Welcome DENNIS SCHRÖDER (Acquired for Danny Green and the 28th Pick)
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MJST
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PostPosted: Tue Jun 08, 2021 9:17 pm    Post subject:

Reds622 wrote:
CRoost wrote:
wolfpaclaker wrote:
Danny Green had 8 assists in game 2 win today

Dennis?

Never had more than 4 assists and in the last 3 games (all losses) had a combined 7 assists.


Green understand the nuance of those angles on both ends. He knew how to position himself and knew the off ball movement, he bring intangibles that makes him a winning type of player . He was under appreciated here because his shooting was off throughout the year including the playoff but he’s one of those player that can defend and provide space for more room for Lebron to operate and AD to finish.


You're wasting your time posting something like this. The DS lovers don't understand the game in this way.

They admire the streak in Schroders haircut.


No, Danny Green apologists just wait till he has a semi okay game to go "OH MUCH BETTER THAN SCHROEDEREAAS!!" but ignore every bad game he has. It's typical. Game 1 Danny can stink up the place but silence, Game 2 Danny has 8 assists "OMG DIFFERENCE MAKER!" meanwhile Dennis has 1 bad game in a 6 game series in a solid season "SCRUB!!NEVER A LAKER!"
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PostPosted: Tue Jun 08, 2021 10:47 pm    Post subject:

MJST wrote:
Reds622 wrote:
CRoost wrote:
wolfpaclaker wrote:
Danny Green had 8 assists in game 2 win today

Dennis?

Never had more than 4 assists and in the last 3 games (all losses) had a combined 7 assists.


Green understand the nuance of those angles on both ends. He knew how to position himself and knew the off ball movement, he bring intangibles that makes him a winning type of player . He was under appreciated here because his shooting was off throughout the year including the playoff but he’s one of those player that can defend and provide space for more room for Lebron to operate and AD to finish.


You're wasting your time posting something like this. The DS lovers don't understand the game in this way.

They admire the streak in Schroders haircut.


No, Danny Green apologists just wait till he has a semi okay game to go "OH MUCH BETTER THAN SCHROEDEREAAS!!" but ignore every bad game he has. It's typical. Game 1 Danny can stink up the place but silence, Game 2 Danny has 8 assists "OMG DIFFERENCE MAKER!" meanwhile Dennis has 1 bad game in a 6 game series in a solid season "SCRUB!!NEVER A LAKER!"


Difference is Danny Green is a 3 time champion on 3 different teams.

What has Dennis Schroder done in his career? Besides being a disappointment on the Hawks and Lakers?
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MJST
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PostPosted: Tue Jun 08, 2021 11:33 pm    Post subject:

Megaton wrote:

Difference is Danny Green is a 3 time champion on 3 different teams.


yes and it's not his fault that he's not one this year. You saw what we were doing to teams if not for LeBron and AD's injuries. But are you about to blame Schroeder for our lack of success? When in reality he was one of the x factors on the team, a team which struggled mightily whenever he didn't play?

Give credit where it's due. You act like Danny Green was the main guy on the Championship rosters he was a part of, he was a role player like any other. Schroeder was our 3rd most important player. But with Ad and LeBron hurt there was only so much that can be done. One bad playoff game doesn't change the solid season he gave us.
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PostPosted: Wed Jun 09, 2021 3:46 am    Post subject:

You are right MJST. DS was our 3rd most important player and we struggled without him. Its to bad that AD got hurt, because DS and AD were actually playing well together.

I find it funny that most on this board were excited with last years off season. Now our resident Monday morning GM's are crucifying the construction of the team. Should have, could have, blah blah blah. It did not work out for us, but we still have another year to get this rectified (while we are a legit championship contender). After next season, there is potential that we will no longer be legit contenders (and we could possibly become bottom feeders again).
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PostPosted: Wed Jun 09, 2021 3:55 am    Post subject:

BTW people trash Magic.
But Magic has good vision.
Not a good day to day executive.

However he is the one that wanted to go after AD. He knew a championship would come. Second, he was right about DLo. What has DLO done that has made anyone think he would have been the right max guy to spend money on?

Magic is who he is, faults and all. However I think his analysis is spot on when it comes to Dennis. This dude isn’t the right guy to lead LA. The unfortunate situation is because we mishandled this from the start we positioned him in a leading role instead of working him to earn his minutes and spot. Can we send him to the bench and utilise him to the best interest of the team? Can we blatantly lie to his agent and just keep him on a big deal only to trade him a few months later? I dunno. We are not the Clippers here.

It is not an easy decision either way. I understand who don’t want to lose an asset you can trade. However we don’t for sure know that if we put him in the right role for the team. The role that best serves the teams spacing and needs, that then his value would be as good as some think.

Toronto said no to Lowry for DS and KCP. Before KCP had the playoffs he had. What immense value are we getting in keeping him? Ming posted the salaries of the top players off the bench. DS is going to stay for nearly twice as much as Lou, Clarkson etc
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yinoma2001
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PostPosted: Wed Jun 09, 2021 4:42 am    Post subject:

You won't find me bashing Danny Green. I loved when we picked him up after the Kawhi thing fell through. Always liked him. But, we need to put things perspective.

This whole season unraveled b/c of AD/LBJ injuries, notably, AD's injury in the playoffs. I'd argue that in LBJ/AD's absence for 25+ consecutive games in the regular season, Green would have fared worse without those guys than Dennis did.

And in the playoffs, without AD, Green would have probably played worse than Dennis. But that's ok. Green is an elite role player IMO (or was) who is dependent on other stars. For example:

Healthy Kawhi/Duncan/Parker/Manu
Healthy Kawhi/Lowry/Siakam/Gasol
Healthy AD/LBJ
Healthy Embiid (sort of)/Simmons/Harris.

He's great when you have healthy stars around him. Danny is an amazing guy to add in that context. But re: Dennis, maybe he would have been if all the stars are healthy too. Just too bad we couldn't see it.
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PostPosted: Wed Jun 09, 2021 5:18 am    Post subject:

yinoma2001 wrote:
JUST-MING wrote:
yinoma2001 wrote:
JUST-MING wrote:
How does one value a sixth man ((runner up)) at $16-18 million? That’s more than twice market value!


Because this year he was played as a starting guard. That's probably average to what a starting NBA point guard gets. But then you have to factor in our precarious asset deprived, capped out situation and it's inbuilt, the excess.


Smush Parker was our starting point guard. It doesn’t mean he was worth $16-18 million.

Dennis Schroder is a backup because he is wildly inconsistent. 20 points one night, struggle to scratch the next. When he isn’t scoring, what does he do to help the team? He doesn’t create for others. He doesn’t defend. He doesn’t even shoot 3’s. He’s a bad fit with Vogel. He’s a bad fit with Lebron. So why do we need him?


If you think he’s bad I’d suggest you look at the rest of our roster during these playoffs too. But for me it’s mostly capturing an asset that we can keep or trade. We cannot get nothing for him.


Have to agree with this post.
DS is decent enough to make an reasonable offer. At the very least as a place holder for trade. His speed makes him valuable. If he could only learn to clutch shoot.
But the same could be said for the rest of the team this year.
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PostPosted: Wed Jun 09, 2021 6:29 am    Post subject:

yinoma2001 wrote:
You won't find me bashing Danny Green. I loved when we picked him up after the Kawhi thing fell through. Always liked him. But, we need to put things perspective.

This whole season unraveled b/c of AD/LBJ injuries, notably, AD's injury in the playoffs. I'd argue that in LBJ/AD's absence for 25+ consecutive games in the regular season, Green would have fared worse without those guys than Dennis did.

And in the playoffs, without AD, Green would have probably played worse than Dennis. But that's ok. Green is an elite role player IMO (or was) who is dependent on other stars. For example:

Healthy Kawhi/Duncan/Parker/Manu
Healthy Kawhi/Lowry/Siakam/Gasol
Healthy AD/LBJ
Healthy Embiid (sort of)/Simmons/Harris.

He's great when you have healthy stars around him. Danny is an amazing guy to add in that context. But re: Dennis, maybe he would have been if all the stars are healthy too. Just too bad we couldn't see it.


Agree….
Lakers lost because health was not on their side.
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PostPosted: Wed Jun 09, 2021 6:39 am    Post subject:

MJST wrote:
Megaton wrote:

Difference is Danny Green is a 3 time champion on 3 different teams.


yes and it's not his fault that he's not one this year. You saw what we were doing to teams if not for LeBron and AD's injuries. But are you about to blame Schroeder for our lack of success? When in reality he was one of the x factors on the team, a team which struggled mightily whenever he didn't play?

Give credit where it's due. You act like Danny Green was the main guy on the Championship rosters he was a part of, he was a role player like any other. Schroeder was our 3rd most important player. But with Ad and LeBron hurt there was only so much that can be done. One bad playoff game doesn't change the solid season he gave us.


Lol Schroder did not step up when we need him especially when AD got hurt . So he is a role player and for that role, Danny Green does it better.

Schroder does not provide spacing for Lebron nor have the playmaking ability to put AD on better position to finish. He is not a good fit. Even when everyone was healthy, he was a turnover waiting to happen and a penchant for chucking bad shots. He has some good games for sure but when he is not scoring he is a liability . Green can have 0 points but still makes impact. And this is the reason he has been a key contributor to 3 championship teams. I don’t vision Schroder to be that type. He’s a me me me type, like Monta Ellis type .
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PostPosted: Wed Jun 09, 2021 6:48 am    Post subject:

Green is a veteran who knows how to win. Schroder, I would argue, is the first time playing for a championship contender. Some players with high cerebral such as Gasol just know it, but for the other players, there will be a learning curve. And saying Schroder won't change is a premature assumption.
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PostPosted: Wed Jun 09, 2021 7:00 am    Post subject:

lakersfan8 wrote:
Green is a veteran who knows how to win. Schroder, I would argue, is the first time playing for a championship contender. Some players with high cerebral such as Gasol just know it, but for the other players, there will be a learning curve. And saying Schroder won't change is a premature assumption.


Lol if Schroder is young like THT then maybe experience can make his IQ better . Given with his age and his experience, he is who he is. All that leverage in his contract situations actually reveal more about him . He has diva tendencies but does not have enough game to back it up. Definitely negative attributes in building a supporting cast around AD/Lebron.
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PostPosted: Wed Jun 09, 2021 7:02 am    Post subject:

lakersfan8 wrote:
Green is a veteran who knows how to win. Schroder, I would argue, is the first time playing for a championship contender. Some players with high cerebral such as Gasol just know it, but for the other players, there will be a learning curve. And saying Schroder won't change is a premature assumption.


Hapless Spurs Danny, early 20’s, was leading candidate for finals mvp against Miami. Dennis, 28 years old, won’t change!
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PostPosted: Wed Jun 09, 2021 7:15 am    Post subject:

MJST wrote:
Megaton wrote:

Difference is Danny Green is a 3 time champion on 3 different teams.


yes and it's not his fault that he's not one this year. You saw what we were doing to teams if not for LeBron and AD's injuries. But are you about to blame Schroeder for our lack of success? When in reality he was one of the x factors on the team, a team which struggled mightily whenever he didn't play?

Give credit where it's due. You act like Danny Green was the main guy on the Championship rosters he was a part of, he was a role player like any other. Schroeder was our 3rd most important player. But with Ad and LeBron hurt there was only so much that can be done. One bad playoff game doesn't change the solid season he gave us.


Please enlighten me on what we were doing to teams before injury. we played the easiest schedule and you keep saying the same " we were amazing Before Injury". It took multiple OT to beat teams like CAVS and DET
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PostPosted: Wed Jun 09, 2021 7:59 am    Post subject:

CRoost wrote:
lakersfan8 wrote:
Green is a veteran who knows how to win. Schroder, I would argue, is the first time playing for a championship contender. Some players with high cerebral such as Gasol just know it, but for the other players, there will be a learning curve. And saying Schroder won't change is a premature assumption.


Lol if Schroder is young like THT then maybe experience can make his IQ better . Given with his age and his experience, he is who he is. All that leverage in his contract situations actually reveal more about him . He has diva tendencies but does not have enough game to back it up. Definitely negative attributes in building a supporting cast around AD/Lebron.

This is not purely about basketball IQ. Playing winning basketball is about focusing on some details of the game that sometimes you neglect when you only play for stats. For example, Caruso helps this team a lot by playing winning basketball but he still makes some dumb plays. Kuzma just starts to get it at the age of 25 (although his offense becomes extremely poor). Harden didn't play any defense in the first few years in Houston and then he evolved. There are plenty of players whose playing style has changed after their rookie contract. I am not saying he definitely will change, but he can and there were many examples before.
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PostPosted: Wed Jun 09, 2021 8:13 am    Post subject:

lakersfan8 wrote:
CRoost wrote:
lakersfan8 wrote:
Green is a veteran who knows how to win. Schroder, I would argue, is the first time playing for a championship contender. Some players with high cerebral such as Gasol just know it, but for the other players, there will be a learning curve. And saying Schroder won't change is a premature assumption.


Lol if Schroder is young like THT then maybe experience can make his IQ better . Given with his age and his experience, he is who he is. All that leverage in his contract situations actually reveal more about him . He has diva tendencies but does not have enough game to back it up. Definitely negative attributes in building a supporting cast around AD/Lebron.

This is not purely about basketball IQ. Playing winning basketball is about focusing on some details of the game that sometimes you neglect when you only play for stats. For example, Caruso helps this team a lot by playing winning basketball but he still makes some dumb plays. Kuzma just starts to get it at the age of 25 (although his offense becomes extremely poor). Harden didn't play any defense in the first few years in Houston and then he evolved. There are plenty of players whose playing style has changed after their rookie contract. I am not saying he definitely will change, but he can and there were many examples before.


Look brah Schroder is at his best when he has the ball in his hands. He is 28 already, he is who he is. If we gonna make him something that he is not, he’s not going to flourish given his diva tendencies. He is a role player and role players tend to thrive when they are given a role of which their skill set is utilize. Case in point Clarkson. The fact that we have 2 players that we can surround with to win it all and you’re hopeless trying to change Schroder is not pragmatic.
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PostPosted: Wed Jun 09, 2021 8:24 am    Post subject:

MJST wrote:
Reds622 wrote:
CRoost wrote:
wolfpaclaker wrote:
Danny Green had 8 assists in game 2 win today

Dennis?

Never had more than 4 assists and in the last 3 games (all losses) had a combined 7 assists.


Green understand the nuance of those angles on both ends. He knew how to position himself and knew the off ball movement, he bring intangibles that makes him a winning type of player . He was under appreciated here because his shooting was off throughout the year including the playoff but he’s one of those player that can defend and provide space for more room for Lebron to operate and AD to finish.


You're wasting your time posting something like this. The DS lovers don't understand the game in this way.

They admire the streak in Schroders haircut.


No, Danny Green apologists just wait till he has a semi okay game to go "OH MUCH BETTER THAN SCHROEDEREAAS!!" but ignore every bad game he has. It's typical. Game 1 Danny can stink up the place but silence, Game 2 Danny has 8 assists "OMG DIFFERENCE MAKER!" meanwhile Dennis has 1 bad game in a 6 game series in a solid season "SCRUB!!NEVER A LAKER!"


dont miss green. however regret trading last year's pick. could have had a young 3p shooter in desmond bane.

yes most of us were giddy about the last offseason. that does not mean ds is not a big mistake.
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PostPosted: Wed Jun 09, 2021 10:28 am    Post subject:

wolfpaclaker wrote:
BTW people trash Magic.
But Magic has good vision.
Not a good day to day executive.

However he is the one that wanted to go after AD. He knew a championship would come. Second, he was right about DLo. What has DLO done that has made anyone think he would have been the right max guy to spend money on?

Magic is who he is, faults and all. However I think his analysis is spot on when it comes to Dennis. This dude isn’t the right guy to lead LA. The unfortunate situation is because we mishandled this from the start we positioned him in a leading role instead of working him to earn his minutes and spot. Can we send him to the bench and utilise him to the best interest of the team? Can we blatantly lie to his agent and just keep him on a big deal only to trade him a few months later? I dunno. We are not the Clippers here.

It is not an easy decision either way. I understand who don’t want to lose an asset you can trade. However we don’t for sure know that if we put him in the right role for the team. The role that best serves the teams spacing and needs, that then his value would be as good as some think.

Toronto said no to Lowry for DS and KCP. Before KCP had the playoffs he had. What immense value are we getting in keeping him? Ming posted the salaries of the top players off the bench. DS is going to stay for nearly twice as much as Lou, Clarkson etc


Well said. Magic is who he is. Loved him as a player and he knows what it takes to win.

I don't like Magic the ham sometimes.
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PostPosted: Wed Jun 09, 2021 10:56 am    Post subject:

I loved what Danny brought to the team last year. Unlike others who were making death threats against him when he missed that 3 in the Finals, I valued his veteran savvy and winning ways.

But let's not fool ourselves into thinking that if we didn't trade for Dennis we would be still playing. Same results, maybe worse (especially when AD/LBJ were out). But maybe it makes us feel better losing in that manner?

Same question would be there as I'm asking for Dennis. If Green wants a 2-3 year extension at his current rate of $15m, do you say no, just let him walk for nothing or try to retain him and get some assets for him?
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PostPosted: Wed Jun 09, 2021 11:38 am    Post subject:

lakersfan8 wrote:
CRoost wrote:
lakersfan8 wrote:
Green is a veteran who knows how to win. Schroder, I would argue, is the first time playing for a championship contender. Some players with high cerebral such as Gasol just know it, but for the other players, there will be a learning curve. And saying Schroder won't change is a premature assumption.


Lol if Schroder is young like THT then maybe experience can make his IQ better . Given with his age and his experience, he is who he is. All that leverage in his contract situations actually reveal more about him . He has diva tendencies but does not have enough game to back it up. Definitely negative attributes in building a supporting cast around AD/Lebron.

This is not purely about basketball IQ. Playing winning basketball is about focusing on some details of the game that sometimes you neglect when you only play for stats. For example, Caruso helps this team a lot by playing winning basketball but he still makes some dumb plays. Kuzma just starts to get it at the age of 25 (although his offense becomes extremely poor). Harden didn't play any defense in the first few years in Houston and then he evolved. There are plenty of players whose playing style has changed after their rookie contract. I am not saying he definitely will change, but he can and there were many examples before.




"There are plenty of players whose playing style has changed after their rookie contract."

Dennis has been off his rookie contract for a long time. He just completed a four-year, $60 million extension to his rookie contract, and is looking for his next big contract.

Dennis is approaching 28. He's been a professional basketball player for a decade, and he has 8 years in the NBA.

Could be change? Sure. Is there any particular reason to think he will change. Not that I can think of.

If we resign him, it shouldn't be with the expectation that he will become a different player than he already is.
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PostPosted: Wed Jun 09, 2021 11:51 am    Post subject:

JUST-MING wrote:
lakersfan8 wrote:
Green is a veteran who knows how to win. Schroder, I would argue, is the first time playing for a championship contender. Some players with high cerebral such as Gasol just know it, but for the other players, there will be a learning curve. And saying Schroder won't change is a premature assumption.


Hapless Spurs Danny, early 20’s, was leading candidate for finals mvp against Miami. Dennis, 28 years old, won’t change!


Danny played well against the Heat, but he wasn't "leading candidate for finals MVP" for the Spurs. Leonard got 10 of 11 votes for the award; I don't believe they've ever revealed who got the 11th vote. I doubt it was Danny, since, in my opinion, Duncan, Parker, Manu, and even arguably Patty Mills played better than him. He was just one of the merry crew trouncing the hapless Heat.

And to be fair, Danny has also stunk it up in the playoff. His playoff performance for his second and third rings weren't very good. Last year in the finals, he shot 33% from the field, and 29% from 3-point line for us.

Overall, I'd say Danny is better Dennis. Danny, at the top of his game, shoots and plays defense at a superior level; I'm not sure if Dennis really doesn't anything at a superior level.

But both are inconsistent players and contributors, rather than engines to a team. I do not believe that trading out Dennis for Danny this year would have mattered in the slightest.
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PostPosted: Wed Jun 09, 2021 12:17 pm    Post subject:

Revisionist history, but what else to expect from you. Danny’s 3pt shooting was the only thing ppl talked in that series.
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PostPosted: Wed Jun 09, 2021 6:20 pm    Post subject:

We may need a sticky thread exposing to fans how we can pay this man, but not take the same amount and pay a free agent. Fans don’t seem to understand this principal.
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PostPosted: Wed Jun 09, 2021 6:28 pm    Post subject:

LG, never change. This revisionist history of Danny Green's time with the team is just (bleep) hilarious. He was the most hated man on the roster all playoffs, which peaked with him bricking a wide open three to close the Heat out in Game 5. Barely anyone here wanted him back for another run.

So don't try to argue that somehow, if AD were to have gone down last year (since let's be fair and compare him and Schroder in the same situation), his defense and "intangibles" would stand out and he'd somehow save the Lakers from their fate any more than Schroder did. Danny was a solid player that fit the team well, don't get me wrong, but Schroder was not bad himself when we actually had everyone healthy and the team was clicking.
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PostPosted: Wed Jun 09, 2021 6:32 pm    Post subject:

Lakerz113 wrote:
We may need a sticky thread exposing to fans how we can pay this man, but not take the same amount and pay a free agent. Fans don’t seem to understand this principal.


That sounds fair, but it should be accompanied by an equally emphatic explanation about how it is possible that at a certain price... somewhere between 18 million and 30 million dollars per season that no GM, no matter how desperate will trade for him.
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PostPosted: Wed Jun 09, 2021 7:05 pm    Post subject:

BILBJH wrote:
Lakerz113 wrote:
We may need a sticky thread exposing to fans how we can pay this man, but not take the same amount and pay a free agent. Fans don’t seem to understand this principal.


That sounds fair, but it should be accompanied by an equally emphatic explanation about how it is possible that at a certain price... somewhere between 18 million and 30 million dollars per season that no GM, no matter how desperate will trade for him.


$18M to $30M is a fairly large range. Several GM's would love to have DS at under $20M.

Regardless of any of our opinions, the Laker are going to do everything they can to resign DS whether we as fans like it or not. Why you ask? For the same reason all of the salary cap informed participants in this thread continue to remind the rest of you: ASSET MANAGEMENT ...... WE HAVE NO CAP SPACE.

Suck it up and go by yourself a DS jersey cause he's staying.


Last edited by Killer_Z on Wed Jun 09, 2021 7:10 pm; edited 1 time in total
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