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Lakeshow323
Star Player
Joined: 17 Nov 2016
Posts: 1277
Location: LA
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 Posted: Wed Feb 08, 2023 7:04 pm Post subject: |
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I just can’t help but laugh that the only GM who absolutely fleeced Ainge was Pelinka.  |
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Halflife
Franchise Player
Joined: 15 Aug 2015
Posts: 16799
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pio2u
Retired Number
Joined: 26 Dec 2012
Posts: 54627
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| Posted: Wed Feb 08, 2023 8:22 pm Post subject: |
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Nice job Rob! 
Jarred Vanderbilt provides excellent defense & can play 4 or small ball 5.
Malik Beasley is a much-needed shooter, 36% from deep.
D’Angelo Russell can be that third star & will fit in nicely if he follows LBJ's lead. |
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LaxT
Star Player
Joined: 23 Sep 2002
Posts: 2536
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| Posted: Wed Feb 08, 2023 10:49 pm Post subject: |
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Kyle Kuzma, Kentavious Caldwell-Pope, Montrezl Harrell and two FRPs for D’Angelo Russell, Malik Beasley, Jarred Vanderbilt.
Two years of the LBJ/AD window was wasted in the process. And Pelinka is called a good GM.  |
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KindCrippler2000
Franchise Player
Joined: 02 May 2003
Posts: 15821
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| Posted: Wed Feb 08, 2023 10:54 pm Post subject: |
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| As much as I rag on Rob, we should all be glad he's not Joe Tsai. The Nets are now a dead zone for franchise and star players as far as I'm concerned. No player of great importance wants anything to do with Tsai. |
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Rubin
Starting Rotation
Joined: 23 Aug 2017
Posts: 632
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| Posted: Wed Feb 08, 2023 11:00 pm Post subject: |
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| LaxT wrote: | Kyle Kuzma, Kentavious Caldwell-Pope, Montrezl Harrell and two FRPs for D’Angelo Russell, Malik Beasley, Jarred Vanderbilt.
Two years of the LBJ/AD window was wasted in the process. And Pelinka is called a good GM. |
I feel much the same way. Fact is, the Russ trade was so awful that there was no recovering from it.
In a vacuum, Pelinka did well today. It’s just impossible to ignore the broader context of the self-made disaster that was the Westbrook trade.
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Job 12:10 - In His hand is the life of every creature and the breath of all mankind.
Mk 8:36 - For what shall it profit a man, if he shall gain the whole world, yet forfeit his soul? |
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slavavov
Star Player
Joined: 03 Oct 2003
Posts: 8377
Location: Santa Monica
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| Posted: Wed Feb 08, 2023 11:12 pm Post subject: |
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| Rubin wrote: | | LaxT wrote: | Kyle Kuzma, Kentavious Caldwell-Pope, Montrezl Harrell and two FRPs for D’Angelo Russell, Malik Beasley, Jarred Vanderbilt.
Two years of the LBJ/AD window was wasted in the process. And Pelinka is called a good GM. |
I feel much the same way. Fact is, the Russ trade was so awful that there was no recovering from it.
In a vacuum, Pelinka did well today. It’s just impossible to ignore the broader context of the self-made disaster that was the Westbrook trade. |
Yes, 1.5 years of the LBJ/AD window was wasted, but Rob recovered from the Russ trade well.
If DLo keeps shooting well and gets a reasonable extension to stay here, and if Beasley ups his 3-point shooting percentage, this exchange was not bad at all. |
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Laker_Jocker
Star Player
Joined: 13 Jul 2004
Posts: 2817
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| Posted: Wed Feb 08, 2023 11:16 pm Post subject: |
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On its face, looks to be a lopsided trade in the Lakers favor….
Removed the depth gutting and heart gutting error of WB at the cost of only 2 useless players and 1 pick 4 seasons away (protected to boot!)
Much better depth/balance now - brought back a real starting PG (and former Laker), a real shooter and a real defensive specialist with length. Should be way less out of position mismatches now:
DLO/DS- back in proper role as 6th man/Bev - cheerleader
Beas/LW4 - Malik Monk role/Reaves - cheerleader
Rui/Brown/Christie
LBJ/Van/Wenyen
AD/Bryant
Roster is legitimate now, thank you Rob!
Now, they better start winning!!!! |
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Polarbear
Star Player
Joined: 03 Nov 2003
Posts: 6129
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| Posted: Wed Feb 08, 2023 11:53 pm Post subject: |
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| LaxT wrote: | Kyle Kuzma, Kentavious Caldwell-Pope, Montrezl Harrell and two FRPs for D’Angelo Russell, Malik Beasley, Jarred Vanderbilt.
Two years of the LBJ/AD window was wasted in the process. And Pelinka is called a good GM. |
And a championship |
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Polarbear
Star Player
Joined: 03 Nov 2003
Posts: 6129
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| Posted: Wed Feb 08, 2023 11:55 pm Post subject: |
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| Rubin wrote: | | LaxT wrote: | Kyle Kuzma, Kentavious Caldwell-Pope, Montrezl Harrell and two FRPs for D’Angelo Russell, Malik Beasley, Jarred Vanderbilt.
Two years of the LBJ/AD window was wasted in the process. And Pelinka is called a good GM. |
I feel much the same way. Fact is, the Russ trade was so awful that there was no recovering from it.
In a vacuum, Pelinka did well today. It’s just impossible to ignore the broader context of the self-made disaster that was the Westbrook trade. |
You give criticism where it’s due to Pelinka therefore, it is also the right thing to give props when it’s due to him
Today was a good day for him |
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epic_
Franchise Player
Joined: 23 Jan 2020
Posts: 11310
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| Posted: Wed Feb 08, 2023 11:56 pm Post subject: |
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| Polarbear wrote: | | LaxT wrote: | Kyle Kuzma, Kentavious Caldwell-Pope, Montrezl Harrell and two FRPs for D’Angelo Russell, Malik Beasley, Jarred Vanderbilt.
Two years of the LBJ/AD window was wasted in the process. And Pelinka is called a good GM. |
And a championship |
Yep, this year is a "to be determined."
So it was 1 year (last year) that was wasted.
The year before, the Lakers started off hot, got injuries, and then was going to kill it in the playoffs, until AD's injury. Unless that's on Rob, I'd say last year was the one real waste due to personnel choices.
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Robblake
Starting Rotation
Joined: 05 Aug 2020
Posts: 991
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| Posted: Thu Feb 09, 2023 12:00 am Post subject: |
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| We def have a sleeper squad but I have zero confidence in Ham knowing how to handle the roster until proven. |
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Polarbear
Star Player
Joined: 03 Nov 2003
Posts: 6129
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| Posted: Thu Feb 09, 2023 12:06 am Post subject: |
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| Robblake wrote: | | We def have a sleeper squad but I have zero confidence in Ham knowing how to handle the roster until proven. |
I think that’s fair the way the Darvin ham has handled. Winnie Gabriel has been absolutely criminal. He was one of our energy players and actually getting it done and he got benched now he’s been given better groceries. What is he going to do? |
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LaxT
Star Player
Joined: 23 Sep 2002
Posts: 2536
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| Posted: Thu Feb 09, 2023 12:18 am Post subject: |
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| Polarbear wrote: | | LaxT wrote: | Kyle Kuzma, Kentavious Caldwell-Pope, Montrezl Harrell and two FRPs for D’Angelo Russell, Malik Beasley, Jarred Vanderbilt.
Two years of the LBJ/AD window was wasted in the process. And Pelinka is called a good GM. |
And a championship |
If you want to add the championship into the equation, you need to expand the equation.
2018 lottery
2019 lottery
2020 championship
2021 1st round exit
2022 lottery
2023 likely play-in
That championship will always hinder people's evaluation of Pelinka. |
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Polarbear
Star Player
Joined: 03 Nov 2003
Posts: 6129
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| Posted: Thu Feb 09, 2023 12:31 am Post subject: |
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| LaxT wrote: | | Polarbear wrote: | | LaxT wrote: | Kyle Kuzma, Kentavious Caldwell-Pope, Montrezl Harrell and two FRPs for D’Angelo Russell, Malik Beasley, Jarred Vanderbilt.
Two years of the LBJ/AD window was wasted in the process. And Pelinka is called a good GM. |
And a championship |
If you want to add the championship into the equation, you need to expand the equation.
2018 lottery
2019 lottery
2020 championship
2021 1st round exit
2022 lottery
2023 likely play-in
That championship will always hinder people's evaluation of Pelinka. |
I failed to see how a championship in someway hinders an evaluation
Seeing as how it’s the ultimate goal of playing the game |
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LaxT
Star Player
Joined: 23 Sep 2002
Posts: 2536
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| Posted: Thu Feb 09, 2023 12:51 am Post subject: |
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| Polarbear wrote: | | LaxT wrote: | | Polarbear wrote: | | LaxT wrote: | Kyle Kuzma, Kentavious Caldwell-Pope, Montrezl Harrell and two FRPs for D’Angelo Russell, Malik Beasley, Jarred Vanderbilt.
Two years of the LBJ/AD window was wasted in the process. And Pelinka is called a good GM. |
And a championship |
If you want to add the championship into the equation, you need to expand the equation.
2018 lottery
2019 lottery
2020 championship
2021 1st round exit
2022 lottery
2023 likely play-in
That championship will always hinder people's evaluation of Pelinka. |
I failed to see how a championship in someway hinders an evaluation
Seeing as how it’s the ultimate goal of playing the game |
A championship is an outcome of many factors such as players, coaches etc..
That's why a longer term perspective is needed when evaluating. You would not call a player good if he has a good game, or even a good season. You would look at the whole record. Same with a GM.
It has been five full years since Pelinka was hired. I would say disappointment has been a norm while success was an anomaly. Yet people would point to that anomaly to justify his promotion and extension. |
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wolfpaclaker
Retired Number
Joined: 29 May 2002
Posts: 58348
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| Posted: Thu Feb 09, 2023 4:50 am Post subject: |
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The positive of his work since the Westbrook trade disaster and all the old washed vet min players he brought in (summer 2021) has been he has been able to get a lot more younger and athletic around AD/Bron.
Vanderbilt 23
Beasley 26
D'LO 26
Reaves 24
TBryant 25
Rui 25
Walker 24
Christie 19
And one of them is a 6MOTY/all-star caliber player in DLO, and theres a lot of scoring there. It's almost as if low key Pelinka is re-building without actually saying it. Because those are not pieces you put around AD/Bron to win rings, those are more players you try and develop a bit and get through a re-build time. The only win now player who is getting into his athletic prime is really DLO.
Now that's the good about this. The roster has gone from an old washed with no trade assets, with quite a few trade assets/players you can dump into deals for another bigger move. The bad is that we lost our 2027 #1 pick, a lot of 2nd rounders and the advanced stats show that these players aren't very impactful.
RAPTOR ratings for these players
Reaves +2.4
DLO -0.2 (-1.7 on defense)
TBryant -1.2
Rui -1.5
Beasley -1.7
Vanderbilt -2.4
Walker -4.7
For reference
So the only KCP/Caruso/Green championship level piece we've gotten is Reaves, IMO. He seems to have the net impact we need to win now. DLO has a lot of impact on offense. Overall as players helping Bron/AD win now, I see this as more a team that has a lot of mediocre young players who can sometimes show flashes and only 2 impact guys (Reaves, DLO). DLO also, his impact is on offense, not defense. And if we sign DLO to a massive deal, and we re-sign Reaves and Rui to 3 years deals, then we're pretty married to this roster and core of players cap wise for the next 2 years.
Guess what I'm saying is while I'm excited that I can watch games without WB anymore, I also don't think he was the biggest problem with the team. I think the advanced metrics show this team still will struggle to win at a high level unless these role guys have a huge internal growth. We also have a coach who Pelinka and co hired who has a weak defensive tactical game plan.
On the positive, I will say, AD/Bron/DLO/Rui/Reaves will be a FUN lineup to watch on offense. We'll win at least half our games and put up a lot of points. I always liked DLO as a support player, didn't think he was the franchise guy some thought but he had a ton of positive skills on offense. It will be fun to watch a lineup of DLO, Reaves, Rui around AD/Bron. After almost 2 years of suffering with WB's lack of chemistry with AD/Bron and a forced marriage, I think DLO/Reaves/Rui will be a ton of fun to watch around AD/Bron. Someone needs to mandate to Ham that he run that lineup immediately for player chemistry development. |
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governator
Retired Number
Joined: 28 Jan 2006
Posts: 25092
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| Posted: Thu Feb 09, 2023 5:08 am Post subject: |
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PelinKlutch Redeem team
Let's go!!! |
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danzag
Franchise Player
Joined: 28 Apr 2013
Posts: 22385
Location: Brazil
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| Posted: Thu Feb 09, 2023 5:11 am Post subject: |
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| It was a nice trade, but the Westbrook trade should never have happened to begin with. Already wasted a year of LBJ+AD. Hopefully we can save this season |
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giordan0
Star Player
Joined: 05 Jan 2016
Posts: 1017
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| Posted: Thu Feb 09, 2023 5:15 am Post subject: |
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The squad looks more balanced now.
Go get GTJ Rob. |
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Day
Star Player
Joined: 12 Mar 2012
Posts: 1742
Location: San Francisco, CA
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| Posted: Thu Feb 09, 2023 5:34 am Post subject: |
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| danzag wrote: | | It was a nice trade, but the Westbrook trade should never have happened to begin with. Already wasted a year of LBJ+AD. Hopefully we can save this season |
It was AD+LBJ who wanted him.
If you want to blame Rob for it, then at least frame it properly - he listened to what LeBron James wanted. You can't fault him for that, it just didn't work out.
He was sabotaged with Magic when he first got here, listened to LBJ and did the Russ trade. Other than that, and the Ham hiring, he's done a lot of good. |
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danzag
Franchise Player
Joined: 28 Apr 2013
Posts: 22385
Location: Brazil
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| Posted: Thu Feb 09, 2023 5:40 am Post subject: |
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| Day wrote: | | danzag wrote: | | It was a nice trade, but the Westbrook trade should never have happened to begin with. Already wasted a year of LBJ+AD. Hopefully we can save this season |
It was AD+LBJ who wanted him.
If you want to blame Rob for it, then at least frame it properly - he listened to what LeBron James wanted. You can't fault him for that, it just didn't work out.
He was sabotaged with Magic when he first got here, listened to LBJ and did the Russ trade. Other than that, and the Ham hiring, he's done a lot of good. |
The GM makes the trade, not the players. |
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Day
Star Player
Joined: 12 Mar 2012
Posts: 1742
Location: San Francisco, CA
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| Posted: Thu Feb 09, 2023 5:44 am Post subject: |
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| danzag wrote: | | Day wrote: | | danzag wrote: | | It was a nice trade, but the Westbrook trade should never have happened to begin with. Already wasted a year of LBJ+AD. Hopefully we can save this season |
It was AD+LBJ who wanted him.
If you want to blame Rob for it, then at least frame it properly - he listened to what LeBron James wanted. You can't fault him for that, it just didn't work out.
He was sabotaged with Magic when he first got here, listened to LBJ and did the Russ trade. Other than that, and the Ham hiring, he's done a lot of good. |
The GM makes the trade, not the players. |
Where in my post made you think I thought otherwise? I specifically said he listened to what LeBron wanted, not that LeBron himself made the deal. |
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waterman40
Star Player
Joined: 17 Jun 2003
Posts: 6287
Location: Central Coast
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| Posted: Thu Feb 09, 2023 5:49 am Post subject: |
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It seems like when we lose out on a big trade, then we quickly pivot to another good deal. We lost out on KL, but rebounded with Morris and he was a key to us winning that ring. We lose out to Kyrie (and maybe that is a blessing in disguise) and then we salvage the Westbrook fiasco with DLO and a couple of good players to boot.
The problem is we have less than 30 games to try to get into the play-in, and we have basically four new players in the past week. So its basically a year of getting back into playoff shape, and depending on who we keep, being well setup for next year.
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LAKERS 2019-2020: NBA World Champions! |
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troy
Star Player
Joined: 30 Jan 2013
Posts: 5031
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| Posted: Thu Feb 09, 2023 5:50 am Post subject: |
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| Mr. Snake did a nice job here. We actually have a pretty good team now, definitely good enough to move up beyond play-in status. We just now have to put it all together and put a winning streak together. Guys should NOT be taking the All-star break off; need our new guys to gel quickly. Not many games left, can we do this? |
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