Potential Rotations and Starting Lineup Discussion
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hype
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PostPosted: Fri Oct 08, 2021 2:32 pm    Post subject:

Laker's Fan wrote:
defense wrote:
If Jordan starts over Howard I will lose it


Not looking forward to that either, though I like Howard off the bench as an energy big that gives you a solid rim protector in non-Davis minutes.

Some of the issue may be that Davis will be out of rebounding position a lot if he’s having to cover the rim for poor perimeter defense. He’s a good but not elite rebounder, so the other ‘big’ has to clean up the glass. Russ will help with that too. Basically, we need a better version of Jordan.

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32 wrote:
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At the end of Tuesday’s practice, the first team is a small ball group for LAL composed of LeBron, AD, Westbrook, Melo and Monk. AD just hit a contested 2 from the corner, then LeBron drained a fadeaway from the baseline on the next trip down.

https://mobile.twitter.com/LakersReporter/status/144548905999696282

i get the sense that Vogel is realizing that he doesn’t have much in shooting to put around 360.
Like this lineup if Monk can channel some KCP chaser/harasser D and Melo gives us anything on the D.


The defense and rebounding would be interesting, but Monk and Melo would space really well.


I'd actually be very surprised if Howard starts for that exact reason. I think especially with Vogel talking about wanting to try and keep guys in the same rotation outside of obvious rest day shakeups setting Dwight as that energy big off the bench lets him fully acclimate to that role because I see him still getting minutes even in games where AD starts and Jordan gets little to no minutes.

Saying that, I don't love Jordan starting at all either and I think much like McGee in 2019 we will be counting the minutes he's in until he's subbed out. I also see him very, very rarely closing any games (hopefully).

Basically Jordan from 5-10 years ago would be a flawless fit for the role but not so much the current one but that's what happens when we have to pick up the vet min scraps I guess.
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PostPosted: Fri Oct 08, 2021 3:31 pm    Post subject:

If only we had kept Kieff instead of making a crazy run on small guards.

I'd feel a whole lot better having Kieff and Melo backing up AD at the 4. Kieff wasn't a dominant rebounder/ enforcer/ sniper, but at least you could put him in the starting lineup in injury situations and get a 10 and 6 with savvy play out of him.

It bugs me we're not only overly guard-heavy, but we're already redundant with those slots as-is.

Playmaker/ boxscore stuffer - Russ AND Rondo
Veteran shooter - Ellington AND Baze
Long-armed SG who can swing up to the SF - THT AND Baze (again)
Instant offense off the bench - Nunn AND Monk

Saving a few million on taxes by bumping Reaves up won't mean squat if we miss out on Finals-round money by not having a decent combo big forward off the bench like Kieff.
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PostPosted: Fri Oct 08, 2021 3:48 pm    Post subject:

MIMLaker wrote:
If only we had kept Kieff instead of making a crazy run on small guards.

I'd feel a whole lot better having Kieff and Melo backing up AD at the 4. Kieff wasn't a dominant rebounder/ enforcer/ sniper, but at least you could put him in the starting lineup in injury situations and get a 10 and 6 with savvy play out of him.

It bugs me we're not only overly guard-heavy, but we're already redundant with those slots as-is.

Playmaker/ boxscore stuffer - Russ AND Rondo
Veteran shooter - Ellington AND Baze
Long-armed SG who can swing up to the SF - THT AND Baze (again)
Instant offense off the bench - Nunn AND Monk

Saving a few million on taxes by bumping Reaves up won't mean squat if we miss out on Finals-round money by not having a decent combo big forward off the bench like Kieff.


Yep, big miss so far by Rob who's likely assuming KLove will get bought out mid-season when there's clearly a need for reinforcements NOW.
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PostPosted: Fri Oct 08, 2021 4:07 pm    Post subject:

As of right now, after learning of Ariza's injury-absence, and 2 games of preseason, I'm leaning towards some of the youngin's actually getting some run, in Reaves/Brown (contingent on Brown replacing Ayayi, for the 2-way contract, which he should, imo).

Russ- Rondo
Monk- THT, Nunn
Bazemore- Reaves, Ellington (Brown?)
LeBron- Carmelo, Oliver
AD- Dwight/DJ

This lineup keeps size on the court, while maintaining sufficient offense. The question will be, can this team pull it together, defensively. Vogel is definitely gonna be earning his new contract, this season.


Edit: After watching tonights game against the Warriors, I'm amending my lineups. Bazemore starts at the 3. Ellington off the bench, behind Reaves. Reaves has really showed out, imo.
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PostPosted: Fri Oct 08, 2021 4:40 pm    Post subject:

I see a number of comments wanting Ayayi released from his 2-way. I just don't this happening unless Ayayi is the one who asks out.

I have previously discussed his basketball credentials so I won't go there but it was reported that he had asked out from being drafted so he could sign with the team of his choice and apparently that was the Lakers. I would believe this was agreeable on both sides before the draft and his immediate signing after the draft seems to confirm this.

The Lakers will not renege on any understanding they had with Ayayi and his camp which includes the powerful Wasserman agency.

If the Lakers were willing to hold onto Kostas for 2 years to maintain relations with Giannis and their agent, they will not screw Ayayi and Wasserman.
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PostPosted: Fri Oct 08, 2021 5:40 pm    Post subject:

PlantedTanks wrote:
I see a number of comments wanting Ayayi released from his 2-way. I just don't this happening unless Ayayi is the one who asks out.

I have previously discussed his basketball credentials so I won't go there but it was reported that he had asked out from being drafted so he could sign with the team of his choice and apparently that was the Lakers. I would believe this was agreeable on both sides before the draft and his immediate signing after the draft seems to confirm this.

The Lakers will not renege on any understanding they had with Ayayi and his camp which includes the powerful Wasserman agency.

If the Lakers were willing to hold onto Kostas for 2 years to maintain relations with Giannis and their agent, they will not screw Ayayi and Wasserman.



Not going to pretend to know anything about basketball politics. But, imo, you prove your worth, if you want to stay with a team, The Lakers don't have the luxury to spend a roster spot on someone who looked iffy in summer league, and even worse in preseason. The Lakers can/should switch Brown and Ayayi's contracts.

Brown gets the 2way, and Ayayi gets the Xzhibit 10 deal. Brown is justly rewarded, and Ayayi still has a chance to prove he belongs in the NBA. Win-win for everyone.
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PostPosted: Fri Oct 08, 2021 9:04 pm    Post subject:

sonic the laker wrote:
PlantedTanks wrote:
I see a number of comments wanting Ayayi released from his 2-way. I just don't this happening unless Ayayi is the one who asks out.

I have previously discussed his basketball credentials so I won't go there but it was reported that he had asked out from being drafted so he could sign with the team of his choice and apparently that was the Lakers. I would believe this was agreeable on both sides before the draft and his immediate signing after the draft seems to confirm this.

The Lakers will not renege on any understanding they had with Ayayi and his camp which includes the powerful Wasserman agency.

If the Lakers were willing to hold onto Kostas for 2 years to maintain relations with Giannis and their agent, they will not screw Ayayi and Wasserman.



Not going to pretend to know anything about basketball politics. But, imo, you prove your worth, if you want to stay with a team, The Lakers don't have the luxury to spend a roster spot on someone who looked iffy in summer league, and even worse in preseason. The Lakers can/should switch Brown and Ayayi's contracts.

Brown gets the 2way, and Ayayi gets the Xzhibit 10 deal. Brown is justly rewarded, and Ayayi still has a chance to prove he belongs in the NBA. Win-win for everyone.


You paint an idyllic picture but that is not the reality of the NBA. How did the Lakers get to their current position as contenders for the championship? It started with the Lakers working with Klutch and agreeing to overpay KCP to minimize the $ damage that occurred when they (KCP+Agent) turned down a huge extension. I wonder who this reminds me of.

Being in the good graces of Klutch surely helped in securing the services of one Lebron James. Next was AD. Would AD be a Laker without Lebron? If Giannis signs with the Lakers in 4 or 5 years I would believe they laid the foundation with their handling of Kostas these past 2 years. At the minimum they established an indirect relationship with him.

Relationships Matter. The Wasserman agency has a lot of influence over player movement and you don't jeopardize future dealings with them over the 16th and 17th players on the Lakers.

Btw why not just sign Brown to the open 2-way spot?
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PostPosted: Fri Oct 08, 2021 9:14 pm    Post subject:

PlantedTanks wrote:
sonic the laker wrote:
PlantedTanks wrote:
I see a number of comments wanting Ayayi released from his 2-way. I just don't this happening unless Ayayi is the one who asks out.

I have previously discussed his basketball credentials so I won't go there but it was reported that he had asked out from being drafted so he could sign with the team of his choice and apparently that was the Lakers. I would believe this was agreeable on both sides before the draft and his immediate signing after the draft seems to confirm this.

The Lakers will not renege on any understanding they had with Ayayi and his camp which includes the powerful Wasserman agency.

If the Lakers were willing to hold onto Kostas for 2 years to maintain relations with Giannis and their agent, they will not screw Ayayi and Wasserman.



Not going to pretend to know anything about basketball politics. But, imo, you prove your worth, if you want to stay with a team, The Lakers don't have the luxury to spend a roster spot on someone who looked iffy in summer league, and even worse in preseason. The Lakers can/should switch Brown and Ayayi's contracts.

Brown gets the 2way, and Ayayi gets the Xzhibit 10 deal. Brown is justly rewarded, and Ayayi still has a chance to prove he belongs in the NBA. Win-win for everyone.


You paint an idyllic picture but that is not the reality of the NBA. How did the Lakers get to their current position as contenders for the championship? It started with the Lakers working with Klutch and agreeing to overpay KCP to minimize the $ damage that occurred when they (KCP+Agent) turned down a huge extension. I wonder who this reminds me of.

Being in the good graces of Klutch surely helped in securing the services of one Lebron James. Next was AD. Would AD be a Laker without Lebron? If Giannis signs with the Lakers in 4 or 5 years I would believe they laid the foundation with their handling of Kostas these past 2 years. At the minimum they established an indirect relationship with him.

Relationships Matter. The Wasserman agency has a lot of influence over player movement and you don't jeopardize future dealings with them over the 16th and 17th players on the Lakers.

Btw why not just sign Brown to the open 2-way spot?



Lakers want to keep that 15th spot open for any possible future buyouts. And, I could say the same about Ayayi/Wasserman. It's not like the Lakers would be completely cutting ties with him. Just, not wasting a spot on a player who's playing extremely subpar. I don't think the Lakers are going to jeopardize/hamstring their season, for political reasons. Could I be wrong? Sure. But, I surely hope not. Anyway, I'm not going to belabor the point. It'll be what it'll be. Either way.
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PostPosted: Fri Oct 08, 2021 9:34 pm    Post subject:

sonic the laker wrote:
PlantedTanks wrote:
sonic the laker wrote:
PlantedTanks wrote:
I see a number of comments wanting Ayayi released from his 2-way. I just don't this happening unless Ayayi is the one who asks out.

I have previously discussed his basketball credentials so I won't go there but it was reported that he had asked out from being drafted so he could sign with the team of his choice and apparently that was the Lakers. I would believe this was agreeable on both sides before the draft and his immediate signing after the draft seems to confirm this.

The Lakers will not renege on any understanding they had with Ayayi and his camp which includes the powerful Wasserman agency.

If the Lakers were willing to hold onto Kostas for 2 years to maintain relations with Giannis and their agent, they will not screw Ayayi and Wasserman.



Not going to pretend to know anything about basketball politics. But, imo, you prove your worth, if you want to stay with a team, The Lakers don't have the luxury to spend a roster spot on someone who looked iffy in summer league, and even worse in preseason. The Lakers can/should switch Brown and Ayayi's contracts.

Brown gets the 2way, and Ayayi gets the Xzhibit 10 deal. Brown is justly rewarded, and Ayayi still has a chance to prove he belongs in the NBA. Win-win for everyone.


You paint an idyllic picture but that is not the reality of the NBA. How did the Lakers get to their current position as contenders for the championship? It started with the Lakers working with Klutch and agreeing to overpay KCP to minimize the $ damage that occurred when they (KCP+Agent) turned down a huge extension. I wonder who this reminds me of.

Being in the good graces of Klutch surely helped in securing the services of one Lebron James. Next was AD. Would AD be a Laker without Lebron? If Giannis signs with the Lakers in 4 or 5 years I would believe they laid the foundation with their handling of Kostas these past 2 years. At the minimum they established an indirect relationship with him.

Relationships Matter. The Wasserman agency has a lot of influence over player movement and you don't jeopardize future dealings with them over the 16th and 17th players on the Lakers.

Btw why not just sign Brown to the open 2-way spot?



Lakers want to keep that 15th spot open for any possible future buyouts. And, I could say the same about Ayayi/Wasserman. It's not like the Lakers would be completely cutting ties with him. Just, not wasting a spot on a player who's playing extremely subpar. I don't think the Lakers are going to jeopardize/hamstring their season, for political reasons. Could I be wrong? Sure. But, I surely hope not. Anyway, I'm not going to belabor the point. It'll be what it'll be. Either way.


Yea I won't belabor the point but the 15th spot is actually a full roster spot. There is still an open 2-way which opened up when Reaves converted to a regular roster contract. These are the 16th and 17th players. The $ difference between an exhibit 10 and 2-way is close to $400,000 so yes it does matter to the player and agent. Not a win win for Ayayi for sure.
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PostPosted: Sat Oct 09, 2021 3:43 am    Post subject:

Russ
Monk
Baze
Bron
AD

Or

Russ
Baze
Bron
AD
Dwight

Either set of starters and I'm happy
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PostPosted: Sun Oct 10, 2021 10:19 am    Post subject:

Ariza, THT and Monk will be out going into the season, which are huge for this team going forward, so the rotations are up in the air...

Westbrook + Bazemore + LBJ + AD + DJ
Rondo + Nunn + Ellington + Melo + DH

With the current injuries, it won't get any easier going into the start of the season.
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PostPosted: Sun Oct 10, 2021 10:29 am    Post subject:

lakurluv wrote:
Ariza, THT and Monk will be out going into the season, which are huge for this team going forward, so the rotations are up in the air...

Westbrook + Bazemore + LBJ + AD + DJ
Rondo + Nunn + Ellington + Melo + DH

With the current injuries, it won't get any easier going into the start of the season.


Who says Monk and THT are out to start the season?
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PostPosted: Sun Oct 10, 2021 12:28 pm    Post subject:

Call me crazy but i would love a lineup like this:

WB
Monk
Kent
LeBron
AD

Bench:
Nunn/Rondo
THT/Hillbilly
Ariza/Wayne
Melo/Cam
Dwight/DJ
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PostPosted: Sun Oct 10, 2021 12:55 pm    Post subject:

West Baze LBJ Melo AD

Rondo Nunn Monk THT Dwight

30-minute starters
18-minute bench

The first team is big at every position and will put up points

The second team has the: Rondo to Dwight, 1-2 punch while being sounded by scorers.


Last edited by Lucky_Shot on Sun Oct 10, 2021 1:02 pm; edited 2 times in total
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PostPosted: Sun Oct 10, 2021 12:59 pm    Post subject:

logical24 wrote:
Call me crazy but i would love a lineup like this:

WB
Monk
Kent
LeBron
AD

Bench:
Nunn/Rondo
THT/Hillbilly
Ariza/Wayne
Melo/Cam
Dwight/DJ


Call you crazy for what reason? That lineup will stomp some teams with pure speed, athleticism, and offensive execution. Vogel has a lot of variations to toy with, and so does LeBron & AD now.
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PostPosted: Mon Oct 11, 2021 8:50 am    Post subject:

I was actually really encouraged by Vogel's lineup for that one five-minute segment of game time last night vs. the Suns in the second half of the 2nd quarter.

We had Westbrook, Ellington, Bazemore, AD and Dwight on the floor, and defensively they went AT IT. While it was nice they scored 15 points in that stretch (mostly from FTs and fast break points), the fact they kept the Suns from scoring even one point that entire time was fantastic (CP3, Ayton, Payne and Crowder were on the floor).

Bazemore in particular is a legit defensive stud. His 3P shooting was icing on the cake for me in the game, but I loved watching him hound CP3, strip Ayton from a dunk, and harass with a double team anyone he scrambled after.

Yeah, it's just pre-season, but my main question mark about if we lost too much defensively over the last two years to seriously compete for a title. It's good to see that there are some new faces like Bazemore that will help us a lot in that area (if we can stay healthy overall).
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PostPosted: Mon Oct 11, 2021 9:35 am    Post subject:

Closing, WB-Bron-AD, gotta add 2 shooters, one of them gotta be able to defend wings, Bazemore and Melo
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PostPosted: Mon Oct 11, 2021 3:30 pm    Post subject:

POST INJURY LINE UPS TO START SEASON:

Westbrook
Nunn
Bazemore
Lebron
Davis

Rondo
Monk
Ellington
Melo
Howard

DJ has no business playing but I'm sure will see minutes. I would prefer monk starting but I think we need Rondo to play...a lot. Rondo is so good with the bigs and running the offense when Lebron is out.
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PostPosted: Sun Oct 17, 2021 6:56 pm    Post subject:

textbook wrote:
POST INJURY LINE UPS TO START SEASON:

Westbrook
Nunn
Bazemore
Lebron
Davis

Rondo
Monk
Ellington
Melo
Howard

DJ has no business playing but I'm sure will see minutes. I would prefer monk starting but I think we need Rondo to play...a lot. Rondo is so good with the bigs and running the offense when Lebron is out.


Really like the lineup. I don't know if they stagger LBJ and Russ, or have a true 2nd line come in at the same time. Like Rondo with the shooters with Howard pulling down boards.
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PostPosted: Tue Oct 19, 2021 1:49 pm    Post subject:

Chris Hayes wrote:

    Lakers expected to go with a starting lineup of Russell Westbrook, Kent Bazemore, LeBron James, Anthony Davis and DeAndre Jordan in tonight’s season-opener against the Warriors, league sources tell @YahooSports.
Oct 19, 2021ReplyRetweetFavorite


Kent Bazemore won the starting shooting guard job. Deandre Jordon won the starting center spot.
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PostPosted: Tue Oct 19, 2021 1:53 pm    Post subject:

DAJ is a true hooper! The haters are full of it and are gonna eat crow!
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PostPosted: Tue Oct 19, 2021 2:02 pm    Post subject:

I'm pleased with the potential defensive strength of the starting lineup, but it's ironic that we focused on improved outside shooting this off season and these five don't really show it on paper.

Of course, injuries are a major issue right now so it isn't surprising. If everyone were healthy, I wonder what we would've rolled out there instead. Maybe:

WB
Ellington
Lebron
Ariza
AD
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PostPosted: Tue Oct 19, 2021 2:46 pm    Post subject:

I'll be interested to see what Austin Reaves does when he gets in.
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PostPosted: Tue Oct 19, 2021 3:05 pm    Post subject:

Regardless, I think the closing lineup for now will likely be

Russ
Baze
Bron
Melo
AD
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PostPosted: Tue Oct 19, 2021 3:21 pm    Post subject:

Kobetan wrote:
Regardless, I think the closing lineup for now will likely be

Russ
Baze
Bron
Melo
AD


Imo Melo doesn’t play enough defense to be in any closing lineup.

I see:

Russ
Nunn
Baze
LBJ
AD

In this lineup I could see Monk over Nunn for shooting, if he plays good enough defense.

Small ball I could see:
Russ
Monk
THT (Reaves until THT is healthy)
LBJ
AD

I actually think Reaves will get a few games closing out, because he has the basketball IQ so one of THT, Monk or Nunn could get squeezed.
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