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lakers0505
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PostPosted: Wed Oct 13, 2021 8:59 am    Post subject:

lakersken80 wrote:
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I wonder who Gruden pissed off for all this to go public. This seems to be a very coordinated attack here.

That being said I don't feel bad for him either but I also am not into this faux outrage.

Especially by ESPN(who employed him for years) and the Raiders(who hired him for the second time around).

I have to admit the only shocking thing is that he is the first coach to leave this season and not Urban Meyer.

I am glad this has totally overshadowed how the Colts collapsed last night.


If I had to guess he became too powerful for somebody who wasn't an NFL owner. The NFL could've made this public or kept it in house. The fact that it went public means he probably got some enemies amongst the owners or crossed Goodell at some point.


That was my thought as well.
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PostPosted: Wed Oct 13, 2021 11:16 am    Post subject:

What's done in the dark will always come to light.

I don't think Gruden's a racist. I think he's misogynistic and homophobic. The two latter are reasons enough to expel him from the league.

I'll walk back Mark had something to do with the email leaks to save himself $60 million dollars. I walk that back because of media reports about his relationship with Gruden. He seems to have a true friendship with him.
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lakersken80
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PostPosted: Wed Oct 13, 2021 12:11 pm    Post subject:

jodeke wrote:
What's done in the dark will always come to light.

I don't think Gruden's a racist. I think he's misogynistic and homophobic. The two latter are reasons enough to expel him from the league.

I'll walk back Mark had something to do with the email leaks to save himself $60 million dollars. I walk that back because of media reports about his relationship with Gruden. He seems to have a true friendship with him.


The league apparently had the evidence and wanted the Raiders to fire him ASAP. I guess this is why they leaked the rest of the content of the other emails to the NY Times.
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PostPosted: Wed Oct 13, 2021 1:54 pm    Post subject:

lakersken80 wrote:
Basketball Fan wrote:
I wonder who Gruden pissed off for all this to go public. This seems to be a very coordinated attack here.

That being said I don't feel bad for him either but I also am not into this faux outrage.

Especially by ESPN(who employed him for years) and the Raiders(who hired him for the second time around).

I have to admit the only shocking thing is that he is the first coach to leave this season and not Urban Meyer.

I am glad this has totally overshadowed how the Colts collapsed last night.


If I had to guess he became too powerful for somebody who wasn't an NFL owner. The NFL could've made this public or kept it in house. The fact that it went public means he probably got some enemies amongst the owners or crossed Goodell at some point.


I think this as well but I'm really wondering how did he become powerful in the first place. I mean Gruden is well known but he's not iconic either.
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PostPosted: Wed Oct 13, 2021 4:00 pm    Post subject:

DeMaurice Smith discusses email trove from WFT investigation, questions whether race a factor in hiring decisions around NFL

Quote:
One of Gruden's emails included a racist comment about Smith, who is Black.

Before Gruden resigned Monday as the Raiders' head coach, Smith tweeted that the email and some of the reaction to it "confirms that the fight against racism, racist tropes and intolerance is not over. This is not about an email as much as it is about a pervasive belief by some that people who look like me can be treated as less."


https://www.espn.com/nfl/story/_/id/32395337/demaurice-smith-discusses-email-trove-wft-investigation-questions-whether-race-factor-hiring-decisions-nfl
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lakersken80
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PostPosted: Wed Oct 13, 2021 4:56 pm    Post subject:

Basketball Fan wrote:
lakersken80 wrote:
Basketball Fan wrote:
I wonder who Gruden pissed off for all this to go public. This seems to be a very coordinated attack here.

That being said I don't feel bad for him either but I also am not into this faux outrage.

Especially by ESPN(who employed him for years) and the Raiders(who hired him for the second time around).

I have to admit the only shocking thing is that he is the first coach to leave this season and not Urban Meyer.

I am glad this has totally overshadowed how the Colts collapsed last night.


If I had to guess he became too powerful for somebody who wasn't an NFL owner. The NFL could've made this public or kept it in house. The fact that it went public means he probably got some enemies amongst the owners or crossed Goodell at some point.


I think this as well but I'm really wondering how did he become powerful in the first place. I mean Gruden is well known but he's not iconic either.


Raiders were a desperate organization that needed to find success....so they hired the last coach where they were actually winning....they backed up the Brinks truck and gave him control over the personnel. I'm guessing there was only room for one Jerry Jones like character in the NFL.
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PostPosted: Thu Oct 14, 2021 9:12 am    Post subject:

jodeke wrote:
I don't think Gruden's a racist. I think he's misogynistic and homophobic. The two latter are reasons enough to expel him from the league.


I am going to speculate that the league could not field anywhere close to 32 teams if they expelled every "misogynistic and homophobic" person in the league.
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PostPosted: Thu Oct 14, 2021 9:40 am    Post subject:

adkindo wrote:
jodeke wrote:
I don't think Gruden's a racist. I think he's misogynistic and homophobic. The two latter are reasons enough to expel him from the league.


I am going to speculate that the league could not field anywhere close to 32 teams if they expelled every "misogynistic and homophobic" person in the league.



It wasn't a racist action but rather racist trope. There is a distinction as the Players Union was threatening to take Chucky's football away, so he resorted to childish name calling. He may not necessarily be racist in action but he is definitely homophobic.

The racist trope has three severely negative repercussions:

First most of his team (like most NFL teams) is composed of black athletes, and likely a measure of sympathetic athletes of other races. That explains the dispirited performance during their last game. Chucky lost the locker room.

Second, The Raiders are a private enterprise, part of a franchise (NFL). Both can do what they please, but they too face consequences for their actions. Most of the revenue for the NFL is generated from advertisers who in turn sell products to the general public. If the Raiders or NFL tacitly accept Gruden’s racist and homophobic slurs, people will boycott the product (viewership) and the products of the advertising sponsors.

Third, Raiders need to keep their own free agents and attract free agents. Retaining a coach accused of racism will have negative effect on signing free agents.

Chucky had to go, but that won't be the end of him. There's already a damage control campaign that is intended to repair the damage, and in the many months ahead I'm sure we'll hear about Chucky doing good deeds to disadvantaged black youth. It might take two or more years, but my money is on Chucky finding his way back due to good deeds and some PR-fluff around him becoming a more sensitive, caring and aware human being.
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PostPosted: Thu Oct 14, 2021 10:45 am    Post subject:

adkindo wrote:
jodeke wrote:
I don't think Gruden's a racist. I think he's misogynistic and homophobic. The two latter are reasons enough to expel him from the league.


I am going to speculate that the league could not field anywhere close to 32 teams if they expelled every "misogynistic and homophobic" person in the league.

That could apply to many businesses. It's a societal plague. In some segments women, gays, minorities are considered less than.
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panamaniac
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PostPosted: Thu Oct 14, 2021 11:28 am    Post subject:

Seems like the NFL and the Raiders dropped just enough bread crumbs to give Chucky the axe. He was making a lot of money and the team was not winning. He needed to go, not because he’s less than decent but rather because he was not returning enough for the teams investment. This closure feels fabricated and anti climactic. And unless they continue digging deep on these “emails” I will continue to call BS on them. This reminds me of the Harvey Weinstein situation, when Hollywood cancelled him and then turned around and patted themselves on the back for a job well done. I’m sure there are plenty more Harvey Weinsteins out there, but he became the poster child and the scapegoat, because they’re terrified of looking themselves in the mirror and truly have to make amends. Goodell will do the same, open and shut case, quick fix. Then start a hashtag or something about having ended racism. But at some point that methodology will come back to bite them. You can’t keep putting band aids on a shotgun wound.

Last edited by panamaniac on Thu Oct 14, 2021 11:51 am; edited 1 time in total
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lakersken80
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PostPosted: Thu Oct 14, 2021 11:39 am    Post subject:

panamaniac wrote:
Seems like the NFL and the Raiders dropped just enough bread crumbs to give Chucky the axe. He was making a lot of money and the team was not winning. He needed to go, not because he’s less than decent but rather because he was not returning enough for the teams investment. This closure feels fabricated and anti climactic. And unless they continue digging deep on these “emails” I will continue to call BS on them. This reminds me of the Harvey Weinstein situation, when Hollywood cancelled him and then turned around and patted themselves on the back for a job well done. I’m sure there are plenty more Harvey Weinsteins out there, but he became the poster child and the scapegoat, because they’re terrified of looking themselves in the mirror and truly have to make amends. Goodell will do the same, open and shut case, quick fix. Then start a hashtag or something about having ended racism. But at some pint that methodology will come back to bite them. You can’t keep putting band aids on a shotgun wound.


I'm close to your line of thinking. I think Gruden was a sacrificial lamb. He wasn't an NFL owner. He was was a coach and GM and probably somebody who could be sacrificed to distract from the bigger issues. Remember the investigation was about the Washington NFL team and Gruden just happened to correspond to somebody within the organization.
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PostPosted: Thu Oct 14, 2021 11:46 am    Post subject:

panamaniac wrote:
Seems like the NFL and the Raiders dropped just enough bread crumbs to give Chucky the axe. He was making a lot of money and the team was not winning. He needed to go, not because he’s less than decent but rather because he was not returning enough for the teams investment. This closure feels fabricated and anti climactic. And unless they continue digging deep on these “emails” I will continue to call BS on them. This reminds me of the Harvey Weinstein situation, when Hollywood cancelled him and then turned around and patted themselves on the back for a job well done. I’m sure there are plenty more Harvey Weinsteins out there, but he became the poster child and the scapegoat, because they’re terrified of looking themselves in the mirror and truly have to make amends. Goodell will do the same, open and shut case, quick fix. Then start a hashtag or something about having ended racism. But at some pint that methodology will come back to bite them. You can’t keep putting band aids on a shotgun wound.


Gruden, Weinstein, Cosby, one at a time as they surface. You know the blight exists you should also know it's impossible to out all. Confront them when they come to light.
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PostPosted: Thu Oct 14, 2021 4:33 pm    Post subject:

Brady looked good on opening drive.
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PostPosted: Thu Oct 14, 2021 4:41 pm    Post subject:

Richard Sherman to the locker room. There is no reason for the Eagles to call a running play in this game unless it's the QB or unless they are up late and can run out the clock. Not even kidding.
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PostPosted: Thu Oct 14, 2021 4:45 pm    Post subject:

The underthrown deep ball / pass interference call is just the worst call in football. The defender often gets hit with a penalty when he is actually in good position, but the receiver has to come back through him to get to ball. I have always hated the call because it is often unavoidable by the defender.
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PostPosted: Thu Oct 14, 2021 4:46 pm    Post subject:

ChickenStu wrote:
Richard Sherman to the locker room.


done for the night....hamstring
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PostPosted: Thu Oct 14, 2021 5:05 pm    Post subject:

there are cancel terry bradshaw calls. Apparently he called Erin Andrews hot.
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lakersken80
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PostPosted: Thu Oct 14, 2021 6:23 pm    Post subject:

Eagles are a bad team.
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PostPosted: Thu Oct 14, 2021 7:17 pm    Post subject:

Leftwich always seems to turn off the offense too early...
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lakersken80
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PostPosted: Thu Oct 14, 2021 7:23 pm    Post subject:

Final score is deceiving, the Eagles were never really in this game until the last series.
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PostPosted: Thu Oct 14, 2021 7:54 pm    Post subject:

Bucs were playing to not lose rather than playing to win. My eyeballs are bleeding.
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panamaniac
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PostPosted: Thu Oct 14, 2021 9:13 pm    Post subject:

I like Jalen Hurts, but man Philly sucks.
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PostPosted: Fri Oct 15, 2021 2:17 am    Post subject:

Sirianni and the new coaching staff must HATE Miles Sanders. Honestly, the way they are using him, they should just trade him to a RB-needy team.

Brady is ageless. His arm strength is still where it needs to be to make all the throws, and that's the most surprising part. I'm not surprised about the touch, the pocket presence and nuance, and, yes, he has elite weaponry. Starting with AB. He basically looks like the AB of old. He's clearly their best WR and I don't think it's particularly close. He looks uncoverable again on tape. They are just really, really thin in the secondary right now. They are probably good enough to hold the fort until later in the season when they get some reinforcements back, and I do wonder if they are willing to trade a relatively high draft pick for another CB. They couldn't get Gilmore, but I'm sure others will become available. Heck, maybe even Darius Slay, who of course played against the Bucs last night. You have to wonder if Miami makes Xavien Howard or Byron Jones available if their season goes into the tank. Maybe Xavier Rhodes if he's healthy and if Indy's season goes down the drain, and Indy could want to recoup some draft capital after the deal for Wentz. Perhaps Casey Hayward if the Raiders go into a tailspin after the coaching change and that fallout.
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PostPosted: Fri Oct 15, 2021 7:57 am    Post subject:

angrypuppy wrote:
Bucs were playing to not lose rather than playing to win. My eyeballs are bleeding.


They didn't cover the 7 and cost me a significant bet.
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PostPosted: Fri Oct 15, 2021 12:22 pm    Post subject:

ChickenStu wrote:
Sirianni and the new coaching staff must HATE Miles Sanders. Honestly, the way they are using him, they should just trade him to a RB-needy team.

Brady is ageless. His arm strength is still where it needs to be to make all the throws, and that's the most surprising part. I'm not surprised about the touch, the pocket presence and nuance, and, yes, he has elite weaponry. Starting with AB. He basically looks like the AB of old. He's clearly their best WR and I don't think it's particularly close. He looks uncoverable again on tape. They are just really, really thin in the secondary right now. They are probably good enough to hold the fort until later in the season when they get some reinforcements back, and I do wonder if they are willing to trade a relatively high draft pick for another CB. They couldn't get Gilmore, but I'm sure others will become available. Heck, maybe even Darius Slay, who of course played against the Bucs last night. You have to wonder if Miami makes Xavien Howard or Byron Jones available if their season goes into the tank. Maybe Xavier Rhodes if he's healthy and if Indy's season goes down the drain, and Indy could want to recoup some draft capital after the deal for Wentz. Perhaps Casey Hayward if the Raiders go into a tailspin after the coaching change and that fallout.



Good points, I've thought the same. Antonio Brown is the true WR1 over in Tampa Bay and it isn't even close. He runs great routes, and he shares this mental connection with Brady which allows them to improvise. That Super Bowl TD wasn't even part of a route, they simply saw the same opportunity and grabbed it in a split second. Brown gets more separation that either Evans or Godwin and has great hands. He's lost little since leaving Pittsburgh.

The Bucs desperately need at least one, possibly two CBs. As you know I was highly critical of the Buc GM Licht at taking Kyle Trask with the second pick rather than a CB. Even then they could have taken a CB in the third, fourth, fifth or sixth rounds. They waited until the seventh round which is a haven for practice squad or special teams players.

My preference would be Slay. I would imagine he's available since Phili just jettisoned Ertz. I don't think it would take much to dislodge him, maybe a fourth round pick as Slay's contract dramatically increases next season. On that note whether it's Slay or someone else, the Bucs should let Godwin walk in the offseason and use the money to find a permanent solution at CB. Godwin is pretty damn good but he's underutilized. That means both more money and more reliance on AB, but you cannot have everything.

They don't have the cap space for Xavien Howard or Byron Jones, not that I as a fan would want either one. Howard is a malcontent and quite possibly insane, while Jones is horrifically overpaid for what he is.
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