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DaMuleRules
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 Posted: Wed Jan 19, 2022 2:18 pm Post subject: |
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| DancingBarry wrote: | | ChefLinda wrote: | ¯\_(ツ)_/¯
I knew when Trump started publicly being "pro-vaccine" that his motive was selfish - because he realized it was killing mostly his voters. |
Yeah, it's what immediately went to my mind.
So maybe he's already lost 36K advantage or so from swing states already? By the time the election rolls around who knows how many? Better start working on those dead voter schemes. |
Unfortunately, without the voting rights act and given all the voter suppression efforts being taken in swing states etc., the die off Trump voters may not matter much.
_________________
You thought God was an architect, now you know
He’s something like a pipe bomb ready to blow
And everything you built that’s all for show
goes up in flames
In 24 frames
Jason Isbell
Man, do those lyrics resonate right now |
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kikanga
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| Posted: Wed Jan 19, 2022 3:56 pm Post subject: |
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| DaMuleRules wrote: | | DancingBarry wrote: | | ChefLinda wrote: | ¯\_(ツ)_/¯
I knew when Trump started publicly being "pro-vaccine" that his motive was selfish - because he realized it was killing mostly his voters. |
Yeah, it's what immediately went to my mind.
So maybe he's already lost 36K advantage or so from swing states already? By the time the election rolls around who knows how many? Better start working on those dead voter schemes. |
Unfortunately, without the voting rights act and given all the voter suppression efforts being taken in swing states etc., the die off Trump voters may not matter much. |
"We" as a party (not blaming Biden) need to do more to combat this.
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DaMuleRules
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| Posted: Wed Jan 19, 2022 4:24 pm Post subject: |
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| kikanga wrote: | | DaMuleRules wrote: | | DancingBarry wrote: | | ChefLinda wrote: | ¯\_(ツ)_/¯
I knew when Trump started publicly being "pro-vaccine" that his motive was selfish - because he realized it was killing mostly his voters. |
Yeah, it's what immediately went to my mind.
So maybe he's already lost 36K advantage or so from swing states already? By the time the election rolls around who knows how many? Better start working on those dead voter schemes. |
Unfortunately, without the voting rights act and given all the voter suppression efforts being taken in swing states etc., the die off Trump voters may not matter much. |
"We" as a party (not blaming Biden) need to do more to combat this. |
Yeah, and I am still waiting for your explanation of exactly who "we" (as a party) are and what "we" are supposed to do to combat this stuff . . . 
_________________
You thought God was an architect, now you know
He’s something like a pipe bomb ready to blow
And everything you built that’s all for show
goes up in flames
In 24 frames
Jason Isbell
Man, do those lyrics resonate right now |
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Halflife
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| Posted: Wed Jan 19, 2022 6:45 pm Post subject: |
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| DaMuleRules wrote: | | DancingBarry wrote: | | ChefLinda wrote: | ¯\_(ツ)_/¯
I knew when Trump started publicly being "pro-vaccine" that his motive was selfish - because he realized it was killing mostly his voters. |
Yeah, it's what immediately went to my mind.
So maybe he's already lost 36K advantage or so from swing states already? By the time the election rolls around who knows how many? Better start working on those dead voter schemes. |
Unfortunately, without the voting rights act and given all the voter suppression efforts being taken in swing states etc., the die off Trump voters may not matter much. |
if people care. they will vote. if people vote GOP shouldn't win. Regardless of suppression. They can not stop the vote they can only make it difficult. we will see if people care. Unfortunately for Joe, the issues of the country outside of mandates were caused by trump. Also unfortunately for Joe they are on his watch.
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kikanga
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| Posted: Wed Jan 19, 2022 6:53 pm Post subject: |
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| DaMuleRules wrote: | | kikanga wrote: | | DaMuleRules wrote: | | DancingBarry wrote: | | ChefLinda wrote: | ¯\_(ツ)_/¯
I knew when Trump started publicly being "pro-vaccine" that his motive was selfish - because he realized it was killing mostly his voters. |
Yeah, it's what immediately went to my mind.
So maybe he's already lost 36K advantage or so from swing states already? By the time the election rolls around who knows how many? Better start working on those dead voter schemes. |
Unfortunately, without the voting rights act and given all the voter suppression efforts being taken in swing states etc., the die off Trump voters may not matter much. |
"We" as a party (not blaming Biden) need to do more to combat this. |
Yeah, and I am still waiting for your explanation of exactly who "we" (as a party) are and what "we" are supposed to do to combat this stuff . . . |
You answered your own question.
You're fighting a mirror. I'm agreeing with your post.
I acknowledged from jump I was acknowledging a problem and not proposing a solution. That still wasn't enough for you.
Anything less than "we are perfect" is unacceptable for your current train of thought.
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Last edited by kikanga on Wed Jan 19, 2022 6:56 pm; edited 1 time in total |
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DaMuleRules
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| Posted: Wed Jan 19, 2022 6:55 pm Post subject: |
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| Halflife wrote: | (Quotes trimmed for space)
if people care. they will vote. if people vote GOP shouldn't win. Regardless of suppression. They can not stop the vote they can only make it difficult. we will see if people care. Unfortunately for Joe, the issues of the country outside of mandates were caused by trump. Also unfortunately for Joe they are on his watch. |
The problem is, they aren't just making it "difficult", the GOP in states like Georgia and Arizona are making it virtually impossible by installing logistical roadblocks. On top of that, the efforts to make voting results actually overturned mean even if people manage to overcome the suppression, it won't matter.
_________________
You thought God was an architect, now you know
He’s something like a pipe bomb ready to blow
And everything you built that’s all for show
goes up in flames
In 24 frames
Jason Isbell
Man, do those lyrics resonate right now |
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kikanga
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| Posted: Wed Jan 19, 2022 7:06 pm Post subject: |
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DMR.
I'll vote Dem till I die. (like I have since age 18). And I'll encourage everyone I know, to do the same. Know that going into this convo.
Hypothetically, if a group of people hire me. I say I'll do the job. And I don't. Then that group fires me and hires someone else. And they hire someone else even worse.
Is it the the fault of the subgroup who wanted me in the first place (for not fighting hard enough to keep me)?
Is it my fault for not doing what I promised?
Where does the blame go?
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"Every hurt is a lesson, and every lesson makes you better”
Last edited by kikanga on Wed Jan 19, 2022 7:12 pm; edited 1 time in total |
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DaMuleRules
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| Posted: Wed Jan 19, 2022 7:10 pm Post subject: |
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| kikanga wrote: | | DaMuleRules wrote: | | kikanga wrote: | | "We" as a party (not blaming Biden) need to do more to combat this. |
Yeah, and I am still waiting for your explanation of exactly who "we" (as a party) are and what "we" are supposed to do to combat this stuff . . . |
You answered your own question.
You're fighting a mirror. I'm agreeing with your post.
I acknowledged from jump I was acknowledging a problem and not proposing a solution. That still wasn't enough for you.
Anything less than "we are perfect" is unacceptable for your current train of thought. |
You obviously are not following my train of thought, because that could not be a less accurate description of the discussion. What I am talking about has nothing to do with an expectation nor claim of perfection. You keep repeating criticisms of the Dems and the administration of not doing enough or the right things to combat the GOP efforts to sway the upcoming elections.
I'm simply asking, given your criticisms, what you believe the Dem leaders should be doing and how those things would be effective.
_________________
You thought God was an architect, now you know
He’s something like a pipe bomb ready to blow
And everything you built that’s all for show
goes up in flames
In 24 frames
Jason Isbell
Man, do those lyrics resonate right now |
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kikanga
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| Posted: Wed Jan 19, 2022 7:14 pm Post subject: |
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| DaMuleRules wrote: |
I'm simply asking, given your criticisms, what you believe the Dem leaders should be doing and how those things would be effective. |
This is a far jump from where we were when we discussed this a week ago, and you were convinced I was blaming Biden despite explicitly saying I wasn't.
Okay, if that's the question you want answered.
I wouldn't have promised voting rights reform in the first place. We overpromised and underdelivered.
Without the overpromising, actually what we accomplished in the bipartisan infrastructure deal is epic. But when everyone has in their mind Build Back Better as well. Politically, we set ourselves up for disappointing our voters. And I don't blame them for being disappointed.
And TO ME it feels like you are blaming people (not just "progressives" in actuality) for being disappointed and reflecting that in Biden's approval rating. Because you believe they aren't being realistic/pragmatic. Completely ignoring the promises not being kept part of the equation.
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DaMuleRules
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| Posted: Wed Jan 19, 2022 7:27 pm Post subject: |
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Here's an interesting quote from the NY Time's columnist Bret Stephens:
Biden's performance thus far is sometimes compared to Jimmy Carter's. Maybe a better source of comparison is Bill Clinton, who ran as a centrist, tilted left in his first year, saw his signature legislation blow up in Congress, suffered military humiliation in Somalia - and figured out how to recapture the center and save his presidency".
Now, I don't think it will be as easy as that for Biden if he is able to make that kind of adjustment, because let's face it, there really isn't a "center" in the type of way there was almost 30 years ago, but it is a hint at a strategy moving forward.
_________________
You thought God was an architect, now you know
He’s something like a pipe bomb ready to blow
And everything you built that’s all for show
goes up in flames
In 24 frames
Jason Isbell
Man, do those lyrics resonate right now
Last edited by DaMuleRules on Wed Jan 19, 2022 7:48 pm; edited 1 time in total |
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Halflife
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| Posted: Wed Jan 19, 2022 7:38 pm Post subject: |
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| DaMuleRules wrote: | Here's an interesting quote from the NY Time's columnist Bret Stephens:
Biden's performance thus far is sometimes compared to Jimmy Carter's. Maybe a better source of comparison is Bill Clinton, who ran as a centrist, tilted left in his first year, saw his signature legislation blow up in Congress, suffered military humiliation in Somalia - and figured out how to recapture the center and save his presidency".
Now, I don't think it will be as that for Biden if he is able to make that kind of adjustment, because let's face it, there really isn't a "center" in the type of way there was almost 30 years ago, but it is a hint at a strategy moving forward. |
Or tech boom.
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Halflife
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| Posted: Wed Jan 19, 2022 7:42 pm Post subject: |
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| DaMuleRules wrote: | | Halflife wrote: | (Quotes trimmed for space)
if people care. they will vote. if people vote GOP shouldn't win. Regardless of suppression. They can not stop the vote they can only make it difficult. we will see if people care. Unfortunately for Joe, the issues of the country outside of mandates were caused by trump. Also unfortunately for Joe they are on his watch. |
The problem is, they aren't just making it "difficult", the GOP in states like Georgia and Arizona are making it virtually impossible by installing logistical roadblocks. On top of that, the efforts to make voting results actually overturned mean even if people manage to overcome the suppression, it won't matter. |
we are seeing it fla right now. A dem slaughtered a gop and he isn’t accepting results. However reality hits. Dems just have to worry about voting.
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adkindo
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| Posted: Wed Jan 19, 2022 7:44 pm Post subject: |
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| DaMuleRules wrote: | Here's an interesting quote from the NY Time's columnist Bret Stephens:
Biden's performance thus far is sometimes compared to Jimmy Carter's. Maybe a better source of comparison is Bill Clinton, who ran as a centrist, tilted left in his first year, saw his signature legislation blow up in Congress, suffered military humiliation in Somalia - and figured out how to recapture the center and save his presidency".
Now, I don't think it will be as that for Biden if he is able to make that kind of adjustment, because let's face it, there really isn't a "center" in the type of way there was almost 30 years ago, but it is a hint at a strategy moving forward. |
I have been making this comp for weeks...not really in regards to Somalia, but Clinton came into office with 43% of the vote and swung for the fences with universal healthcare. It failed in spectacular fashion and his party was destroyed in the mid-terms. Clinton pivoted away from his more left wing in house advisors like Chief of Staff Leon Panetta (yes, he was considered "far" left in 1994) and brought back Dick Morris who advised him as Governor.....and it turned around his presidency. |
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DaMuleRules
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| Posted: Wed Jan 19, 2022 7:46 pm Post subject: |
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| kikanga wrote: | DMR.
I'll vote Dem till I die. (like I have since age 18). And I'll encourage everyone I know, to do the same. Know that going into this convo.
Hypothetically, if a group of people hire me. I say I'll do the job. And I don't. Then that group fires me and hires someone else. And they hire someone else even worse.
Is it the the fault of the subgroup who wanted me in the first place (for not fighting hard enough to keep me)?
Is it my fault for not doing what I promised?
Where does the blame go? |
You say you aren't blaming Biden, yet this hypothetical is completely based on the person in question (you/Biden) "not doing the job", which is based on the assertion that people's perception of how that job is being done is an accurate or reasonable depiction of what was actually accomplished and the circumstances behind it.
_________________
You thought God was an architect, now you know
He’s something like a pipe bomb ready to blow
And everything you built that’s all for show
goes up in flames
In 24 frames
Jason Isbell
Man, do those lyrics resonate right now |
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trmiv
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| Posted: Wed Jan 19, 2022 8:03 pm Post subject: |
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| (bleep) Joe Manchin and (bleep) Kyrsten Sinema. |
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kikanga
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| Posted: Wed Jan 19, 2022 8:11 pm Post subject: |
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| DaMuleRules wrote: | | kikanga wrote: | DMR.
I'll vote Dem till I die. (like I have since age 18). And I'll encourage everyone I know, to do the same. Know that going into this convo.
Hypothetically, if a group of people hire me. I say I'll do the job. And I don't. Then that group fires me and hires someone else. And they hire someone else even worse.
Is it the the fault of the subgroup who wanted me in the first place (for not fighting hard enough to keep me)?
Is it my fault for not doing what I promised?
Where does the blame go? |
You say you aren't blaming Biden, yet this hypothetical is completely based on the person in question (you/Biden) "not doing the job", which is based on the assertion that people's perception of how that job is being done is an accurate or reasonable depiction of what was actually accomplished and the circumstances behind it. |
1) You didn't answer my post.
2) You know the 2022 midterms come before the 2024 Presidential re-election campaign. And honestly, they are more important than the former.
Stop bringing this back to Biden. You know as much as I. Biden didn't fail. Manchin, Sinema, and many other members of the party are ahead of him in lime when it comes to assigning him blame.
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kikanga
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| Posted: Wed Jan 19, 2022 8:17 pm Post subject: |
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| DaMuleRules wrote: | | kikanga wrote: | DMR.
I'll vote Dem till I die. (like I have since age 18). And I'll encourage everyone I know, to do the same. Know that going into this convo.
Hypothetically, if a group of people hire me. I say I'll do the job. And I don't. Then that group fires me and hires someone else. And they hire someone else even worse.
Is it the the fault of the subgroup who wanted me in the first place (for not fighting hard enough to keep me)?
Is it my fault for not doing what I promised?
Where does the blame go? |
You say you aren't blaming Biden, yet this hypothetical is completely based on the person in question (you/Biden) "not doing the job", which is based on the assertion that people's perception of how that job is being done is an accurate or reasonable depiction of what was actually accomplished and the circumstances behind it. |
1) You didn't answer my post.
2) You know the 2022 midterms come before the 2024 Presidential re-election campaign. And honestly, considering the anti-democratic, fascistic machinations of the R party. The midterms are more important than 2024.
I'm just trying to simplify to a person just to make it easier. Me in this metaphor is the Democratic party having control of the legislative and executive branches (the combination needed to make legislation)
Only reason I brought up Biden's approval rating was so we can all agree on the bolded. Us. As a party. The Democratic party. Is behind right now. Going into 2022.
Us. As a party. Promised things in 2020, that weren't delivered and chances are we'll have less power after midterms than we do now.
Agreeing on that, can you answer my original hypothetical post.
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SweetP
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| Posted: Wed Jan 19, 2022 9:22 pm Post subject: |
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Mitch McConnell: "African-American voters are voting in just as high a percentage as American voters."
Just say it you old racist, American = White.
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adkindo
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| Posted: Thu Jan 20, 2022 1:03 am Post subject: |
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| trmiv wrote: | | (bleep) Joe Manchin and (bleep) Kyrsten Sinema. |
In regards to Manchin, is he not supposed to represent his constituents that elected him? I understand why Democrats are not pleased they are short votes, but polling in WV has illustrated that his positions are overwhelmingly supported by WV voters. It is a catch 22....while he is far more moderate than most current Senators in his party, he is the only Democrat that can win in WV. He is the reason Democrats are currently in power in the Senate.
I have seen the same thing on the Republican side for....ever. The more conservative voters claim to wish Senators like Olympia Snowe (former), Susan Collins and other moderate Republicans would lose or become a Democrat. I do not get it because no other Republican was going to win their seats, and it would simply be a case of cutting off ones nose to spite their face.
I have recently wondered if Manchin, Sinema, Tester, Collins, Murkowski and a few others could walk away to form a moderate 3rd party. Could they pull up to around 10 Senators into this new party affiliation? I do not mean identify as a 3rd party and caucus with one of the other two parties.....but actually caucus as a separate 3rd party. I can think of no other time that the chances to actually create a 3rd party have been higher because I do believe that the only way a legit 3rd party could happen would be with currently elected members of Congress. It would be the only way to give it enough legitimacy and foundation to survive. I know the chances of that happening are probably less than 1%, but talk about legacy for the history books. While it would not have majority type power anytime in the near future, it would be very powerful. |
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governator
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| Posted: Thu Jan 20, 2022 5:54 am Post subject: |
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| SweetP wrote: | Mitch McConnell: "African-American voters are voting in just as high a percentage as American voters."
Just say it you old racist, American = White. |
You missed the second part of the quote: "So we need to rectify that" |
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governator
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| Posted: Thu Jan 20, 2022 5:56 am Post subject: |
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| adkindo wrote: | | trmiv wrote: | | (bleep) Joe Manchin and (bleep) Kyrsten Sinema. |
In regards to Manchin, is he not supposed to represent his constituents that elected him? I understand why Democrats are not pleased they are short votes, but polling in WV has illustrated that his positions are overwhelmingly supported by WV voters. It is a catch 22....while he is far more moderate than most current Senators in his party, he is the only Democrat that can win in WV. He is the reason Democrats are currently in power in the Senate.
I have seen the same thing on the Republican side for....ever. The more conservative voters claim to wish Senators like Olympia Snowe (former), Susan Collins and other moderate Republicans would lose or become a Democrat. I do not get it because no other Republican was going to win their seats, and it would simply be a case of cutting off ones nose to spite their face.
I have recently wondered if Manchin, Sinema, Tester, Collins, Murkowski and a few others could walk away to form a moderate 3rd party. Could they pull up to around 10 Senators into this new party affiliation? I do not mean identify as a 3rd party and caucus with one of the other two parties.....but actually caucus as a separate 3rd party. I can think of no other time that the chances to actually create a 3rd party have been higher because I do believe that the only way a legit 3rd party could happen would be with currently elected members of Congress. It would be the only way to give it enough legitimacy and foundation to survive. I know the chances of that happening are probably less than 1%, but talk about legacy for the history books. While it would not have majority type power anytime in the near future, it would be very powerful. |
Suspect that majority of those 52 nays doesn't represent their constituent interest/desire |
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DaMuleRules
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| Posted: Thu Jan 20, 2022 7:39 am Post subject: |
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| kikanga wrote: | 1) You didn't answer my post.
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Because I haven’t had time to do so properly, but will when I do.
_________________
You thought God was an architect, now you know
He’s something like a pipe bomb ready to blow
And everything you built that’s all for show
goes up in flames
In 24 frames
Jason Isbell
Man, do those lyrics resonate right now |
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governator
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32
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| Posted: Thu Jan 20, 2022 10:20 am Post subject: |
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| Quote: | | Fulton County DA requests special grand jury to probe Trump's election interference |
https://twitter.com/Acosta/status/1484218985478594563
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