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Aeneas Hunter
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PostPosted: Wed Oct 13, 2021 9:08 am    Post subject:

PenG_ wrote:
My biggest fear is that we traded away our top 3 defense for an equally mediocre offense. To me, this team is a total mystery without KCP and Caruso's defensive value.


I think we'll be better than mediocre on offense, but I'm not seeing signs of an elite offense yet. But that defense . . . .
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LakerMindLA
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PostPosted: Wed Oct 13, 2021 9:12 am    Post subject:

troy wrote:
laker50 wrote:
The Westbrook trade has been a disappointment so far.

Westbrook has shown a tendency for turnovers and cannot shoot.
For a superstar this is a problem.

Pelinka has to learn to stop fixing what is not broken.
Lebron and Rondo is enough elite playmaking. Nunn adds the bench.
Westbrook was not needed.


Not at the expense of the loss of an elite defense and draft pick.
Loss of Gasol is stupid.


I agree. Why was Westbrick brought to this team? We had playmakers. We had rebounders. We needed a shooter. We could have signed a shooter. RB is NOT a shooter.


To be fair to Rob, at the time of the trade, Rondo was on the Clippers and Nunn was a restricted FA. He likely couldn’t have seen Rondo getting traded, but Nunn leaving Miami was likely.

The biggest issue is the premise that we need another creator is a flawed narrative and not the right way to maximize Lebron and extend his career.

Instead of making the game easier for him when he is on the court, we’ve made it harder by clogging the lane. When you have Lebron on the floor with WB, why would you take the ball out of hands of the best player in the game and give it to an inferior player.

Can you imagine how unstoppable Lebron would be when he is surrounded by multiple knockdown shooters?
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lakersfever714
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PostPosted: Wed Oct 13, 2021 9:21 am    Post subject:

With Rondo on the team to lead the bench unit, there's really no need for a playmaker like Westbrick to help take the load off of Lebron. You wanna help Lebron? Surround him with real shooter like Hield.

Westbrick is going to exemplify the problem of lack of outside shooting that the Lakers were experiencing. DS did not work well with Lebron. Westbrick is a just faster version of DS with worse shooting. What makes people think he's going to work? Use your brain. Yes, Rob i'm looking at you!!
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anth2000
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PostPosted: Wed Oct 13, 2021 9:42 am    Post subject:

Yep, I am trying to remain positive but not sure Westbrook was the right choice. I do love watching him run and do other things, I just don't know if he is the right guy, the right fit. I am sure he will get better....

Perhaps a smaller splash was needed in LA, not a big $40 mil per year, splash...
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PostPosted: Wed Oct 13, 2021 9:53 am    Post subject:

I'm going to stay patient with Russ, he showed some flashes for a short stint after he made a three where he made some nice passes and drilled a few jumpers in a row. Makes me think his issues right now are mental / comfort zone stuff that should come with more reps.

I think he doesn't want to come in here and come across as a ball hog but we need him to dominate or it's a waste of time. If I'm Vogel, I'm telling him to be aggressive and you live with the occasional turnover or brick.
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LakerSD
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PostPosted: Wed Oct 13, 2021 10:23 am    Post subject:

It takes some time for Russ to get going.

Happened in Houston and Washington. Last season he got off to a slow start and then basically carried the Wizards in the 2nd half.

I’m mostly worried about how slow they look as a team and the defense, particularly guys who will be hunted constantly in DJ and Melo.

It’s preseason…until it’s not…
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levon
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PostPosted: Wed Oct 13, 2021 10:28 am    Post subject:

LakerSD wrote:
It takes some time for Russ to get going.

Happened in Houston and Washington. Last season he got off to a slow start and then basically carried the Wizards in the 2nd half.

I’m mostly worried about how slow they look as a team and the defense, particularly guys who will be hunted constantly in DJ and Melo.

It’s preseason…until it’s not…

ditto. the defense can turn it on in spurts, but they can also give up the lead they built up in transition in a heartbeat. that's demoralizing after you did all that running. perhaps it's connected where the older guys lose the stamina after the run. it might require creative lineup rotations to keep everyone sharp
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PostPosted: Wed Oct 13, 2021 11:15 am    Post subject:

Couple things I know from watching Westbrook in the past is that he always play with this tenacity and goes 100%… The Westbrook we saw in the preseason is a guy trying to fit in right now and trying to figure things out. He is barely going at 75% game speed due to these preseason games are not important. He barely attacked the basket and just trying to get his team mates more involved.
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PostPosted: Wed Oct 13, 2021 11:33 am    Post subject:

LakerSD wrote:
It takes some time for Russ to get going.

Happened in Houston and Washington. Last season he got off to a slow start and then basically carried the Wizards in the 2nd half.

I’m mostly worried about how slow they look as a team and the defense, particularly guys who will be hunted constantly in DJ and Melo.

It’s preseason…until it’s not…


There's a third variant to that whole "Westbrook thing" that doesn't exactly work well with Championship contending teams.

"Oh he starts slow.. but he turns it around midway through the season and plays great."

is the first half...

"And then he plays horribly in the Playoffs and loses any of that efficiency he showed prior"

is the second half...

So even the 'full picture' of Westbrook doesn't end well in our prospects. He's gonna have to go about this season much differently if we're going to do something with this.
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PostPosted: Wed Oct 13, 2021 11:34 am    Post subject:

levon wrote:
LakerSD wrote:
It takes some time for Russ to get going.

Happened in Houston and Washington. Last season he got off to a slow start and then basically carried the Wizards in the 2nd half.

I’m mostly worried about how slow they look as a team and the defense, particularly guys who will be hunted constantly in DJ and Melo.

It’s preseason…until it’s not…

ditto. the defense can turn it on in spurts, but they can also give up the lead they built up in transition in a heartbeat. that's demoralizing after you did all that running. perhaps it's connected where the older guys lose the stamina after the run. it might require creative lineup rotations to keep everyone sharp


No doubt. This team seems to have the leaking oil issue like an old vehicle

No, but seriously I hope this inability to hold leads is not a pattern. The game today is designed where any comeback is possible.

Last season’s team had a similar issue, but difference for last season was lack of securing defensive rebounds and the embarrassing shooting.
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PostPosted: Wed Oct 13, 2021 3:14 pm    Post subject:

Aside from Davis who is going to defend?

We have some terrible defenders

Who is going to make outside shots?

LeBron is mediocre at best
Westbrook is terrible
Davis is bad

Assuming we start a center that's 4 guys that can't shoot in at once. To make things worse it's a bad defensive line up as well. LeBron and Westbrook are both high turn over guys and want the ball. How is that going to work? Thinking about it gives me anxiety.

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PostPosted: Wed Oct 13, 2021 7:44 pm    Post subject:

lakersfever714 wrote:
With Rondo on the team to lead the bench unit, there's really no need for a playmaker like Westbrick to help take the load off of Lebron. You wanna help Lebron? Surround him with real shooter like Hield.


Rondo is too old to start or play major minutes, and he only plays well once every several regular season games. It's interesting how when we resigned him in 2019 fans hated the move, but now that we brought him back the same people love the move and are making him out to be more than he is.

LeBron is going to turn 37 in a couple of months. He has way too much mileage to always handle the ball, push the pace, set the table and still score the 25-30 points a game we need from him. That's why we got Westbrook, and also why we got DS last year. We need to keep LeBron fresh throughout the season and to extend his prime as much as possible.
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PostPosted: Wed Oct 13, 2021 9:00 pm    Post subject:

You guy will still be complaining about his turnovers and shooter percentage even after winning number 18 lol...

Theirs still people bashing AD after number 17. West > Buddy... It's not even close

You can't win a championship in October. It's going to be a long season ahead, enjoy watching these guys learn how to win together. Sooner or later things will start clicking
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PostPosted: Wed Oct 13, 2021 10:10 pm    Post subject:

We can say what we will about pre-season turnovers or rust or whatever. But defensive effort like this cannot be ignored..
https://twitter.com/nonsmoknlifboat/status/1448141595698630668


This isn't a 'rust' thing... he needs to be better.. A LOT better.
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PostPosted: Thu Oct 14, 2021 4:41 am    Post subject:

Is it confirmed that when AD, Bron and Westbrook play, AD will be at the 5?

I think we're a better team on D on most nights with Howard at the 5, AD, Bron, Westbrook and a wing that can defend a little like Baze, perhaps Ellington can step up his D. Even Nunn, he seemed like he has some defensive ability but would mean we push RW to the 2.
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governator
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PostPosted: Thu Oct 14, 2021 4:50 am    Post subject:

Aeneas Hunter wrote:
governator wrote:
Brodie still playing tight, pretty obvious it’s supratentorial not physical. The more reps he get with Bron-AD and our shooters, the better he’ll be… though Vogel need to solve the Brodie defender sagging off him to double AD, make some cut plays between the two, punish this drop


I watched only the first half due to the time zone difference, but I was actually encouraged by what I saw from Westbrook. It wasn't great, but there were times when it seemed like he was getting into the flow. There were times when he didn't seem to know what to do when Lebron or Rondo had the ball, but that is fixable.


yeah, I'm optimistic but also realistic that Brodie isn't near Kyrie level as a 3rd banana. Vogel needs get him sweet spots/plays off AD-Bron and our defense need to sync in quick
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PostPosted: Thu Oct 14, 2021 8:05 am    Post subject:

governator wrote:
Aeneas Hunter wrote:
governator wrote:
Brodie still playing tight, pretty obvious it’s supratentorial not physical. The more reps he get with Bron-AD and our shooters, the better he’ll be… though Vogel need to solve the Brodie defender sagging off him to double AD, make some cut plays between the two, punish this drop


I watched only the first half due to the time zone difference, but I was actually encouraged by what I saw from Westbrook. It wasn't great, but there were times when it seemed like he was getting into the flow. There were times when he didn't seem to know what to do when Lebron or Rondo had the ball, but that is fixable.


yeah, I'm optimistic but also realistic that Brodie isn't near Kyrie level as a 3rd banana. Vogel needs get him sweet spots/plays off AD-Bron and our defense need to sync in quick


Yes we really need to get the 3 stars playing off each other instead of just taking turns in ISO's. Even AD we have two elite pick and roll ball handlers and still end up dumping him the ball at the high elbow for a stagnant ISO pull up jumper. That really shouldn't be happening.
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PostPosted: Thu Oct 14, 2021 1:21 pm    Post subject:

Lucky_Shot wrote:

You can't win a championship in October.


Correct... errr, wait a sec...
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PostPosted: Thu Oct 14, 2021 4:58 pm    Post subject:

DancingBarry wrote:
Lucky_Shot wrote:

You can't win a championship in October.


Correct... errr, wait a sec...


This lightened my mood. Good one.
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PostPosted: Thu Oct 14, 2021 6:00 pm    Post subject:

Byron Scott was trying to claim this would be a tough adjustment for Westbrook because he won’t be the top guy here. Between Durant, Harden, PG, Beal, etc, hasn’t he ALWAYS played with other stars? Byron is so disappointing.
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PostPosted: Thu Oct 14, 2021 7:31 pm    Post subject:

Treble Clef wrote:
Byron Scott was trying to claim this would be a tough adjustment for Westbrook because he won’t be the top guy here. Between Durant, Harden, PG, Beal, etc, hasn’t he ALWAYS played with other stars? Byron is so disappointing.


Byron Scott is the last person I want to hear from.
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PostPosted: Thu Oct 14, 2021 8:30 pm    Post subject:

Russ is a bully
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PostPosted: Thu Oct 14, 2021 8:47 pm    Post subject:

Westbrook played MUCH better tonight. Shot really well and had only 3 turnovers along with 3 steals.
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PostPosted: Thu Oct 14, 2021 8:48 pm    Post subject:

left two layups on the rim. could have had 22 5 3 and 3 steals in 29 minutes

only 3 three point attempts, nailed 1. like his form on the standstill jumper

loved his game today
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PostPosted: Thu Oct 14, 2021 9:09 pm    Post subject:

anth2000 wrote:
Yep, I am trying to remain positive but not sure Westbrook was the right choice. I do love watching him run and do other things, I just don't know if he is the right guy, the right fit. I am sure he will get better....

Perhaps a smaller splash was needed in LA, not a big $40 mil per year, splash...


The problem is we made a $40M splash when we still had many other pressing needs. It was irresponsible. Said this all offseason, but whatever. LeBron and AD got the guy they asked for, so I don't want to hear any excuses from them.
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