wed Jul 23, 2008 12:22 pm    Post subject:

24 wrote:
Critical Beatdown wrote:
Sky wrote:
Having to look at free agency. What's more important, starting 3 for next 10 years locked in or having to shop for backup 1?

I don't see Buss paying 4 max or near-max players, let's be realistic. If we got Deng, then Pau is probably out the door when we get the first great offer for him that includes younger players on better contracts (and I'm not necessarily opposed to that, would have to think about it a bit).

Either way, Deng clearly wouldn't solve the spacing issues that have been so direly presented as a problem with Odom at the 3 for 16 minutes per game.


Actually, Deng is very good at instinctively finding the open spaces to get his shot. He would thrive in the Tri with most of the attention located in the paint and on Kobe.


Deng is a more lethal scorer than Lamar, no doubt, but we already have a lot of scorers, and Deng is not as good a passer or playmaker as Lamar, so you have to balance the picture when making analysis.

For instance, Deng and Lamar were basically identical shooting 2-point jumpers last season (40%), and neither guy is a 3-point threat. Deng is a potential 20 and 8 guy but do we need that? Kobe will get his 25, Pau will get his 18, Drew will get his 18, that's 61 points already, so you don't really need another near-max salary scorer.

Really, those pointing at Shane Battier or Tayshaun Prince are more on the mark, as those players not only fit better but their salaries fit better as far as overall team salary as well as what we actually need from them considering that Kobe, Pau and Drew will all be all-stars.
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PostPosted: Wed Jul 23, 2008 12:22 pm    Post subject:

Critical Beatdown wrote:
king255 wrote:
A guy like Farmar can easily be found late in the 1st round.

No he can't, the guy keeps better every season, and has turned into a 3-point sniper when that was supposed to be his biggest weakness. Farmar was a steal for us, and only because he went into the draft too early.


Well, Farmar has been here for just 2 seasons, so technically, you can say that he's improved every season The question is whether his potential is starter or permanent bench player. I'm guessing the latter. He may have a great work ethic, but to me, work ethic will only improve you a little bit above your limit(and help you get there quicker), not a lot.
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PostPosted: Wed Jul 23, 2008 12:24 pm    Post subject:

king255 wrote:
Critical Beatdown wrote:
king255 wrote:
A guy like Farmar can easily be found late in the 1st round.

No he can't, the guy keeps better every season, and has turned into a 3-point sniper when that was supposed to be his biggest weakness. Farmar was a steal for us, and only because he went into the draft too early.


Well, Farmar has been here for just 2 seasons, so technically, you can say that he's improved every season The question is whether his potential is starter or permanent bench player. I'm guessing the latter. He may have a great work ethic, but to me, work ethic will only improve you a little bit above your limit(and help you get there quicker), not a lot.


Last I checked, "every" doesn't imply a number. Farmar has vastly improved each and every season he's been with us, and I expect that to continue into the future. Don't be surprised if Jordan ends up an all-star or at least all-star caliber player himself, along the lines of Mike Bibby but with better passing skills and intangibles.
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PostPosted: Wed Jul 23, 2008 12:24 pm    Post subject:

Critical Beatdown wrote:

It's still kinda questionable how well Pau will defend the 4 spot anyway...would we be better off with Deng and Lamar as our forwards next to Bynum and Kobe, while we still retain Farmar?


Its funny when people question how Pau plays the 4. I don't know, maybe he played the 4 his entire career except for half a season with the Lakers? And been an all-star before as a 4?
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PostPosted: Wed Jul 23, 2008 12:24 pm    Post subject:

Critical Beatdown wrote:
24 wrote:
Critical Beatdown wrote:
Sky wrote:
Having to look at free agency. What's more important, starting 3 for next 10 years locked in or having to shop for backup 1?

I don't see Buss paying 4 max or near-max players, let's be realistic. If we got Deng, then Pau is probably out the door when we get the first great offer for him that includes younger players on better contracts (and I'm not necessarily opposed to that, would have to think about it a bit).

Either way, Deng clearly wouldn't solve the spacing issues that have been so direly presented as a problem with Odom at the 3 for 16 minutes per game.


Actually, Deng is very good at instinctively finding the open spaces to get his shot. He would thrive in the Tri with most of the attention located in the paint and on Kobe.


Deng is a more lethal scorer than Lamar, no doubt, but we already have a lot of scorers, and Deng is not as good a passer or playmaker as Lamar, so you have to balance the picture when making analysis.

For instance, Deng and Lamar were basically identical shooting 2-point jumpers last season (40%), and neither guy is a 3-point threat. Deng is a potential 20 and 8 guy but do we need that? Kobe will get his 25, Pau will get his 18, Drew will get his 18, that's 61 points already, so you don't really need another near-max salary scorer.

Really, those pointing at Shane Battier or Tayshaun Prince are more on the mark, as those players not only fit better but their salaries fit better as far as overall team salary as well as what we actually need from them considering that Kobe, Pau and Drew will all be all-stars.


But Deng gives you everything they do, and he's young enough to team with Bynum after gasol and kobe decline.
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PostPosted: Wed Jul 23, 2008 12:25 pm    Post subject:

Deng is a glue guy... he may not have Lamar's ball handling skills or be as adept as a passer (although he's not a bad passer either), but he is a much better defender, just as selfless, and has a good jumper. I'd prefer a Shane Battier or Tayshuan Prince (if only because they might be less pricey and have better 3pt range), but as far as Tri-able 3s in this league go, Deng might be at the top of the list.
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PostPosted: Wed Jul 23, 2008 12:26 pm    Post subject:

Hector the Pup wrote:
LakerJam wrote:
kaoss128 wrote:
We have to get Deng if anything just to keep him away from Portland. Portland will have plenty of cap space next year and if Deng is not traded I would be willing to bet he goes there.


If I'm the Lakers - or ANY team in the west, really - I sign Darius Miles to two 10-day contracts so that his contract is officially on Portland's books and their cap space is GONE.

Business is business, after all.


It would need to be a full season contract.

The guy has a 10 game suspension to serve, then you'd need to use a whole bunch of duct tape to keep his knee together for 10 games after that.


He only needs to be on a roster for more than 10 games and his entire contract is on Portland's books against the cap.


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PostPosted: Wed Jul 23, 2008 12:26 pm    Post subject:

LakerSanity wrote:
Deng is a glue guy... he may not have Lamar's ball handling skills or be as adept as a passer (although he's not a bad passer either), but he is a much better defender, just as selfless, and has a good jumper. I'd prefer a Shane Battier or Tayshuan Prince (if only because they might be less pricey and have better 3pt range), but as far as Tri-able 3s in this league go, Deng might be at the top of the list.


Put it this way: Houston or Detroit would immediately accept Deng for the guys you mentioned above.
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PostPosted: Wed Jul 23, 2008 12:26 pm    Post subject:

Sky wrote:
Beatdown- The Lakers have been after Deng for two years. They've already contacted his agent about S&T scenarios. That can only realistically happen in an Odom deal and only if Buss was already ok with the fiscal ramifications. The decision has already been made, if the Lakers can make a deal where Odom and Deng are the principals they are pulling the trigger without any hesitation whatsoever.

Raise all the negatives you want CB, the Lakers have already made the call on this one. They do it.


I'm not opposed to it either, just saying that if we land Deng then Pau is going to be out the door within a year or two, and I'm not necessarily opposed to that either.

As I've said, I would trade Lamar for Deng and deal with the financial consequences later, but I would fight hard not to include Farmar in that deal (don't care about Ariza), and would at this point likely nix the trade if it had to include Farmar.
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PostPosted: Wed Jul 23, 2008 12:28 pm    Post subject: Re: Lakers in the Mix for Deng (Deng set an Aug. 4 deadline)

[quote="Great One"] Lakers, Pistons, Heat and Jazz have all had discussions with Luol Deng's camp

"Great one", I appreciate the title update but next time put the pg. number where the update shows. I haven't found it yet(I just started looking.)
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PostPosted: Wed Jul 23, 2008 12:28 pm    Post subject:

24 wrote:
LakerSanity wrote:
Deng is a glue guy... he may not have Lamar's ball handling skills or be as adept as a passer (although he's not a bad passer either), but he is a much better defender, just as selfless, and has a good jumper. I'd prefer a Shane Battier or Tayshuan Prince (if only because they might be less pricey and have better 3pt range), but as far as Tri-able 3s in this league go, Deng might be at the top of the list.


Put it this way: Houston or Detroit would immediately accept Deng for the guys you mentioned above.


Of course they would, but that's not his point, and each team's needs and financial situation are different. If there was no salary cap or luxury tax, it wouldn't even be an issue, and Buss could make like Steinbrenner.
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PostPosted: Wed Jul 23, 2008 12:29 pm    Post subject:

Critical Beatdown wrote:
24 wrote:
LakerSanity wrote:
Deng is a glue guy... he may not have Lamar's ball handling skills or be as adept as a passer (although he's not a bad passer either), but he is a much better defender, just as selfless, and has a good jumper. I'd prefer a Shane Battier or Tayshuan Prince (if only because they might be less pricey and have better 3pt range), but as far as Tri-able 3s in this league go, Deng might be at the top of the list.


Put it this way: Houston or Detroit would immediately accept Deng for the guys you mentioned above.


Of course they would, but that's not his point, and each team's needs and financial situation are different.


Just pointing out that he's top of the heap.
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PostPosted: Wed Jul 23, 2008 12:29 pm    Post subject:

Critical Beatdown wrote:
24 wrote:
Critical Beatdown wrote:
Sky wrote:
Having to look at free agency. What's more important, starting 3 for next 10 years locked in or having to shop for backup 1?

I don't see Buss paying 4 max or near-max players, let's be realistic. If we got Deng, then Pau is probably out the door when we get the first great offer for him that includes younger players on better contracts (and I'm not necessarily opposed to that, would have to think about it a bit).

Either way, Deng clearly wouldn't solve the spacing issues that have been so direly presented as a problem with Odom at the 3 for 16 minutes per game.


Actually, Deng is very good at instinctively finding the open spaces to get his shot. He would thrive in the Tri with most of the attention located in the paint and on Kobe.


Deng is a more lethal scorer than Lamar, no doubt, but we already have a lot of scorers, and Deng is not as good a passer or playmaker as Lamar, so you have to balance the picture when making analysis.

For instance, Deng and Lamar were basically identical shooting 2-point jumpers last season (40%), and neither guy is a 3-point threat. Deng is a potential 20 and 8 guy but do we need that? Kobe will get his 25, Pau will get his 18, Drew will get his 18, that's 61 points already, so you don't really need another near-max salary scorer.

Really, those pointing at Shane Battier or Tayshaun Prince are more on the mark, as those players not only fit better but their salaries fit better as far as overall team salary as well as what we actually need from them considering that Kobe, Pau and Drew will all be all-stars.


Of course we can use 20 and 8. I think what you meant is, can he get 20 and 8 here? Probably not. But I'll take 16, 7 and 3 for 8 years and possibly great D over Odom's 13, 8 and 4 and good D for 4.
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PostPosted: Wed Jul 23, 2008 12:29 pm    Post subject:

24 wrote:
LakerSanity wrote:
Deng is a glue guy... he may not have Lamar's ball handling skills or be as adept as a passer (although he's not a bad passer either), but he is a much better defender, just as selfless, and has a good jumper. I'd prefer a Shane Battier or Tayshuan Prince (if only because they might be less pricey and have better 3pt range), but as far as Tri-able 3s in this league go, Deng might be at the top of the list.


Put it this way: Houston or Detroit would immediately accept Deng for the guys you mentioned above.


Well yes, because Deng is a better player... but we also have to take into account fit. We primarily need a SF with a good 3pt shot and shut down D (some ball handling skills wouldn't hurt either), and that makes a guy like Battier the perfect fit. However, Deng is probably still more preferable thinking about it because Deng is not a role player, he's a core piece who could be around for a long time after Kobe is no longer suiting up.
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PostPosted: Wed Jul 23, 2008 12:30 pm    Post subject:

Does Phil want Josh Smith? Cause his mouth piece Rosen wrote this yesterday
Quote:
For sure, Josh Smith is a knucklehead, albeit a very talented one. Trouble is, despite their courageous playoff showing against the Celtics, the Hawks are headed nowhere. For his own good, Smith needs to play with a no-nonsense, veteran, championship-caliber team, one that's led by a coach whose disciplined game plan is reinforced by a gold ring or two, or at least a finals appearance.

[/u]
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PostPosted: Wed Jul 23, 2008 12:31 pm    Post subject:

ocho wrote:
137 pages.


138 pages Drew
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PostPosted: Wed Jul 23, 2008 12:31 pm    Post subject:

JUST-MING wrote:
Critical Beatdown wrote:
Sky wrote:
Having to look at free agency. What's more important, starting 3 for next 10 years locked in or having to shop for backup 1?

I don't see Buss paying 4 max or near-max players, let's be realistic. If we got Deng, then Pau is probably out the door when we get the first great offer for him that includes younger players on better contracts (and I'm not necessarily opposed to that, would have to think about it a bit).

Either way, Deng clearly wouldn't solve the spacing issues that have been so direly presented as a problem with Odom at the 3 for 16 minutes per game.


This entire thread is unrealistic. What makes you think the Bulls have any interest in Deng for Lamar Odom? When they had reservations on trading Deng for Bryant? If the Lakers were to somehow steal Deng from Chicago, I'm absolutely sure that Buss would be willing to pay for a Bryant/Deng/Gasol/Bynum core. We could fill in the remainder with MLE players.


Well last year Indiana wanted Odom, Bynum for JO. Within a year they end up trading him for TJ Ford.
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