He knew it would be a short window with Lebron, so yeah, he's gonna throw hail marys. Wouldn't even surprise me if THT is the next one gone. It's pretty much all about Lebron.
If it were "all about Lebron" we would've paid Caruso.
*shrugs*
THT is part of the Klutch though and that arguably played some role. Hindsight is 20/20. Seems like lots of people here were on board with THT's potential, myself included. It made sense to find some way to keep him, but not at the expense of Caruso. Tough move by Rob.
which other team was linked to THT?
Rob should have paid Alex around 8 and THT around 4 but Klutch's Errand boy paid 9.5 to tht who is basically useless on this team with Bron/Westbrook handling the ball
Pelinka learned nothing last year...trading away defensive center in Howard for Harrell... who couldn't guard anyone.
Now this year, Pelinka does it again by trading away our defensive backcourt, Caruso, KCP and bringing in Nunn, Monk, Ellington, etc.
Right now, the worst teams in the league are roasting us from the perimeter.
If this is the best we can expect from Pelinka... he needs to go.
Vogel is not the biggest problem.
The only way the Lakers have a shot this season, is if they makes some trades and bring in some perimeter defense...otherwise...they're screwed again. _________________ A three headed monster... Jeannie, Pelinka, and Ham... another terrible season.
Meanwhile, Jeanie watches on clueless. The fact that she still hasn't fired Rob shows she has no idea how to run a basketball team. I wonder if there's anyone she goes to for advice, other than her bestie Linda.
Meanwhile, Jeanie watches on clueless. The fact that she still hasn't fired Rob shows she has no idea how to run a basketball team. I wonder if there's anyone she goes to for advice, other than her bestie Linda.
Even if you think that firing Pelinka is a good idea, doing it right now would be pointless. _________________ Internet Argument Resolved
Meanwhile, Jeanie watches on clueless. The fact that she still hasn't fired Rob shows she has no idea how to run a basketball team. I wonder if there's anyone she goes to for advice, other than her bestie Linda.
He knew it would be a short window with Lebron, so yeah, he's gonna throw hail marys. Wouldn't even surprise me if THT is the next one gone. It's pretty much all about Lebron.
If it were "all about Lebron" we would've paid Caruso.
*shrugs*
THT is part of the Klutch though and that arguably played some role. Hindsight is 20/20. Seems like lots of people here were on board with THT's potential, myself included. It made sense to find some way to keep him, but not at the expense of Caruso. Tough move by Rob.
Yeah I mean he's one of a few valuable long term assets for the Lakers, and I don't understand why fans want to trade him at this point. Do people not see how bad this team is right now? What trade package would justify offloading any remaining assets?
Meanwhile, Jeanie watches on clueless. The fact that she still hasn't fired Rob shows she has no idea how to run a basketball team. I wonder if there's anyone she goes to for advice, other than her bestie Linda.
Even if you think that firing Pelinka is a good idea, doing it right now would be pointless.
So you would rather have Pelinka make more personnel changes prior to the trade deadline after what he's done to the roster this offseason?
Meanwhile, Jeanie watches on clueless. The fact that she still hasn't fired Rob shows she has no idea how to run a basketball team. I wonder if there's anyone she goes to for advice, other than her bestie Linda.
Even if you think that firing Pelinka is a good idea, doing it right now would be pointless.
So you would rather have Pelinka make more personnel changes prior to the trade deadline after what he's done to the roster this offseason?
dont like the owner
dont like the GM
dont like the coach
dont like the players
Meanwhile, Jeanie watches on clueless. The fact that she still hasn't fired Rob shows she has no idea how to run a basketball team. I wonder if there's anyone she goes to for advice, other than her bestie Linda.
Even if you think that firing Pelinka is a good idea, doing it right now would be pointless.
So you would rather have Pelinka make more personnel changes prior to the trade deadline after what he's done to the roster this offseason?
I think it's unlikely that there are going to be significant personnel changes prior to the trade deadline. We might look at trading THT, but that's about it. It's more likely that we'll be looking at the buyout market, which means giving a vet min contract to some castoff.
More importantly, if you think that we should fire Pelinka, then you presumably think that we should hire a new GM with some credentials. People like that generally aren't available at mid-season. I mean, we could bring in Phil Jackson or Isiah Thomas or Joe Dumars (I say this with tongue in cheek), but if you want a real upgrade, the good candidates won't be available until the summer. _________________ Internet Argument Resolved
THT is part of the Klutch though and that arguably played some role. Hindsight is 20/20. Seems like lots of people here were on board with THT's potential, myself included. It made sense to find some way to keep him, but not at the expense of Caruso. Tough move by Rob.
Yeah I mean he's one of a few valuable long term assets for the Lakers, and I don't understand why fans want to trade him at this point. Do people not see how bad this team is right now? What trade package would justify offloading any remaining assets?
Why? Because this season is not going well and the flaws in the roster construction are glaring. THT is the only trade asset that we might be able to use to address the problem. However, it is not clear how much other teams value him, especially now that we gave him an overpriced contract as a Team Lebron premium. He may have upside, but he also costs $10M/year.
What trade package? That's the problem. Even if another team values THT, Pelinka has not shown himself to be much of a negotiator. To get anything useful, we'd probably need to throw in all of our remaining draft assets and a few of the Laker Girls. This is why I think that we're more likely to see action during buyout season. _________________ Internet Argument Resolved
Joined: 07 May 2014 Posts: 13823 Location: Boulder ;)
Posted: Sun Dec 05, 2021 9:58 am Post subject:
How does GSW fill its roster with quality players
Why do we have 3 superstar contracts on our team
3 players takeup OVER ONE HUNDRED AND 20 MILLION DOLLARS
3 players
Bron 2021-22 Contract details by year 36 $41,180,544
AD 2021-22 Contract details by year 28 $35,361,360
RW 2021-22 Contract details by year 32 $44,211,146
How did Russell Westbrook make us better
We signed him because extending him didn't cost us taxes?
130 million next year..... for 3 players
I feel tricked.. expecting THT to become something useful.. while we watch Kuz and AC doing great.. this dude looks (bleep) clueless
Joined: 24 Dec 2007 Posts: 35854 Location: Santa Clarita, CA (Hell) ->>>>>Ithaca, NY -≥≥≥≥≥Berkeley, CA
Posted: Sun Dec 05, 2021 10:27 am Post subject:
DancingBarry wrote:
^GSW would have never let an asset like Caruso walk for nothing. They’d have retained him.
It's incredible how quickly GSW restocked after Durant left. Two seasons later and they're the favorites to win another championship. Unbelievable. _________________ Damian Lillard shatters Dwight Coward's championship dreams:
3 players takeup OVER ONE HUNDRED AND 20 MILLION DOLLARS
3 players
Bron 2021-22 Contract details by year 36 $41,180,544
AD 2021-22 Contract details by year 28 $35,361,360
RW 2021-22 Contract details by year 32 $44,211,146
How did Russell Westbrook make us better
We signed him because extending him didn't cost us taxes?
130 million next year..... for 3 players
I feel tricked.. expecting THT to become something useful.. while we watch Kuz and AC doing great.. this dude looks (bleep) clueless
I am Grumpy
People want to keep blaming the Russ trade. He's had some ugly games but for the most part has been good and recently is paying much more efficiently and in control.
It's not putting the big 3 together that ruined this team. Its either that:
(a) Jeanie pushed Rob to stay under a certain luxury tax tax figure and/or spend little as possible after Russ
or
(b) Rob didn't push Jeanie to spend more because he actually thought this roster would be enough and no reason to spend more.
The truth of the matter is that we could and still should be the best team in the NBA even with Russ and trying to incorporate him. You mentioned GS... look at their insane luxury take bill. They have their 3 stars they're paying like we are but then they're not scared to spend to add/keep guys around them.
I've said it before but losing Caruso and Dennis when we had their bird rights was ridiculously foolish. Here's what should have happened:
Russ Trade - without including the 1st. That was an overpay.
Re-sign Caruso to the 2/$20M he told Rob he'd take
Re-sign Dennis to a 1/$8M offer and be very open to trying him
Re-sign THT to same deal but try to trade him for a defensive 3 at some point
Use mMLE on Otto Porter Jr and promise him a starting job
Vet Min - Monk, Melo, Wayne, Dwight, Ariza, Baze, Rondo
^GSW would have never let an asset like Caruso walk for nothing. They’d have retained him.
It's incredible how quickly GSW restocked after Durant left. Two seasons later and they're the favorites to win another championship. Unbelievable.
The key there is this
A) They lost Durant…. I don’t think Lakers lose Durant
B) They needed two losing seasons and high lottery picks to get back
C) Warriors owners much richer than Jeanie and siblings
D) Warriors FO manages assets better
We are who we are. But the playing fields are not equal. They had
Steph, Klay in prime
KD in prime
Green in late prime
We had a lot of young players that had never been in a single playoff game or sniffed a title. From there we signed Bron, who had a miserable first season with the Lakers.
The assets the Warriors have and players ages aren’t comparable. We got an old in decline Bron, and still got a title out of it. Only way was to trade for a player like AD. AD is comparable to Klay/Green in the sense he’s a star in his athletic prime when we got him. The season we got him, he played Steph Curry level had a MVP level year and playoffs.
The Lakers never had the same talent to work with. I assure you if we had a 30 year old Lebron in 2018 to work with we see Rob/Jeanie behave a lot more patiently with how they give up assets. We got a 35 year old LBj who after his first season got the label “washed” king. You see what I mean? The ages of their best players and level was way different. Just to get in the title picture we needed a guy like AD. And now the Lakers felt to keep in the title picture they needed a Westbrook. Let’s see.
Joined: 14 Apr 2001 Posts: 144474 Location: The Gold Coast
Posted: Sun Dec 05, 2021 11:48 am Post subject:
Aeneas Hunter wrote:
lakersfever714 wrote:
Aeneas Hunter wrote:
lakersfever714 wrote:
Meanwhile, Jeanie watches on clueless. The fact that she still hasn't fired Rob shows she has no idea how to run a basketball team. I wonder if there's anyone she goes to for advice, other than her bestie Linda.
Even if you think that firing Pelinka is a good idea, doing it right now would be pointless.
So you would rather have Pelinka make more personnel changes prior to the trade deadline after what he's done to the roster this offseason?
I think it's unlikely that there are going to be significant personnel changes prior to the trade deadline. We might look at trading THT, but that's about it. It's more likely that we'll be looking at the buyout market, which means giving a vet min contract to some castoff.
More importantly, if you think that we should fire Pelinka, then you presumably think that we should hire a new GM with some credentials. People like that generally aren't available at mid-season. I mean, we could bring in Phil Jackson or Isiah Thomas or Joe Dumars (I say this with tongue in cheek), but if you want a real upgrade, the good candidates won't be available until the summer.
I wouldn’t anticipate Jeanie hiring a good candidate. Only now she has no one to shift the blame to and her “I don’t make basketball decisions” excuse is now gone. _________________ RIP mom. 11-21-1933 to 6-14-2023.
People want to keep blaming the Russ trade. He's had some ugly games but for the most part has been good and recently is paying much more efficiently and in control.
It's not putting the big 3 together that ruined this team. Its either that:
(a) Jeanie pushed Rob to stay under a certain luxury tax tax figure and/or spend little as possible after Russ
or
(b) Rob didn't push Jeanie to spend more because he actually thought this roster would be enough and no reason to spend more.
There is some truth in that, but for the most part, you're oversimplifying. First of all, you need to separate the Westbrook trade from Westbrook's performance. Even if Westbrook plays well, the trade still cost us a bunch of assets that we could replace only with vet minimum contracts. It also increased our payroll by $8M or so, which jacked up our luxury tax, and led to us making a choice between THT and Caruso. It isn't a question of whether Westbrook is better than KCP, Kuzma, Harrell, and Caruso. The question is whether a team with Westbrook and a bunch of vet min contracts is better than a team with all of those pieces. So far this season, the answer has been No. But there is much left to be written.
Second, we must assume that Pelinka knew what his spending limit was. Once he made the Westbrook trade, the consequences were locked in. So yeah, the Lakers could theoretically have spent an additional $50-100M in payroll and luxury tax (someone else has probably figured out the exact number). But if Pelinka knew that we weren't going to do that, then the consequences are on him. Furthermore, while Caruso would have helped with some of the flaws on this roster, I'm not sure that his defense would have added enough to bring us to an elite level. If we rolled out a backcourt of Westbrook and Caruso, that would be two non-shooters that the defense could ignore on the perimeter. So we would be better with Caruso, but I don't think he would have been a cure-all. _________________ Internet Argument Resolved
I don't know about yal but I can't recall another year where I'm as scattered in posting as this one. It's like what was I complaining about, what's the topic even?
Again I agree with @2019. The Russ trade wasn’t really the problem…it was what happened afterwards. We really weren’t in any position to demand a better talent than Russ and that all comes down to our asset management. We were in no position to really demand a Dame like talent, so when Trez opted in, we were put in an opportune position to utilized him as an asset before it was too late. Now you can argue if Buddy/DeRozan was the better play, but we were lucky to have utilized Trezz as an asset at that point.
People didn’t like that we gave up our #22 pick in that trade, but that’s been the MO of our FO. We gave up unnecessary draft flexibility via deferment options in the AD trade when it seemed like AD/Klutch gave us all the leverage in negotiations. Gave up a 1st in the Schro trade when there was never really any established market for dude. So we essentially cleared up all that cap space using/losing assets for Danny Green in 2019, only to add another draft pick to swap him out for Schro and then dude leaves us for nothing to show for it.
@Wolf, that’s been the difference between the dubs and us and you mentioned it with the management of our assets. I stated above how we lost Schro for nothing even after it took many assets to essentially get him…but this goes back to even how we lost Dwight in his 1st tour here. Just like Schro, he was an impending free agent and we lost him for nothing to show for it. Meanwhile, the dubs lost KD but at least salvaged the loss with a S&t for DLo which ended up being swapped for Wiggins/2021 1st (top 3 protected aka #7 overall Kuminga).
This goes back even further to how the dubs locked up Steph in a team friendly deal due to his ankle injuries. Meanwhile, we did not keep Jules on depreciated extension after his entire rookie season was lost due to his foot injury. We saw the same ignorance again with AC this summer.
Our asset management has been piss poor since Jimbo/Mitch. Folks thought the problem was solved once Magic quit, but nah! R.Pelly keeps pissing away our young assets. _________________ Not familiar with the salary cap/CBA rules & how it impacts our Lakers?
#GetFamiliar by CLICKING HERE!
^GSW would have never let an asset like Caruso walk for nothing. They’d have retained him.
It's incredible how quickly GSW restocked after Durant left. Two seasons later and they're the favorites to win another championship. Unbelievable.
They make more money than us, so they can afford to pay 179 mil luxury tax. That is a significant difference. Warriors basically have 4 max/close to max contracts plus wiseman/MLE, etc
Joined: 14 Apr 2001 Posts: 144474 Location: The Gold Coast
Posted: Sun Dec 05, 2021 12:46 pm Post subject:
mad55557777 wrote:
CandyCanes wrote:
DancingBarry wrote:
^GSW would have never let an asset like Caruso walk for nothing. They’d have retained him.
It's incredible how quickly GSW restocked after Durant left. Two seasons later and they're the favorites to win another championship. Unbelievable.
They make more money than us, so they can afford to pay 179 mil luxury tax. That is a significant difference. Warriors basically have 4 max/close to max contracts plus wiseman/MLE, etc
They also make better personnel decisions _________________ RIP mom. 11-21-1933 to 6-14-2023.
If not for injuries last year the Lakers would have had 2 championships in the 3 years they've had LeBron.
Factor that into your decision making too.
So we factor in fantasy? I will pass on that.
No, you factor in that we were in a position to win a Championship 2 years in a row, and the one year we didn't wasn't due to roster construction, it was due to injury.
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