LAKERS -at- SUNS - 5/23 - Thoughts and :-(( Ratings
Goto page 1, 2  Next

 
Post new topic    LakersGround.net Forum Index -> Thoughts and Ratings Reply to topic
View previous topic :: View next topic  
Author Message
DancingBarry
Editor-in-Chief
Editor-in-Chief


Joined: 07 Sep 2001
Posts: 38698
Location: O.C.

PostPosted: Sun May 23, 2021 3:27 pm    Post subject: LAKERS -at- SUNS - 5/23 - Thoughts and :-(( Ratings

Suns Win The First One... Back in the seven game series, Vogel will play his usual long game.

The Suns forced multiple timeouts from Vogel early in this game as they were scoring at will in transition. If the Lakers were missing shots (2-10 from three in half), the Suns were getting down court quick and taking advantage. They had a 16-5 advantage in transition and a 34-20 advantage on points in the paint.

Anyone not named LeBron in that first half shot 0-8 from three. The Lakers trailed 53-45 at the half.

The Lakers went to their usual starting lineup to start the third quarter. AD and LeBron saw very few opportunities in the paint and they lost the third quarter, as well.

Early in the fourth, after LeBron was fouled at the three line and missed a couple FTs, was fouled again a few seconds later, missed another and yanked down by CP3 for another foul. Tech started flying as AC/Payne/Trezz got into it. Payne was ejected, and we had that expected chippiness.

Would it ignite a Laker run or was the hole too deep?

While it was the only quarter of the game the Lakers would win, it was still one in which they struggled to score. They missed freethrows and threes. LeBron/AD never really got going and they faded as the game went along. Like last year’s playoffs, they dropped their first one 99-90.

Poor shooting, poor transition D early, poor defensive rebounding. Take care of any one of those issues and they are probably fine in this game. Few of those issues are on Vogel as far as adjustments. Getting AD better looks? Getting LeBron downhill? Yes. That may take some changes to the lineups and schemes. Let’s see how Vogel reacts.

The team has been in this situation last year, of course, with the Blazers and Rockets. That can help with composure, but can also trick them into not bringing the sense of urgency needed.


LeBron -- -- I don’t know how many times he got to the rim in the half court, but if it was more than one I’d be a little surprised. He sank a couple of threes early. When he got in the paint, help came and he had a few setups to his bigs. Shooters weren’t hitting threes, so that hurt. He had 10 points on 4-6 shooting at the half. In the second half, again with the paint packed he was very perimeter oriented. We tried to get him a few touches in the post as we went to the smaller lineups with AD. But you still never saw him attack. That LeBron, while still good, isn’t playoff LeBron. With the paint packed, we allow teams to cover LeBron by just getting an extra body in the spot away from the ball where LeBron wants to go. Bring in floor spacers and there is more room. If there is a concern, however, it’s that when we went to our AD small ball lineup in the final 8 minutes, we didn’t see LeBron getting downhill and to the rim. That makes me wonder how he is physically. Let’s see if we switch things up in the next game and what happens. Hopefully, his left shoulder is fine after getting yanked down by CP3. LeBron is strong, but something awkward like that can do some damage. The Stats: He scored 18 points on 6-13 shooting (3-7 from three, 3-6 from the line) to go with 7 boards, 10 assists, 3 steals, 5 turnovers and 1 foul in 36 minutes. He was a +2.

Davis -- -- “This is on me. I take full responsibility,” AD said afterward. Ideally in this series (and most), we get AD on the move. He’s long, fast and has handles. It’s tough to cover. Additionally, he’s much better passing while facing the basket versus having his back to it when help comes. Plus, that helps him get to the line. That didn’t happen today. For the first three quarters, he played with a C and had that typically PF opportunities that push him out further. He had 7 points on 2-9 shooting in the first half with just one trip to the line (1-2). In the second half, he’d go 2-3 from the line. So, clearly we weren’t getting that aggressive AD. In the fourth, he really settled when he finally had room to maneuver. While the coaches did a really, really poor job activating him. When AD had the chance, he never switched gears. You want him attacking Ayton off the dribble and forcing the issue/fouls. Instead he settled for contested jumpers. He was outplayed by Ayton today. That’s not the AD, we know. I put this about 50% on coaching and 50% on AD. We were outscored badly on the AD-led units while LBJ was out. Vogel said the Suns did a good job limiting AD’s touches, but that “there are ways we can be better to take advantage of him.” The main adjustment in the past has simply been giving him room to work. “I’ve still got to find ways to make plays offensively,” AD said. Unleash the beast, AD. He had 0 offensive boards. The Stats: He scored 13 points on 5-16 shooting (0-2 from three, 3-5 from the line) to go with 7 boards, 2 assists, 3 blocks and 1 foul in 39 minutes. He was a -18.

Schröder -- -- Penetration is especially key against teams that don’t have anchors. When Ayton’s out of the paint, the Suns have had problems defending the rim. Schröder was getting into the paint for FTs early on or setting up his bigs, but struggled to make his FTs (3-6 in the first half). His only bucket was hitting a midrange pull-up. In the second half, he’d score a layup in transition and other in early offense (Ayton trailing the action). Another in early offense again, this team past Ayton with a tough finish. Then he’d sink a three to cut the lead to 7 late. Schröder is looking at what is behind his defender when making decisions offensively. If you want to make his defenders work harder, you need to find ways to pull the help out of the paint. The Stats: He scored 14 points on 5-7 shooting (1-2 from three, 3-6 from the line) to go with 1 board, 3 assists, 2 steals, 1 block, 4 turnovers and 3 fouls in 34 minutes. He was a -8.

Caldwell-Pope -- -- Defensively, the Suns cross matched in the last game, hiding CP3 on KCP, while KCP spent time on Booker. Again, we had KCP on Booker quite a bit. We want to send help so Booker can’t get him into the post or other vulnerable areas. The problem is when we can’t get into our set defense, we can’t send help like we want. Offensively, if KCP hits his open looks in this game and a respectable rate, this game goes down to the wire. An 0-4 first quarter start from KCP, with some wide open looks from three. He just did not look in rhythm early on. He finally hit a pull-up jumper on his last attempt of the first half to finish with 4 points on 1-6 shooting. He’d go 1-3 in the second half. Too many good looks for him to miss in this one. Passing-wise, a couple of nice sequences, including an oop to AD on an ATO handoff sequence. He’d also attack off the three line and set up AD for a dunk. The Stats: He’d score 7 points on 2-9 shooting (1-7 from three, 2-2 from the line) to go with 2 boards, 2 assists, 1 steal and 3 fouls in 35 minutes. He was a -9..

Drummond -- -- A lot of this series will come down to getting Ayton out of the paint, and one of the ways to do that is by getting him into foul trouble and on the bench. He can be foul prone, and the Lakers have several big bodies that can draw those fouls by just being active. We got Ayton’s third foul with 4 minute left in the first half as Drummond was battling down low. AD2 had 5 offensive boards in the first half. So there is one advantage to playing Drummond some minutes. But there are disadvantages. I think just looking at AD with 13 points and LeBron with 18 and very few shots for either while putting pressure on the rim says a lot. The Suns have a AD/LBJ problem...but not when Drummond is on the floor. Drummond did his job. This isn’t Drummond’s fault. It’s just the nature of playing a traditional C. Last year, we’d run McGee 5 minutes or so to start games. Usually not good minutes, but he’d eat up minutes at C. Then, we’d transition into some AD at the C spot. In this one, you saw some longer stints for Drummond, followed by Trezz coming in. In the third, we ran Drummond for 10 minutes straight to start the second half. That’s just different use of our personnel than last year and it causes some issues. Now you might have noticed how much the Suns ran on the Lakers, especially that first half. Perhaps, you are thinking that Gasol can’t keep up with that. You’ve got to remember where Gasol plays. He’s out beyond the three line on offense. He will likely be back in transition more than other other bigs who are down in the paint. One more body back in transition helps a lot. The Stats: He scored 12 points on 5-7 shooting (2-4 from the line) to go with 9 boards (7 offensive), 1 steal, 1 block, 2 turnovers and 1 foul in 19 minutes. He was a -4.

Harrell -- -- Good effort by Trezz in this one. He had 10 points in the first half on 3-3 shooting and drew a bunch of fouls. Some good moments with LeBron/Harrell. Ayton was sitting during quite a bit of Trezz’s stints, so that helps us get penetration more. Remember the last we saw the Suns that was the first time we saw that Gasol/Harrell combo on the floor. (Trezz at the 5 offensively and at the 4 defensively.) We didn’t see that tonight. We cut Trezz’s minutes short in the second half. He picked up a tech running into Payne to help stand up for AC. All that time taking freethrows, reviewing plays, issuing techs, that allowed us rest AD, so Trezz’s minutes might have been cut short some from that. The Stats: He scored 12 points on 4-5 shooting (4-5 from the line) to go with 3 boards (2 offensive), 2 steals, 2 turnovers and 2 fouls in 15 minutes. He was a +2.

Kuzma -- -- He really made some bad decisions in this one. He threw a bad cross-court pass. He fouled Booker on an offensive board in the corner to give up FTs when in the penalty. He was also blocked on a reverse in a crowd. Really disappeared. He had a good sequence or two defending CP3 on switches, but very little positive impact. The Stats: He didn’t score on 0-2 shooting (0-1 from three) to go with 3 boards, 1 assist, 1 turnover and 1 foul in 19 minutes. He was a -5.

Caruso -- -- He was 0-3 in the first half, but we were still a +2 in his 10 minutes. In the second half, he went 4-6, including a couple of threes. Outside of AC and LBJ, the rest of the team shot 2-15 from three. If that continues to happen maybe you see McLemore cracking the rotation. Defensively, that fourth quarter he was making things happen. He drew back-to-back charges (scoring a layup himself on a drive after that second stop. He then forced a turnover at midcourt, probably drawing another charge that wasn’t called and LBJ scored an And-1 off it. Those are the kind of plays that you hope get your team going and certainly will win ball games for you. But we were already down 13 to start the fourth. Good job defending Booker at times. The Stats: He scored 10 points on 4-9 shooting (2-4 from three) to go with 4 fouls in 24 minutes. He was a +1.

Horton-Tucker -- -- Some first half run where he put up 4 shots in 7 minutes. He made one twisting drive. Another layup, he missed, but LeBron cleaned it up in transition. He got snapped at AD at one point. Our problems were bigger than THT and the team actually was a +1 while he was on the floor. There is opportunity for him in this series because of the small anchors that the Suns have off their bench. That should allow him to get to the rim. The Stats: He scored 2 points on 1-4 shooting to go with 1 board, 1 assist, 1 steal and no fouls in 7 minutes. He was a +1.

Matthews -- -- We threw him on CP3 late in the game. His size defensively will be leaned on. We may switch or blitz a bit more than we have in the next games. Offensively, Wes missed all his looks from three. We needed someone to step up from three and it would have been huge if he could have knocked down a couple. He did have a nice layup curling into the paint off the dribble. The Stats: He scored 2 points on 1-4 shooting (0-3 from three) to go with 2 fouls in 12 minutes. He was a -7.

Vogel -- -- Key Moment: The chippy stretch in the fourth. LeBron got fouled on a three, made just one FT. Caruso forced a turnover on that rebound and pushout. LeBron scored an And-1 layup off that. Again, he missed the FT (so just 3 points on all that). But on the FT rebound attempt, his left arm was yanked by CP3 and LeBron went down in pain. Out on the perimeter, AC got knocked down by Payne, who ended up getting ejected. AC/Trezz picked up techs. Lakers were down 9. Trezz missed a jumphook out of that. (That’s a good situation to draw up a nice ATO for a lob or something.) Kuz was then called for a weak foul on a three, never leaving the floor, holding his arm straight up (great D twice by Kuz in that sequence). Vogel was forced to challenge it. All of this led to a ton of down time and rest for AD, so we brought him back. “This is our freaking moment,” Monty Williams said in his timeout. That call overturned, but we didn’t win the jumpball. The Suns scored on the next two possessions to push the lead back to 13. Two scores by the Lakers there and that’s a huge momentum shift. It was, indeed, the Suns moment.

Key Substitution: Starters with AC instead of Drummond down 9 as we went small. AD and LeBron did not switch gears well to take advantage. The Lakers needed to hit their threes, as well.

Key Stats: The Lakers lost the offensive board battle, 16-10. Just no excuse for that. The Lakers shot 7-26 from three. The Suns 9-28. A lot of the Laker misses in the first half, the Suns turned into transition scores. They had 16 points on the break to 5 Laker points in the first half. In the second half, the Lakers won that 4-0. First, good job dealing with the transition D in the second half (awful, however, in the first half...and largely why they lost this game). Secondly, though, just 4 points for the Lakers in the second half on the break. If you aren’t controlling your boards, hard to get on the break. Lastly, the Lakers lost the points in the paint 52-44. That’s tied into a lot of that. The Lakers lost the second-chance point battle 21-10.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Reply with quote
samnizam
Star Player
Star Player


Joined: 25 Oct 2008
Posts: 1085

PostPosted: Sun May 23, 2021 3:31 pm    Post subject: Re: LAKERS -at- SUNS - 5/23 - Thoughts and :-(( Ratings

DancingBarry wrote:
Suns Win The First One... Back in the seven game series, Vogel will play his usual long game.

The Suns forced multiple timeouts from Vogel early in this game as they were scoring at will in transition. If the Lakers were missing shots (2-10 from three in half), the Suns were getting down court quick and taking advantage. They had a 16-5 advantage in transition and a 34-20 advantage on points in the paint.

Anyone not named LeBron in that first half shot 0-8 from three. The Lakers trailed 53-45 at the half.

The Lakers went to their usual starting lineup to start the third quarter. AD and LeBron saw very few opportunities in the paint and they lost the third quarter, as well.

Early in the fourth, after LeBron was fouled at the three line and missed a couple FTs, was fouled again a few seconds later, missed another and yanked down by CP3 for another foul. Tech started flying as AC/Payne/Trezz got into it. Payne was ejected, and we had that expected chippiness.

Would it ignite a Laker run or was the hole too deep?

While it was the only quarter of the game the Lakers would win, it was still one in which they struggled to score. They missed freethrows and threes. LeBron/AD never really got going and they faded as the game went along. Like last year’s playoffs, they dropped their first one 99-90.

Poor shooting, poor transition D early, poor defensive rebounding. Take care of any one of those issues and they are probably fine in this game. Few of those issues are on Vogel as far as adjustments. Getting AD better looks? Getting LeBron downhill? Yes. That may take some changes to the lineups and schemes. Let’s see how Vogel reacts.

The team has been in this situation last year, of course, with the Blazers and Rockets. That can help with composure, but can also trick them into not bringing the sense of urgency needed.


LeBron -- -- I don’t know how many times he got to the rim in the half court, but if it was more than one I’d be a little surprised. He sank a couple of threes early. When he got in the paint, help came and he had a few setups to his bigs. Shooters weren’t hitting threes, so that hurt. He had 10 points on 4-6 shooting at the half. In the second half, again with the paint packed he was very perimeter oriented. We tried to get him a few touches in the post as we went to the smaller lineups with AD. But you still never saw him attack. That LeBron, while still good, isn’t playoff LeBron. With the paint packed, we allow teams to cover LeBron by just getting an extra body in the spot away from the ball where LeBron wants to go. Bring in floor spacers and there is more room. If there is a concern, however, it’s that when we went to our AD small ball lineup in the final 8 minutes, we didn’t see LeBron getting downhill and to the rim. That makes me wonder how he is physically. Let’s see if we switch things up in the next game and what happens. Hopefully, his left shoulder is fine after getting yanked down by CP3. LeBron is strong, but something awkward like that can do some damage. The Stats: He scored 18 points on 6-13 shooting (3-7 from three, 3-6 from the line) to go with 7 boards, 10 assists, 3 steals, 5 turnovers and 1 foul in 36 minutes. He was a +2.

Davis -- -- “This is on me. I take full responsibility,” AD said afterward. Ideally in this series (and most), we get AD on the move. He’s long, fast and has handles. It’s tough to cover. Additionally, he’s much better passing while facing the basket versus having his back to it when help comes. Plus, that helps him get to the line. That didn’t happen today. For the first three quarters, he played with a C and had that typically PF opportunities that push him out further. He had 7 points on 2-9 shooting in the first half with just one trip to the line (1-2). In the second half, he’d go 2-3 from the line. So, clearly we weren’t getting that aggressive AD. In the fourth, he really settled when he finally had room to maneuver. While the coaches did a really, really poor job activating him. When AD had the chance, he never switched gears. You want him attacking Ayton off the dribble and forcing the issue/fouls. Instead he settled for contested jumpers. He was outplayed by Ayton today. That’s not the AD, we know. I put this about 50% on coaching and 50% on AD. We were outscored badly on the AD-led units while LBJ was out. Vogel said the Suns did a good job limiting AD’s touches, but that “there are ways we can be better to take advantage of him.” The main adjustment in the past has simply been giving him room to work. “I’ve still got to find ways to make plays offensively,” AD said. Unleash the beast, AD. He had 0 offensive boards. The Stats: He scored 13 points on 5-16 shooting (0-2 from three, 3-5 from the line) to go with 7 boards, 2 assists, 3 blocks and 1 foul in 39 minutes. He was a -18.

Schröder -- -- Penetration is especially key against teams that don’t have anchors. When Ayton’s out of the paint, the Suns have had problems defending the rim. Schröder was getting into the paint for FTs early on or setting up his bigs, but struggled to make his FTs (3-6 in the first half). His only bucket was hitting a midrange pull-up. In the second half, he’d score a layup in transition and other in early offense (Ayton trailing the action). Another in early offense again, this team past Ayton with a tough finish. Then he’d sink a three to cut the lead to 7 late. Schröder is looking at what is behind his defender when making decisions offensively. If you want to make his defenders work harder, you need to find ways to pull the help out of the paint. The Stats: He scored 14 points on 5-7 shooting (1-2 from three, 3-6 from the line) to go with 1 board, 3 assists, 2 steals, 1 block, 4 turnovers and 3 fouls in 34 minutes. He was a -8.

Caldwell-Pope -- -- Defensively, the Suns cross matched in the last game, hiding CP3 on KCP, while KCP spent time on Booker. Again, we had KCP on Booker quite a bit. We want to send help so Booker can’t get him into the post or other vulnerable areas. The problem is when we can’t get into our set defense, we can’t send help like we want. Offensively, if KCP hits his open looks in this game and a respectable rate, this game goes down to the wire. An 0-4 first quarter start from KCP, with some wide open looks from three. He just did not look in rhythm early on. He finally hit a pull-up jumper on his last attempt of the first half to finish with 4 points on 1-6 shooting. He’d go 1-3 in the second half. Too many good looks for him to miss in this one. Passing-wise, a couple of nice sequences, including an oop to AD on an ATO handoff sequence. He’d also attack off the three line and set up AD for a dunk. The Stats: He’d score 7 points on 2-9 shooting (1-7 from three, 2-2 from the line) to go with 2 boards, 2 assists, 1 steal and 3 fouls in 35 minutes. He was a -9..

Drummond -- -- A lot of this series will come down to getting Ayton out of the paint, and one of the ways to do that is by getting him into foul trouble and on the bench. He can be foul prone, and the Lakers have several big bodies that can draw those fouls by just being active. We got Ayton’s third foul with 4 minute left in the first half as Drummond was battling down low. AD2 had 5 offensive boards in the first half. So there is one advantage to playing Drummond some minutes. But there are disadvantages. I think just looking at AD with 13 points and LeBron with 18 and very few shots for either while putting pressure on the rim says a lot. The Suns have a AD/LBJ problem...but not when Drummond is on the floor. Drummond did his job. This isn’t Drummond’s fault. It’s just the nature of playing a traditional C. Last year, we’d run McGee 5 minutes or so to start games. Usually not good minutes, but he’d eat up minutes at C. Then, we’d transition into some AD at the C spot. In this one, you saw some longer stints for Drummond, followed by Trezz coming in. In the third, we ran Drummond for 10 minutes straight to start the second half. That’s just different use of our personnel than last year and it causes some issues. Now you might have noticed how much the Suns ran on the Lakers, especially that first half. Perhaps, you are thinking that Gasol can’t keep up with that. You’ve got to remember where Gasol plays. He’s out beyond the three line on offense. He will likely be back in transition more than other other bigs who are down in the paint. One more body back in transition helps a lot. The Stats: He scored 12 points on 5-7 shooting (2-4 from the line) to go with 9 boards (7 offensive), 1 steal, 1 block, 2 turnovers and 1 foul in 19 minutes. He was a -4.

Harrell -- -- Good effort by Trezz in this one. He had 10 points in the first half on 3-3 shooting and drew a bunch of fouls. Some good moments with LeBron/Harrell. Ayton was sitting during quite a bit of Trezz’s stints, so that helps us get penetration more. Remember the last we saw the Suns that was the first time we saw that Gasol/Harrell combo on the floor. (Trezz at the 5 offensively and at the 4 defensively.) We didn’t see that tonight. We cut Trezz’s minutes short in the second half. He picked up a tech running into Payne to help stand up for AC. All that time taking freethrows, reviewing plays, issuing techs, that allowed us rest AD, so Trezz’s minutes might have been cut short some from that. The Stats: He scored 12 points on 4-5 shooting (4-5 from the line) to go with 3 boards (2 offensive), 2 steals, 2 turnovers and 2 fouls in 15 minutes. He was a +2.

Kuzma -- -- He really made some bad decisions in this one. He threw a bad cross-court pass. He fouled Booker on an offensive board in the corner to give up FTs when in the penalty. He was also blocked on a reverse in a crowd. Really disappeared. He had a good sequence or two defending CP3 on switches, but very little positive impact. The Stats: He didn’t score on 0-2 shooting (0-1 from three) to go with 3 boards, 1 assist, 1 turnover and 1 foul in 19 minutes. He was a -5.

Caruso -- -- He was 0-3 in the first half, but we were still a +2 in his 10 minutes. In the second half, he went 4-6, including a couple of threes. Outside of AC and LBJ, the rest of the team shot 2-15 from three. If that continues to happen maybe you see McLemore cracking the rotation. Defensively, that fourth quarter he was making things happen. He drew back-to-back charges (scoring a layup himself on a drive after that second stop. He then forced a turnover at midcourt, probably drawing another charge that wasn’t called and LBJ scored an And-1 off it. Those are the kind of plays that you hope get your team going and certainly will win ball games for you. But we were already down 13 to start the fourth. Good job defending Booker at times. The Stats: He scored 10 points on 4-9 shooting (2-4 from three) to go with 4 fouls in 24 minutes. He was a +1.

Horton-Tucker -- -- Some first half run where he put up 4 shots in 7 minutes. He made one twisting drive. Another layup, he missed, but LeBron cleaned it up in transition. He got snapped at AD at one point. Our problems were bigger than THT and the team actually was a +1 while he was on the floor. There is opportunity for him in this series because of the small anchors that the Suns have off their bench. That should allow him to get to the rim. The Stats: He scored 2 points on 1-4 shooting to go with 1 board, 1 assist, 1 steal and no fouls in 7 minutes. He was a +1.

Matthews -- -- We threw him on CP3 late in the game. His size defensively will be leaned on. We may switch or blitz a bit more than we have in the next games. Offensively, Wes missed all his looks from three. We needed someone to step up from three and it would have been huge if he could have knocked down a couple. He did have a nice layup curling into the paint off the dribble. The Stats: He scored 2 points on 1-4 shooting (0-3 from three) to go with 2 fouls in 12 minutes. He was a -7.

Vogel -- -- Key Moment: The chippy stretch in the fourth. LeBron got fouled on a three, made just one FT. Caruso forced a turnover on that rebound and pushout. LeBron scored an And-1 layup off that. Again, he missed the FT (so just 3 points on all that). But on the FT rebound attempt, his left arm was yanked by CP3 and LeBron went down in pain. Out on the perimeter, AC got knocked down by Payne, who ended up getting ejected. AC/Trezz picked up techs. Lakers were down 9. Trezz missed a jumphook out of that. (That’s a good situation to draw up a nice ATO for a lob or something.) Kuz was then called for a weak foul on a three, never leaving the floor, holding his arm straight up (great D twice by Kuz in that sequence). Vogel was forced to challenge it. All of this led to a ton of down time and rest for AD, so we brought him back. “This is our freaking moment,” Monty Williams said in his timeout. That call overturned, but we didn’t win the jumpball. The Suns scored on the next two possessions to push the lead back to 13. Two scores by the Lakers there and that’s a huge momentum shift. It was, indeed, the Suns moment.

Key Substitution: Starters with AC instead of Drummond down 9 as we went small. AD and LeBron did not switch gears well to take advantage. The Lakers needed to hit their threes, as well.

Key Stats: The Lakers lost the offensive board battle, 16-10. Just no excuse for that. The Lakers shot 7-26 from three. The Suns 9-28. A lot of the Laker misses in the first half, the Suns turned into transition scores. They had 16 points on the break to 5 Laker points in the first half. In the second half, the Lakers won that 4-0. First, good job dealing with the transition D in the second half (awful, however, in the first half...and largely why they lost this game). Secondly, though, just 4 points for the Lakers in the second half on the break. If you aren’t controlling your boards, hard to get on the break. Lastly, the Lakers lost the points in the paint 52-44. That’s tied into a lot of that. The Lakers lost the second-chance point battle 21-10.


First ... I blame the coach..
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Reply with quote
Startrout
Star Player
Star Player


Joined: 06 Aug 2004
Posts: 1792

PostPosted: Sun May 23, 2021 3:34 pm    Post subject:

I expected the Suns to focus on AD after the previous game and didn’t think he’d have a big night. I had hoped that LeBron would of been our unstoppable force this game, but it’s clear he doesn’t have his explosion back yet. Even though we played pretty terrible on offense we would of still of won if we didn’t miss most of our 3’s and way too many free throws. We had the open shots, but just clanked them all game long.

So yes, AD was not near aggressive enough and LeBron wasn’t attacking like we’re used to, but it was still a game we win most nights if our shots had been going in at a more normal clip. I’m not worried yet, we’re still a much better team than the Suns. We do need at least one player to have a big night every game, this game we had no one step up.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Reply with quote
Tick
Franchise Player
Franchise Player


Joined: 21 Apr 2006
Posts: 14965
Location: Raleigh, NC

PostPosted: Sun May 23, 2021 3:44 pm    Post subject:

Great recap!
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Reply with quote
PenG_
Star Player
Star Player


Joined: 01 Feb 2020
Posts: 4760

PostPosted: Sun May 23, 2021 3:53 pm    Post subject:

Thanks DB!

Many parallels to game 1 against Portland last year. AD was more aggressive in that game, but shot 8-24 and was a team worst -20 I believe. The team couldn't buy a bucket from the perimeter, and they clogged the paint even when using a small ball lineup. Lebron played an all around solid, but passive game offensively... just like today.

I'm hoping we turn it up a notch like we did against Portland. AD and Lebron went nuclear after a rough first game. This year is obviously a bigger mystery with injuries, spacing, and chemistry issues.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Reply with quote
DancingBarry
Editor-in-Chief
Editor-in-Chief


Joined: 07 Sep 2001
Posts: 38698
Location: O.C.

PostPosted: Sun May 23, 2021 4:04 pm    Post subject:

Yeah. It’s annoying because the Suns didn’t really do anything unexpected. We just tried to do what we’ve been doing. Great thing about this roster is it’s flexibility. So we’ll see which way Vogel goes.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Reply with quote
RhodyRay
Star Player
Star Player


Joined: 13 Apr 2001
Posts: 5433
Location: A room with a view!

PostPosted: Sun May 23, 2021 4:22 pm    Post subject:

First game first loss.

Lakers need to get their act together or it will be a short season.

Hopefully the Lakers will show their championship heart!
_________________
Let them HATE so long as they FEAR!
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Reply with quote
DrDent
Franchise Player
Franchise Player


Joined: 30 Jun 2016
Posts: 10807

PostPosted: Sun May 23, 2021 4:46 pm    Post subject:

Thanks db

So many different issues yet through all that if they were just respectable from 3 and fts they woulda won. So many missed open shots it was agonizing to watch at times.

I expect AD will bounce back. But I really wish when things are not going well he would just aggressively attack and go to the hoop - good things tend to happen when he does.

At least this wasnt a play-in
_________________
"One thing I admire about Kuzma is his unwavering confidence. He truly has no idea that he’s not as good as he thinks." - Killer_Z
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Reply with quote
DrDent
Franchise Player
Franchise Player


Joined: 30 Jun 2016
Posts: 10807

PostPosted: Sun May 23, 2021 5:16 pm    Post subject:

DB, quick question.

I noted when Trez came into the game; and could not help but notice almost immediately the Suns started scoring more proficiently. In fact, I believe he came in at about 5:26 in the 1st with the score tied at 17. Suns, who had previously already scored 5 straight forcing a Laker TO, then proceeded to outscore the Lakers 21-10 while he was in there. Now, when CP3 went down, he did do some nice things to get the team back within 3...but in your mind, is his presence on the defensive side of things a big factor of possibly changing momentum or the dynamic of the game, in a negative way?

For example, upon entry, Lakers proceeded to give up 8 straight points and went from a tie to down 8. In your opinion, was this cuz the Suns saw Trez and eyes got wide so they were even more assertive on offense, or it was just coincidence?

I mean, he at least did score today, so there is that.

[Edit: I was off by a minute in when he entered, and off by 2 points on the score, so changed the above]
_________________
"One thing I admire about Kuzma is his unwavering confidence. He truly has no idea that he’s not as good as he thinks." - Killer_Z
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Reply with quote
LakerLanny
Retired Number
Retired Number


Joined: 24 Oct 2001
Posts: 45814

PostPosted: Sun May 23, 2021 6:51 pm    Post subject:

You aren't going to win a lot of games in the playoffs in the modern era scoring 90 points.
_________________
Love, Laker Lanny
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Reply with quote
joeblow
Star Player
Star Player


Joined: 24 Nov 2008
Posts: 2149

PostPosted: Sun May 23, 2021 7:08 pm    Post subject:

The one bright spot for me is that generally speaking, we played defense well enough to win this one. PHX missed a lot of threes and "only" scored 99 points. If we made, say, five of our missed 11 free throws along with AD being halfway decent offensively, the game could've barely gone the other way.

Hopefully we see improvements in these areas next game.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Reply with quote
A Mad Chinaman
Star Player
Star Player


Joined: 07 Apr 2005
Posts: 5222

PostPosted: Sun May 23, 2021 7:14 pm    Post subject:

DancingBarry wrote:
Yeah. It’s annoying because the Suns didn’t really do anything unexpected. We just tried to do what we’ve been doing. Great thing about this roster is it’s flexibility. So we’ll see which way Vogel goes.
Agree that the team didn't seem to be playng at playoff level, hence a step slower than the Suns.

When CP3 went out for a few minutes, Lakers didn't take advantage of that time

Maybe seeon Drummond will be part of P&Rs where he is the Screener/Roller with either AD/LBJ with the other on the weak side to clean up on any misses

When KCP/Matthews are not hitting any of their shots, Suns will seek out that weakness and exploit it - like any other good playoff team. If Schoeder is not a consistent offensive threat, McLemore to the rescue or TNT.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Reply with quote
DancingBarry
Editor-in-Chief
Editor-in-Chief


Joined: 07 Sep 2001
Posts: 38698
Location: O.C.

PostPosted: Sun May 23, 2021 9:37 pm    Post subject:

DrDent wrote:
DB, quick question.

I noted when Trez came into the game; and could not help but notice almost immediately the Suns started scoring more proficiently. In fact, I believe he came in at about 5:26 in the 1st with the score tied at 17. Suns, who had previously already scored 5 straight forcing a Laker TO, then proceeded to outscore the Lakers 21-10 while he was in there. Now, when CP3 went down, he did do some nice things to get the team back within 3...but in your mind, is his presence on the defensive side of things a big factor of possibly changing momentum or the dynamic of the game, in a negative way?

For example, upon entry, Lakers proceeded to give up 8 straight points and went from a tie to down 8. In your opinion, was this cuz the Suns saw Trez and eyes got wide so they were even more assertive on offense, or it was just coincidence?

I mean, he at least did score today, so there is that.

[Edit: I was off by a minute in when he entered, and off by 2 points on the score, so changed the above]


There were a few problems. In regard to Trezz...do NOT play him against Ayton. That’s just bad on a few levels. Those should be Gasol minutes for sure. Having said that, part of our problem was our horrible transition D in the first half. The problem was happening before and after Trezz came in. We burned two timeouts because of that.

Additionally, our screen coverage schematically was poor and played right into the Suns hands. We need to be either more aggressive and make them move the ball sooner or we need to switch more. Let them try to iso against some of our bigger players mobile players. I think (hope) we will see a little more of that vs. the bigs hanging out too long and trying to recover when it’s much harder to (I’d like to see us make the Suns bigs be short roll playmakers).

Lastly, the problem is also just personnel. Running too many minutes with traditional bigs cause too many problems.

All that said, if they hit the high quality shots they got at a normal clip, they still probably win this one.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Reply with quote
DrDent
Franchise Player
Franchise Player


Joined: 30 Jun 2016
Posts: 10807

PostPosted: Sun May 23, 2021 10:42 pm    Post subject:

DancingBarry wrote:
DrDent wrote:
DB, quick question.

I noted when Trez came into the game; and could not help but notice almost immediately the Suns started scoring more proficiently. In fact, I believe he came in at about 5:26 in the 1st with the score tied at 17. Suns, who had previously already scored 5 straight forcing a Laker TO, then proceeded to outscore the Lakers 21-10 while he was in there. Now, when CP3 went down, he did do some nice things to get the team back within 3...but in your mind, is his presence on the defensive side of things a big factor of possibly changing momentum or the dynamic of the game, in a negative way?

For example, upon entry, Lakers proceeded to give up 8 straight points and went from a tie to down 8. In your opinion, was this cuz the Suns saw Trez and eyes got wide so they were even more assertive on offense, or it was just coincidence?

I mean, he at least did score today, so there is that.

[Edit: I was off by a minute in when he entered, and off by 2 points on the score, so changed the above]


There were a few problems. In regard to Trezz...do NOT play him against Ayton. That’s just bad on a few levels. Those should be Gasol minutes for sure. Having said that, part of our problem was our horrible transition D in the first half. The problem was happening before and after Trezz came in. We burned two timeouts because of that.

Additionally, our screen coverage schematically was poor and played right into the Suns hands. We need to be either more aggressive and make them move the ball sooner or we need to switch more. Let them try to iso against some of our bigger players mobile players. I think (hope) we will see a little more of that vs. the bigs hanging out too long and trying to recover when it’s much harder to (I’d like to see us make the Suns bigs be short roll playmakers).

Lastly, the problem is also just personnel. Running too many minutes with traditional bigs cause too many problems.

All that said, if they hit the high quality shots they got at a normal clip, they still probably win this one.


Thanks DB. And, agreed - with a game that had so many things that can be poked at, just hitting some of those shots likely give them the W.
_________________
"One thing I admire about Kuzma is his unwavering confidence. He truly has no idea that he’s not as good as he thinks." - Killer_Z
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Reply with quote
A Mad Chinaman
Star Player
Star Player


Joined: 07 Apr 2005
Posts: 5222

PostPosted: Sun May 23, 2021 11:34 pm    Post subject:

DancingBarry wrote:
DrDent wrote:
DB, quick question.

I noted when Trez came into the game; and could not help but notice almost immediately the Suns started scoring more proficiently. In fact, I believe he came in at about 5:26 in the 1st with the score tied at 17. Suns, who had previously already scored 5 straight forcing a Laker TO, then proceeded to outscore the Lakers 21-10 while he was in there. Now, when CP3 went down, he did do some nice things to get the team back within 3...but in your mind, is his presence on the defensive side of things a big factor of possibly changing momentum or the dynamic of the game, in a negative way?

For example, upon entry, Lakers proceeded to give up 8 straight points and went from a tie to down 8. In your opinion, was this cuz the Suns saw Trez and eyes got wide so they were even more assertive on offense, or it was just coincidence?

I mean, he at least did score today, so there is that.

[Edit: I was off by a minute in when he entered, and off by 2 points on the score, so changed the above]
There were a few problems. In regard to Trezz...do NOT play him against Ayton. That’s just bad on a few levels. Those should be Gasol minutes for sure. Having said that, part of our problem was our horrible transition D in the first half. The problem was happening before and after Trezz came in. We burned two timeouts because of that.

Additionally, our screen coverage schematically was poor and played right into the Suns hands. We need to be either more aggressive and make them move the ball sooner or we need to switch more. Let them try to iso against some of our bigger players mobile players. I think (hope) we will see a little more of that vs. the bigs hanging out too long and trying to recover when it’s much harder to (I’d like to see us make the Suns bigs be short roll playmakers).

Lastly, the problem is also just personnel. Running too many minutes with traditional bigs cause too many problems.

All that said, if they hit the high quality shots they got at a normal clip, they still probably win this one.
When Trezz came in during the first half, the defensive intensity (hence the TOs) and/or missing assignments happened during the initial action. Agree with not having to play against Aston. Maybe Vogel was hoping that playing him would increase the pace (it did eventually with Trezz 'rim to rim" rush and pinning Ayton).

If AD2 is not getting rebounds (9 was good but he should be getting 10-15 rebounds and NOT be out rebounded by Ayton), especially against young teams like the Suns) and setting strong screens, he is clogging the lane needlessly and without positive results. Maybe if he is not getting rebounds, maybe he can box out Ayton, or at least get fouls on Ayton

Lakers' D needs to be much better (translation: more energy)

If the shots are not following, having AD/AD2/LBJ doing post-ups to either get betters shots or get Suns in foul trouble and/or create wide open outside shots
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Reply with quote
lakerican
Star Player
Star Player


Joined: 09 May 2005
Posts: 2881

PostPosted: Mon May 24, 2021 2:44 am    Post subject:

DrDent wrote:
DB, quick question.

I noted when Trez came into the game; and could not help but notice almost immediately the Suns started scoring more proficiently. In fact, I believe he came in at about 5:26 in the 1st with the score tied at 17. Suns, who had previously already scored 5 straight forcing a Laker TO, then proceeded to outscore the Lakers 21-10 while he was in there. Now, when CP3 went down, he did do some nice things to get the team back within 3...but in your mind, is his presence on the defensive side of things a big factor of possibly changing momentum or the dynamic of the game, in a negative way?

For example, upon entry, Lakers proceeded to give up 8 straight points and went from a tie to down 8. In your opinion, was this cuz the Suns saw Trez and eyes got wide so they were even more assertive on offense, or it was just coincidence?

I mean, he at least did score today, so there is that.

[Edit: I was off by a minute in when he entered, and off by 2 points on the score, so changed the above]


The thing is not when Trezz come in, it is when Lebron get out. Same thing occurred in the 2nd and 3rd quarter. AD is supposed to be 1st option on those minutes and he just take jumpers from isos.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Reply with quote
wolfpaclaker
Retired Number
Retired Number


Joined: 29 May 2002
Posts: 55187

PostPosted: Mon May 24, 2021 3:23 am    Post subject:

My hope was to get one of two games in Phx. Then hold home court in LA.

We need to get more space for AD. One way of course is to have him at the 5. The other way. Get him more floor spacing like Marc.

Do we really need to play both Trezz and Drummond, those many minutes? Last playoffs Vogel adjusted each series. But McGee and Howard were also team guys and not so offensive minded. Trez is a 15 point a game threat as is Andre. Giving them DNPs a lot tougher.

Ultimately this could be solved by AD hitting his jump shots which he has not all season on a consistent basis. His 3 ball and outside jumpers have been off.

Defensively we need to be a little more aggressive in defending Booker. Even if it means leaving the others open, including CP3.

The Suns are a legit tough test. This is like the WCF in the 1st round.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Visit poster's website Reply with quote
yinoma2001
Retired Number
Retired Number


Joined: 19 Jun 2010
Posts: 113014

PostPosted: Mon May 24, 2021 6:17 am    Post subject:

When AD is the worst net rating player (-18), you're going to lose. I'm surprised we managed to keep it within arm's length. Very disappointed with AD's lack of effort.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Reply with quote
A Mad Chinaman
Star Player
Star Player


Joined: 07 Apr 2005
Posts: 5222

PostPosted: Mon May 24, 2021 6:59 am    Post subject:

lakerican wrote:
DrDent wrote:
DB, quick question.

I noted when Trez came into the game; and could not help but notice almost immediately the Suns started scoring more proficiently. In fact, I believe he came in at about 5:26 in the 1st with the score tied at 17. Suns, who had previously already scored 5 straight forcing a Laker TO, then proceeded to outscore the Lakers 21-10 while he was in there. Now, when CP3 went down, he did do some nice things to get the team back within 3...but in your mind, is his presence on the defensive side of things a big factor of possibly changing momentum or the dynamic of the game, in a negative way?

For example, upon entry, Lakers proceeded to give up 8 straight points and went from a tie to down 8. In your opinion, was this cuz the Suns saw Trez and eyes got wide so they were even more assertive on offense, or it was just coincidence?

I mean, he at least did score today, so there is that.

[Edit: I was off by a minute in when he entered, and off by 2 points on the score, so changed the above]
The thing is not when Trezz come in, it is when Lebron get out. Same thing occurred in the 2nd and 3rd quarter. AD is supposed to be 1st option on those minutes and he just take jumpers from isos.
Agree

However, AD is not bringing up the ball and is dependent on others on the court to always be moving/cutting/backscreening and a ball-handler getting him the ball at the right time.
Translationa: Dennis Schoeder needs to be a better floor general. If AD/AD2 are clogging up the lane, mid-range shots or floaters might be more advantageous. Maybe P&Rs with AD2 with AD on the weak side might be something to consider

When LBJ is resting, shouldn't that be Dennis the Menace time - if he wants to be recognized as a top-level PG? If not, TNT is waiting to take over.

If our self-described SG (hello, KCP) can hit some outside shots, the floor will open up.

Hopefully our "Big-to-Big" connections, whether it is High-Low or Weak-to-Strong" will eventually foul out anyone that dares to challenge our strengths that we haven't been utilizing.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Reply with quote
jodeke
Retired Number
Retired Number


Joined: 17 Nov 2007
Posts: 57775
Location: In a world where admitting to not knowing something is consider a great way to learn.

PostPosted: Mon May 24, 2021 7:07 am    Post subject:

I'm not a fan of Vogel. I didn't like his offensive schemes, lineups, or substitutions. Why didn't Gasol, Morris, or THT get some burn?

The Lakers needed an energy boost, Markieff usually sparks a boost and he's been hitting his 3s, they were needed. Gasol's been hitting his 3s and protects the rim, why wasn't he given some burn? THT is scrappy I thought he should have gotten some burn.

AD wasn't hitting his perimeter shots why didn't Vogel run plays near the rim? He has a good midrange game.

When your stars aren't shinning find another way. It's called making adjustments, coaching.
_________________
Be who you are and say what you feel because those who mind don't matter and those who matter don't mind.

America will never be destroyed from the outside. If we falter and lose our freedoms, it will be because we destroyed ourselves.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Reply with quote
Startrout
Star Player
Star Player


Joined: 06 Aug 2004
Posts: 1792

PostPosted: Mon May 24, 2021 7:40 am    Post subject:

jodeke wrote:
I'm not a fan of Vogel. I didn't like his offensive schemes, lineups, or substitutions. Why didn't Gasol, Morris, or THT get some burn?

The Lakers needed an energy boost, Markieff usually sparks a boost and he's been hitting his 3s, they were needed. Gasol's been hitting his 3s and protects the rim, why wasn't he given some burn? THT is scrappy I thought he should have gotten some burn.

AD wasn't hitting his perimeter shots why didn't Vogel run plays near the rim? He has a good midrange game.

When your stars aren't shinning find another way. It's called making adjustments, coaching.


I feel Mark would of helped on offense, but he would of gotten eaten alive on defense by forcing him to switch onto guards and other faster players. Trezz has had success against them in the past, but I could see experimenting with Gasol in the 2nd quarter next game. The best maybe just going with AD & AD2 all game or at least in the second half at center.

THT did get some burn, but he is not the defender our other guards are (yet), so he rarely would be in the game for the second half of a playoff game. With the paint packed much of the game we also needed better 3 point shooters than THT on the floor. Unfortunately, the better shooters never got going this game, but it was the better bet on the coaches part to go with who he did.

The bottom line is we got plenty of open shots and fouls to win the game, but just couldn’t make even a mediocre number of them. We’d win that game far more often than not with just average shooting from us (better shooting would of opened up the paint more as well).
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Reply with quote
A Mad Chinaman
Star Player
Star Player


Joined: 07 Apr 2005
Posts: 5222

PostPosted: Mon May 24, 2021 7:55 am    Post subject:

jodeke wrote:
I'm not a fan of Vogel. I didn't like his offensive schemes, lineups, or substitutions. Why didn't Gasol, Morris, or THT get some burn?

The Lakers needed an energy boost, Markieff usually sparks a boost and he's been hitting his 3s, they were needed. Gasol's been hitting his 3s and protects the rim, why wasn't he given some burn? THT is scrappy I thought he should have gotten some burn.

AD wasn't hitting his perimeter shots why didn't Vogel run plays near the rim? He has a good midrange game.

When your stars aren't shinning find another way. It's called making adjustments, coaching.
Markieff is probably something that Vogel would use later, considering that he hasn't been hitting his shots. Giving THT some run to get some energy was good. Maybe he was doing a "Pop Things" - translation: allowing LBJ, AD, AD2 and Schoeder figure it out on the court since they are the stars of the team.

Gasol is not a rim protecter, though he is a good defender

Imagine if Drummond was a better closer on offense that attracts double-teams - omg! Of course, we need shooters that can consistently hit outside shots - not necessary 3s.

Vogel did give LBJ an extended rest in the first half so that he can try different combinations, especially in Game 1 where the Suns were anticipated to come in with high energy given that this is their first playoffs in many years with many people attending the game

As was noted by the announcers on the broadcast, the Lakers weren't not even close to the intensity being displayed by the Suns on the court. This roster is very flexible and can adjust on the fly.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Reply with quote
JerryWest_44
Franchise Player
Franchise Player


Joined: 22 May 2004
Posts: 19760

PostPosted: Mon May 24, 2021 8:51 am    Post subject:

Im not worried about AD - he will adjust but what heck is wrong with lbj - he’s a shell of himself
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Reply with quote
jodeke
Retired Number
Retired Number


Joined: 17 Nov 2007
Posts: 57775
Location: In a world where admitting to not knowing something is consider a great way to learn.

PostPosted: Mon May 24, 2021 9:06 am    Post subject:

A Mad Chinaman wrote:

Quote:
Gasol is not a rim protecter, though he is a good defender


True. I don't mind Andre starting. I think Mark should get some burn. IMO Vogel should find a way to play Drummond, Gasol. and Harrell. I don't think he's getting the most of what he has.

Maybe he's searching for a playoff 8. I don't know. I'm just not a Vogel supporter.

Hell, what do I know about professional basketball coaching, I'm a retired real estate salesman.

I, as do many fans, have an opinion. I think we need a new coach. I hope he does something to proove me wrong. If Vogel succeeds we succeed.
_________________
Be who you are and say what you feel because those who mind don't matter and those who matter don't mind.

America will never be destroyed from the outside. If we falter and lose our freedoms, it will be because we destroyed ourselves.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Reply with quote
Dr. Laker
Franchise Player
Franchise Player


Joined: 12 Apr 2002
Posts: 15063

PostPosted: Mon May 24, 2021 10:28 am    Post subject:

Thanks, DB!

I missed the game and hoped that we would come out sharp . . . oh well.

Hopefully, Vogel will show (again) that he is a master of adjustments.
_________________
On Lakersground, a concern troll is someone who is a fan of another team, but pretends to be a Lakers fan with "concerns".
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Reply with quote
Display posts from previous:   
Post new topic    LakersGround.net Forum Index -> Thoughts and Ratings All times are GMT - 8 Hours
Goto page 1, 2  Next
Page 1 of 2
Jump to:  

 
You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot vote in polls in this forum






Graphics by uberzev
© 1995-2018 LakersGround.net. All Rights Reserved. Privacy Policy. Terms of Use.
LakersGround is an unofficial news source serving the fan community since 1995.
We are in no way associated with the Los Angeles Lakers or the National Basketball Association.


Powered by phpBB