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| What was the best team of all time? |
| 1=2000-2001 repeat Lakers |
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50% |
[ 26 ] |
| 2=1972 West and Wilt Lakers |
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50% |
[ 26 ] |
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| Total Votes : 52 |
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Kobedidit
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 Posted: Tue Aug 23, 2005 8:03 am Post subject: Best Team of All time? |
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| I would like to ask this question In my opinon it would be the 2000-2001 repeat lakers I dont think there was a team that could stop them at all with the 72-10 bulls having played a water down league as well that same team having problem in the finals they should be ranked like 4th or somethig. the 1972 lakers West and Wilt to me is the 2nd greatest team of all time. |
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MIMLaker
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| Posted: Tue Aug 23, 2005 8:08 am Post subject: |
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NONE OF THE ABOVE -- 1986-87 Lakers. 
MIM
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Money$hot!
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| Posted: Tue Aug 23, 2005 8:11 am Post subject: |
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| MIMLaker wrote: | NONE OF THE ABOVE -- 1986-87 Lakers.
MIM |
QFT
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HRE
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| Posted: Tue Aug 23, 2005 8:13 am Post subject: |
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Neither.
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Billy Thompson
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| Posted: Tue Aug 23, 2005 11:43 am Post subject: |
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| MIMLaker wrote: | NONE OF THE ABOVE -- 1986-87 Lakers.
MIM |
Amen.
Magic
Scott
Worthy
Green
Thompson
Cooper
Rambis
Billy Thompson
Mike Smrek 
Adrian Branch
This "clutch" lineup of veterans is probaly the best halfcourt / defensive group of all time. He used them frequently against the Celtics:
G - Johnson
G - Cooper
F - Worthy
F - Thompson
C - Abdul-Jabbar
No one on the floor is shorter than 6'7" and the youngest is Worthy. In a life or death situation, I'd go with this 5 anytime. |
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BigVeece
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| Posted: Tue Aug 23, 2005 11:53 am Post subject: |
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| MIMLaker wrote: | NONE OF THE ABOVE -- 1986-87 Lakers.
MIM |
I cant say anything about the 72 team.. I wasnt around to see them play.. but I have to say that the 86-87 lakers would have ran circles on the 2000-2001 team. just a better team all around.. so just from what I've seen, not heard, I have to go with the showtime lakers all the way.. thats the reason I even started watchin the Lakers.. thats why I'm a Lakers fan.. VIVA Magic..  |
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STiG909
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| Posted: Tue Aug 23, 2005 12:01 pm Post subject: |
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| Just go back and watch some of the playoff games from 2001 when Shaq was in his prime and got along with Kobe. We only lost 1 game in the playoffs, and that was in OT and we were playing GOOD teams. There's no team in the history of the NBA who could've beat the 2000-2001 Lakers in a 7 game series during that time. |
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Billy Thompson
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| Posted: Tue Aug 23, 2005 12:45 pm Post subject: |
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| STiG909 wrote: | | Just go back and watch some of the playoff games from 2001 when Shaq was in his prime and got along with Kobe. We only lost 1 game in the playoffs, and that was in OT and we were playing GOOD teams. There's no team in the history of the NBA who could've beat the 2000-2001 Lakers in a 7 game series during that time. |
Imagine what our record would've been if Shaq decided to play all year? 2001 was definately better than 2000 with the additions of Grant and Foster. They were huge upgrades from Travis Knight and AC Green. In addition to that, a better-shooting Fish over Harper and a better defending Fox over Rice.
That playoff run was sick.... |
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The Mike
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| Posted: Tue Aug 23, 2005 12:51 pm Post subject: |
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Neither one of them, the 99-00 Lakers were better than the 00-01 repeat team. The repeat team was more dominate in the playoffs. But look at the regular season records
99-00 - 67-15
00-01 - 56-26
11 wins difference.
All that being said, to me the best team all time is the 86-87 Lakers. |
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BigVeece
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| Posted: Tue Aug 23, 2005 12:54 pm Post subject: |
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| Billy Thompson wrote: | | STiG909 wrote: | | Just go back and watch some of the playoff games from 2001 when Shaq was in his prime and got along with Kobe. We only lost 1 game in the playoffs, and that was in OT and we were playing GOOD teams. There's no team in the history of the NBA who could've beat the 2000-2001 Lakers in a 7 game series during that time. |
Imagine what our record would've been if Shaq decided to play all year? 2001 was definately better than 2000 with the additions of Grant and Foster. They were huge upgrades from Travis Knight and AC Green. In addition to that, a better-shooting Fish over Harper and a better defending Fox over Rice.
That playoff run was sick.... |
yeah, as much as I love the 2001 lakers, they wouldnt have matched up well with the 86-87 lakers.. Magic would have been posting fish up all day long plus he wouldnt have had to work much on the the other end of the floor.. cooper would have been able to do a nice job on kobe.. not shut him down but he would have made it hard for him.. scott would have done nice too.. Fox on Worthy, come on now man, no matchup.. the PF would have been a wash with Grant and Thompson but it would have been a nice matchup at center.. Shaq and Kareem would have been going at it.. 86 Lakers just had a deeper bench and a tougher D.. not even close in my eyes.. 86-87 in a landslide.. I'm not bad mouthing any lakers teams, I love them all its just I think the 86-87 team is best.. |
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32tapout
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| Posted: Tue Aug 23, 2005 1:27 pm Post subject: |
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The 2001 Lakers were a great playoff team and peaked at the end of the season but did not have the consistancy of the 86-87 Lakers or 71-72 Lakers during the course of a whole season. the 01 Lakers were the most dominant post season team I have ever seen but the the greatest fore a whole season. I have stressed in the past, the 87 Lakers had 3 great options/superstars in Magic, Kareem (even at his old age) and Big Game James. Worthy gives the 87 Lakers a definite advantage and major match up problems for any team.
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djb
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Kobedidit
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| Posted: Tue Aug 23, 2005 1:31 pm Post subject: |
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| BigVeece wrote: | | Billy Thompson wrote: | | STiG909 wrote: | | Just go back and watch some of the playoff games from 2001 when Shaq was in his prime and got along with Kobe. We only lost 1 game in the playoffs, and that was in OT and we were playing GOOD teams. There's no team in the history of the NBA who could've beat the 2000-2001 Lakers in a 7 game series during that time. |
Imagine what our record would've been if Shaq decided to play all year? 2001 was definately better than 2000 with the additions of Grant and Foster. They were huge upgrades from Travis Knight and AC Green. In addition to that, a better-shooting Fish over Harper and a better defending Fox over Rice.
That playoff run was sick.... |
yeah, as much as I love the 2001 lakers, they wouldnt have matched up well with the 86-87 lakers.. Magic would have been posting fish up all day long plus he wouldnt have had to work much on the the other end of the floor.. cooper would have been able to do a nice job on kobe.. not shut him down but he would have made it hard for him.. scott would have done nice too.. Fox on Worthy, come on now man, no matchup.. the PF would have been a wash with Grant and Thompson but it would have been a nice matchup at center.. Shaq and Kareem would have been going at it.. 86 Lakers just had a deeper bench and a tougher D.. not even close in my eyes.. 86-87 in a landslide.. I'm not bad mouthing any lakers teams, I love them all its just I think the 86-87 team is best.. |
Shaq and Kobe would have gave the 86-87 lakers a half court nightmare with no def 3 seconds and shaq killing any center placed on him how would the 86-87 lakers run the offence they never seen the triangle as well Magic would have work fish but then he would have ran into Shaq down low. But knowing phil fish would have been put on scott and that's an even match up. 2001 lakers where the Best team in history of the lakers that was said by the late Chick hearns then David Stern said it as well Best team in NBA history... 2001 repeat lakers UNSTOPABLE!!!!! |
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nextphenom23
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Posts: 1284
Location: VA
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| Posted: Tue Aug 23, 2005 1:47 pm Post subject: |
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86-87 Lakers best team of all time excellent on D and offense.
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Billy Thompson
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| Posted: Tue Aug 23, 2005 2:12 pm Post subject: |
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| Kobedidit wrote: |
Shaq and Kobe would have gave the 86-87 lakers a half court nightmare with no def 3 seconds and shaq killing any center placed on him how would the 86-87 lakers run the offence they never seen the triangle as well Magic would have work fish but then he would have ran into Shaq down low. But knowing phil fish would have been put on scott and that's an even match up. 2001 lakers where the Best team in history of the lakers that was said by the late Chick hearns then David Stern said it as well Best team in NBA history... 2001 repeat lakers UNSTOPABLE!!!!! |
This is a good matchup...
Let's look at things from 3 perspectives: Matchups, team chemistry, and officiating.
Matchups - '87 Lakers on defense
Green guarding Shaq - uh oh. Pat Riley knows better not to have 40-year old Kareem guard Shaq. Green will need to depend on help. This will yield the same results as having Malik Rose on him -- not much.
Kareem guarding Grant - with very little offense being run through Grant, cap would be able to rest his 40-year old legs on the defensive end.
Worthy guarding Fox - since Fox doesn't generate most of his own offense, Worthy can float and jump in the passing lanes.
Scott guarding Kobe - Kobe will have a 3" advantage and should do whatever he wants.
Magic guarding Fish - just like the case with Kareem, Magic can rest on the defensive end by protecting against Fisher's deadly 3-pointer.
Situational assignments
Michael Cooper on Bryant the defensive player of the year is 6'7" and shakes off screens better than any guard in league history. Coop's leaping ability and quickness would be able to stop Kobe in key stretches.
Thompson on Shaq this is the best the 87 squad has to offer. It aint much. They may have to use Mike Smrek for an additional 6 fouls.
2001 Lakers on defense
Shaq on Kareem - Phil has no choice to but to go with this matchup since Grant must guard Worthy. Shaq can't stop the skyhook.
Fox on Green whoever guards Green only has to worry about him cutting occasionally and his mid-range jumper.
Grant on Worthy - due to Worthy's height, opposing coaches almost reguarly used a PF to guard big game james. Unfortunately for Grant, he doesn't have the quickness of his early years. Worthy will have a field day.
Kobe on Magic - although Kobe is a very effective on-the-ball defender, Magic's height advantage will be too much in the low post.
Fish on Scott - this should be a wash.
Situational matchups
Horry on Worthy - this is the 2001's best answer to big game James. Horry's is 6'10 and his feet are quicker than Grant's.
Team Chemistry
Magic, Cooper, Rambis, and Kareem have played a minimum of 5 years together with 3 championships, 5 WC championships, hundreds of season games together.
Kobe, Shaq, Fisher, Horry, and Fox have played a 4 seasons together with one championship.
Officiating
Since its no secret that refs favor superstars, consider the fact that the 1987 squad has 3 all-stars vs. only 2 for the 2001 team.
Verdict
Matchups - 1987
Chemistry - 1987
Officiating - 1987 |
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djb
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| Posted: Tue Aug 23, 2005 2:19 pm Post subject: |
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Alright... a couple things...
first, if you REALLY wanted an accurate representation of what people think is the greatest NBA team of all time, you should have added more than 2 options.
Second, this is a Lakers board. Bias is going to be heavily in favor of past Laker teams, but that doesn't necessarily mean that the Lakers had the best team ever. A strong argument could be made for the 72-10 Bulls in 96(97?), the '85-'86 Celtics team that went 40-1 at home, the Bill Russel Celtics teams, the '82-'93 Sixers, the '66-'67 Sixers, and others that i'm not thinking of right now.
3rd, The choices you gave are both arguably not even the greatest LAKER team of all time, which as many people have suggested could be the '86-'87 Lakers.
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Lakers#1Team
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| Posted: Tue Aug 23, 2005 4:20 pm Post subject: |
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Since many others have covered the showtime Lakers of 87 I will focus on the 72 Lakers team versus the 01 Lakers team.
First of all, this is all just my opinion, same as everyone else, no right or wrong answers. My answers may be wrong but they are still my opinion and I've seen them both play.
What cancels out - 01 team had a height advantage but the 72 team had better balance, a better team concept and better consistency. Also, the 01 Lakers faced bigger, more athletic teams but the 72 Lakers faced better, more consistently competitive teams that were not watered down by expansion like the 01 teams were. Also cancels out. So that leaves a comparison of how they did against their competition for that year.
Won-Loss record regular season
1972 - 69-13 (ranked 1st)
2001 - 56-26 (ranked tied for 2nd)
Advantage 1972
RPI - Relative Percent Index; the formula is 25% team winning percentage, 50% opponents's average winning percentage, and 25% opponents's opponents's average winning percentage.
1972 - .587 (1st out of 17)
2001 - .554 (2nd out of 29)
Advantage - 1972
Won-Loss record for playoffs
1972 - 12-3
2001- 15-1
Advantage 2001
Team points regular season
1972 - PPG for 121.0 (ranked 1st), against 108.7 (ranked 6th)
2001 - PPG for 100.6 (ranked 3rd), against 97.2 (ranked 23rd)
Advantage 1972
Team rebounding regular season
1972 - 4628 (ranked 1st, Wilt led league with 19.2 RPG)
2001 - 3668 (ranked 5th)
Advantage - 1972
Team assists regular season
1972 - 2232 (ranked 1st, West led league with 9.7 APG)
2001 - 1888 (ranked 9th)
Advantage - 1972
Awards
Finals MVP - 1972 - Wilt, 2001 - Shaq
(there was no DPOY, MIP or SMOY in 1972 Most likely Wilt would have been DPOY)
Advantage - EVEN
All-NBA teams
1972 - West on 1st team, Wilt on 2nd team
2001 - Shaq on 1st team, Kobe on 2nd team
Advantage - EVEN
All-Defense teams
1972 - Wilt and West on 1st team
2001 - Shaq and Kobe on 2nd team
Advantage - 1972
All-Stars that year
1972 - Wilt, West, Goodrich
2001 - Shaq, Kobe
Advantage - 1972
Scoring Balance - regular season
1972 - Starters (same starting lineup the entire season): Goodrich 25.9, West 25.8, McMillian 18.8, Wilt 14.8, Hairston 13.1
2001 - Starters: Shaq 28.7, Kobe 28.5, Fox 9.6, Grant 8.5 and a three man platoon at PG: Fisher 20 games (20 started) at 11.5, Harper 47 games (46 started) at 6.5 and Shaw 80 games (28 started) at 5.3
Advantage - 1972
Scoring Balance - post season
1972 - Starters: Goodrich 23.8, West 22.9, McMillian 19.1, Wilt 14.7, Hairston 13.5
2001 - Starters: Shaq 30.4, Kobe 29.4, Fisher 13.4, Fox 10.0, Grant 6.0
Advantage - 1972
To sum this up, the 1972 Lakers had a balanced team with 5 go-to players while the 2001 team had 2 main go-to players with Fisher sometimes a 3rd option. The 1972 team ranked 1st overall in just about all objective categories that year. The 2001 Lakers didn't lead their league, or did they lead the 1972 Lakers, in anything besides overall playoff record. I have to believe the 1972 Lakers are better than the 2001 Lakers. In a 7-game series the 2001 team may have given them a run for their money but the 1972 team would have won with their balanced scoring, consistency, defense, rebounding and assists as well as better overall team play. |
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Kobedidit
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| Posted: Wed Aug 24, 2005 6:27 am Post subject: |
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Ok we can say one thing about the 72-10 bulls they played a water down league who did they have to face? No one even from the words of ESPN they called them the 4th best... Shaq Kobe fish Fox Horry Grant dude 2001 Lakers where deep very deep with the best coach of all time come on people all this about the 86-87 Lakers Magic himself said during that playoff run (Go Grab your Lakers Dynasty DVD’s) " Non of my Lakers championship teams could match up with this team your dealing with Shaq the Best Big man ever then Kobe let alone Phil Jackson and the triangle this team is a whole different beast in itself “ Chick said it best and I will end with what he said " This is the best Lakers team that has put on the uniform best performing laker team I have seen and have almost seen them all! " I see why chick made this statement looking at whom they face in the playoffs ever team had 50 wins or more ever team was a championship team! And they sweep them all they had no room to take a night off as with other team the level of comp was hit or miss. 2001 Lakers had to face Juggernughts Blazers (all start line up) Kings All star line up (Spurs) Current champions (all star Line up)
Also one stat 2001 repeat Lakers did there repeat without any questions any! Magic baby hook game 4 in Boston changed the tempo but it was always close hey it was great we beat them in Boston but ask yourself did you know without a question we would have won that finals. 2001 Lakers no questions at all beat them all by-blow outs! So when you talk about match ups you have to look at who they played not put them against a team from the future or past look at how they beat there comp then you will see the light!. |
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Billy Thompson
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| Posted: Wed Aug 24, 2005 7:47 am Post subject: |
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| Kobedidit wrote: | | 2001 Lakers no questions at all beat them all by-blow outs! So when you talk about match ups you have to look at who they played not put them against a team from the future or past look at how they beat there comp then you will see the light!. |
You have some good points. I've got to admit -- out of all the teams I've seen over the years (including the 72-10 Bulls), I've never seen a team go on a tear like that. The closest thing I could remember is the 83 Sixers and the 89 Lakers before Byron and Magic got injured.
I still wonder if we'll see a team go 16-0 this lifetime? Either way, no one can agrue that 15-1 is impressive. |
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JRocc88
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| Posted: Wed Aug 24, 2005 11:25 am Post subject: |
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| I'm shocked that no one has mentioned that the '72 team won 33 GAMES IN A ROW. That has barely been approached since then. I don't care what day or age it is, that's pretty impressive. The '72 team gets my vote. |
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Kobedidit
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| Posted: Wed Aug 24, 2005 12:46 pm Post subject: |
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| JRocc88 wrote: | | I'm shocked that no one has mentioned that the '72 team won 33 GAMES IN A ROW. That has barely been approached since then. I don't care what day or age it is, that's pretty impressive. The '72 team gets my vote. |
Yes this is true and Thats why they are a close second or maybe even the best team ever. I mean 33 in a row is just pure dominace no matter how you look at it that 72-10 Bulls team did not do it not did the 2001 lakers plus there comp was very difficult at that time also they had wilt he could rival Shaq at this time 72 lakers are top 3 in best teams ever. Again maybe even Best team ever! But I still go with the lakers of 2001 because the way the finished there post season... You could have put your house on it they would win it all. |
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BigVeece
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| Posted: Wed Aug 24, 2005 12:51 pm Post subject: |
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according to this article, the 72 lakers are the 3rd best team ever, the 96 bulls are #2 and the 67 sixers are #1.. dont know much about that sixers team so I dont have an argument. the 2001 lakers are #8 on the list and the 87 lakers are #10..
http://msn.foxsports.com/nba/story/4802956 |
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KingKobeDubbz
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| Posted: Wed Aug 24, 2005 1:24 pm Post subject: |
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| I mean the Lakers in 200 2001 was invincible. They lost only one game before reaching the the championship ring. The game 1 in the finals where Allen Iverson tore it up. He dropped like almost 50 points and that infamous crossover jumper then stomped over Ty Lue. Other than that game , the Lakers owned the playoffs. Best record in NBA playoff history. 15-1. |
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Kobedidit
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| Posted: Fri Aug 26, 2005 9:06 am Post subject: |
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| KingKobeDubbz wrote: | | I mean the Lakers in 200 2001 was invincible. They lost only one game before reaching the the championship ring. The game 1 in the finals where Allen Iverson tore it up. He dropped like almost 50 points and that infamous crossover jumper then stomped over Ty Lue. Other than that game , the Lakers owned the playoffs. Best record in NBA playoff history. 15-1. |
yes he did but really come on now we know that game the ref's called for the 6er's lkaer had them done |
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