| View previous topic :: View next topic |
| Author |
Message |
emplay
Site Staff
Joined: 15 Apr 2001
Posts: 25550
|
|
| Back to top |
|
 |
emplay
Site Staff
Joined: 15 Apr 2001
Posts: 25550
|
|
| Back to top |
|
|
MIMLaker
Franchise Player
Joined: 18 Jul 2001
Posts: 10015
Location: Los Angeles/ Alhambra, CA
|
 Posted: Wed Apr 13, 2022 11:47 am Post subject: Re: Ranking 6 Realistic Russell Westbrook Trade Ideas for Los Angeles Lakers |
|
|
I'd do the Hayward/Oubre/Plumlee deal in a cold minute. If we can somehow keep Monk, re-sign Dwight (and actaully USE HIM) and then sign even a passable combo forward - Farouq Al-Aminu and Alize Johnson were available all year - we could run with this next year and be way better off:
C - AD/ Plumlee/ Dwight
PF - LBJ/ Gabriel/ combo forward
SF - Oubre/ Johnson
SG - Heyward/ Reaves
PG - Monk/ Nunn/ THT |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
gng930
Franchise Player
Joined: 13 Apr 2001
Posts: 11476
|
| Posted: Wed Apr 13, 2022 1:36 pm Post subject: Re: Ranking 6 Realistic Russell Westbrook Trade Ideas for Los Angeles Lakers |
|
|
| MIMLaker wrote: |
I'd do the Hayward/Oubre/Plumlee deal in a cold minute. If we can somehow keep Monk, re-sign Dwight (and actaully USE HIM) and then sign even a passable combo forward - Farouq Al-Aminu and Alize Johnson were available all year - we could run with this next year and be way better off:
C - AD/ Plumlee/ Dwight
PF - LBJ/ Gabriel/ combo forward
SF - Oubre/ Johnson
SG - Heyward/ Reaves
PG - Monk/ Nunn/ THT |
I'll take that lineup any day. My only reservation would be whether we should use the MLE on a better defender but that's just nit-picking.
_________________
Luxury Tax/FA Spreadsheet (Save to your Google Drive to edit) |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Threatt_Level
Starting Rotation
Joined: 30 Jul 2014
Posts: 467
|
| Posted: Wed Apr 13, 2022 2:04 pm Post subject: Re: Ranking 6 Realistic Russell Westbrook Trade Ideas for Los Angeles Lakers |
|
|
| MIMLaker wrote: |
I'd do the Hayward/Oubre/Plumlee deal in a cold minute. If we can somehow keep Monk, re-sign Dwight (and actaully USE HIM) and then sign even a passable combo forward - Farouq Al-Aminu and Alize Johnson were available all year - we could run with this next year and be way better off:
C - AD/ Plumlee/ Dwight
PF - LBJ/ Gabriel/ combo forward
SF - Oubre/ Johnson
SG - Heyward/ Reaves
PG - Monk/ Nunn/ THT |
Good luck getting Heyward on the court. He's more injured than AD. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Hanging from Rafters
Star Player
Joined: 31 Jul 2018
Posts: 4450
|
| Posted: Wed Apr 13, 2022 6:30 pm Post subject: |
|
|
Thanks emplay...some good reporting here!
We’ll be speculating, hoping, dreaming, contemplating for weeks to come, it’s good to have some targets for our energy!
I’m dreaming of a three team deal with the Pacers and Hornets to get Turner from them and Oubre/Rozier from the Hornets. Not really interested in Heild or Hayward, would rather keep Monk...so if we can save a draft pick and/or
THT to avoid either I’m ecstatic. I would include FRP or two plus THT if it was required to get Turner/Oubre/Rozier and could easily find use for Hayward or Heild if we needed to take them to facilitate the deal.
I believe Turner/Oubre/Rozier provides an almost optimum fit for not only a starting 5 but also a great bench plus injury insurance.
Turner/Cousins/Dwight
AD/Melo/Gabriel
LBJ/Oubre/Stanley
Monk/(Heild or Hayward or THT)/Reeves
Rozier/Nunn/Avery
Elite rim protection with ok (not great) 3pt capability, rebounding, playmaking
Defense and 3pt capability with depth at the wing
Nice shooters in the back court, with some defense capabilities |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
LaxT
Star Player
Joined: 23 Sep 2002
Posts: 2536
|
| Posted: Thu Apr 14, 2022 12:10 am Post subject: |
|
|
| It depends on LBJ's decision. If LBJ does not sign extension, you either (1) trade him, supposedly to Cleveland, and rebuild, or (2) assemble the most competitive roster possible around him for one year. Due to lack of assets/tools, I doubt the later approach could yield a contender especially if you don't further mortgage the future. In the first scenario, Westbrook might stay for another year. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
ThePageDude
Star Player
Joined: 25 Jul 2002
Posts: 2589
|
| Posted: Thu Apr 14, 2022 5:18 am Post subject: |
|
|
| LaxT wrote: | | It depends on LBJ's decision. If LBJ does not sign extension, you either (1) trade him, supposedly to Cleveland, and rebuild, or (2) assemble the most competitive roster possible around him for one year. Due to lack of assets/tools, I doubt the later approach could yield a contender especially if you don't further mortgage the future. In the first scenario, Westbrook might stay for another year. |
The LBJ trade scenario is plausible (even if Jeanie would be loath to do it) since it kills two birds with one stone i.e. reduces LBJ/Klutch pressure and alleviates lux-tax for 2022-23 and repeater for 2023-24. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
cganesh75
Starting Rotation
Joined: 03 Feb 2008
Posts: 513
Location: orlando, FL
|
| Posted: Thu Apr 14, 2022 8:15 am Post subject: |
|
|
| i would rather trade LBJ and AD and let Russ be a 1 man show next year and finish out his contract.. if a good trade pops up then we can address it. otherwise dont give up more to trade him. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
A Mad Chinaman
Star Player
Joined: 07 Apr 2005
Posts: 6148
|
| Posted: Thu Apr 14, 2022 10:57 am Post subject: |
|
|
| Hanging from Rafters wrote: | Turner/Oubre/Rozier provides an almost optimum fit for not only a starting 5 but also a great bench plus injury insurance.
Turner/Cousins/Dwight
AD/Melo/Gabriel
LBJ/Oubre/Stanley
Monk/(Heild or Hayward or THT)/Reeves
Rozier/Nunn/Avery
Elite rim protection with ok (not great) 3pt capability, rebounding, playmaking
Defense and 3pt capability with depth at the wing
Nice shooters in the back court, with some defense capabilities |
Not an elite team.
LBJ at the 3 is a stretch
AD would play a lot at the 5 with Dwight playing when AD injured
Boogie doesn’t play any D
Hield doesn’t play D |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
gng930
Franchise Player
Joined: 13 Apr 2001
Posts: 11476
|
| Posted: Thu Apr 14, 2022 11:39 am Post subject: |
|
|
Yup we'll get murdered by big wings with that squad.
_________________
Luxury Tax/FA Spreadsheet (Save to your Google Drive to edit) |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Hanging from Rafters
Star Player
Joined: 31 Jul 2018
Posts: 4450
|
| Posted: Thu Apr 14, 2022 1:34 pm Post subject: |
|
|
| A Mad Chinaman wrote: | | Hanging from Rafters wrote: | Turner/Oubre/Rozier provides an almost optimum fit for not only a starting 5 but also a great bench plus injury insurance.
Turner/Cousins/Dwight
AD/Melo/Gabriel
LBJ/Oubre/Stanley
Monk/(Heild or Hayward or THT)/Reeves
Rozier/Nunn/Avery
Elite rim protection with ok (not great) 3pt capability, rebounding, playmaking
Defense and 3pt capability with depth at the wing
Nice shooters in the back court, with some defense capabilities |
Not an elite team.
LBJ at the 3 is a stretch
AD would play a lot at the 5 with Dwight playing when AD injured
Boogie doesn’t play any D
Hield doesn’t play D |
We disagree about LeBron being a stretch as SF and that’s ok. A Look at the starters and core rotation more than the reserves may give you a different impression of the team. We didn’t have three NBA quality starters at C, PF, SF and that flawed roster construction may have been our biggest problem. This roster proposal increases the starting potential at those positions from 2 to 4. Turner can start at C or Oubre can start at SF depending on where AD and LBJ plays.
You omitted mentioning Turner who leads the league in Blocks per game and failed to mention that Turner would play a lot at the 5, presumably more than AD who would spend most of his time at the 4 providing two of the top 5 shot blockers in the league rim protecting.
Turner would be the C whether AD is injured or not. If AD was out then LeBron would play PF and Oubre SF.
Boogie as a back up 3rd C behind Turner and AD would not be relied upon for significant minutes and not for D anyway.
The core 7 relied upon to win games:
Turner
AD
LeBron Oubre
Monk
Rozier Nunn
Agree about Heild, said don’t want him or Hayward but if we have to take either to get the deal done there is some use for them if required. Notice I have Monk as the starter, not Heild.
Last edited by Hanging from Rafters on Thu Apr 14, 2022 2:07 pm; edited 7 times in total |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Hanging from Rafters
Star Player
Joined: 31 Jul 2018
Posts: 4450
|
| Posted: Thu Apr 14, 2022 1:42 pm Post subject: |
|
|
| gng930 wrote: | | Yup we'll get murdered by big wings with that squad. |
Oubre at 6’7”, Garbriel at 6’9” (didn’t he guard Clay Thompson in a game this year as the primary match up?) and Stanley at 6’6” makes it look as if we would not get destroyed by big wings. Can’t win on paper tho so would have to see how it works out. Neither knows, we’re both just speculating but not sure where you are coming from with the assessment. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
lakeshowtacular
Starting Rotation
Joined: 22 Jul 2010
Posts: 706
|
| Posted: Thu Apr 14, 2022 2:32 pm Post subject: |
|
|
Preference 1 - Russ to the Pacers for Turner and Brogdon/Hield (1 not both). We'd have to include picks but that makes us better in many ways, if we get 60gms each out of them (which is not guaranteed). This move makes us competitive, and breaks down our 1 large unmovable contract, into 2 more manageable contracts. If we fill out the roster properly than this is my ultimate preference.
Preference 2 - Russ and the 1st to the Hornets for Hayward, Rozier, Oubre, and a 2nd. This is an upgrade over this seasons roster, but I think we still need to make some moves to address size and depth. Oubre helps on wings, but Hayward and Rozier are both undersized. Our strength in 2020 was our size and length, we need to get back to that, so if we could get a third team involved, I'd like this better.
Preference 3 - Russ for Wall / Russ to OKC - both of these moves are high risk since Wall hasn't played, and if OKC has to give us a bunch of assets, I'm not sure we will use them right. We have been making blunder after blunder with our trades and signings - Monk excluded (Zubac, Not tendering Randle so we could get something, trading 3/1 assets in the last 2 major trades, not keeping AC, overpaying slightly for AD - which isn't bad in itself, but is compounded by the other moves). So I think these 2 moves are lateral and don't move us forward next year. With the exception being Wall coming to LA and playing All Star Level.
Just Say NO to all things Knicks!!!
Another thing we got away from is team guys - Javale, Rondo, Dudz, their presence and energy has been missed. Hope this gets addressed too!
_________________
Magic*Kobe*LBJ*AD*Cap |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
gng930
Franchise Player
Joined: 13 Apr 2001
Posts: 11476
|
| Posted: Thu Apr 14, 2022 2:48 pm Post subject: |
|
|
| Hanging from Rafters wrote: | | gng930 wrote: | | Yup we'll get murdered by big wings with that squad. |
Oubre at 6’7”, Garbriel at 6’9” (didn’t he guard Clay Thompson in a game this year as the primary match up?) and Stanley at 6’6” makes it look as if we would not get destroyed by big wings. Can’t win on paper tho so would have to see how it works out. Neither knows, we’re both just speculating but not sure where you are coming from with the assessment. |
I guess I should provide some context. I can imagine those guys hanging with some of the better wings but if we're depending on Stanley and Gabriel to play extended minutes against the likes of Tatum, Kawahi, and PG again then we're in trouble. I'll give you Kelly Oubre though but even then you have to consider the possibility of mismatch hunting. Rozier will be slim pickings and doesn't nearly enough have the offensive game to compensate for it. I guess you could send him to the bench in favor of Oubre but is having $20 million sitting on your bench really a wise strategy? I guess I'm not really in favor of any trade involving Rozier for that reason.
_________________
Luxury Tax/FA Spreadsheet (Save to your Google Drive to edit) |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
DShotMaker1824
Star Player
Joined: 16 Feb 2012
Posts: 8769
|
| Posted: Thu Apr 14, 2022 8:26 pm Post subject: |
|
|
I wonder if emplay would write an article about 6 realistic LeBron James trades so that it could make the rounds on Twitter, First Take and Undisputed.
This team needs to be blown up this off season.
_________________
"Through the legs to the left, through the legs to the right, we don't run them Laker plays, we just Kobe fadeaway..."
|
|
| Back to top |
|
|
emplay
Site Staff
Joined: 15 Apr 2001
Posts: 25550
|
| Posted: Mon Apr 18, 2022 3:42 pm Post subject: |
|
|
If there's intel that the Lakers are looking to trade LeBron, I will - if my editors want me to write that - I will. But if LeBron was going to be traded, he would dictate the team and the Lakers wouldn't have much say in that. What happened with Harden and Philly re: the Nets
_________________
Salary Cap Strategist and Columnist at Bleacher Report and on Twitter at http://www.twitter.com/EricPincus |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Halflife
Franchise Player
Joined: 15 Aug 2015
Posts: 16754
|
| Posted: Mon Apr 18, 2022 6:51 pm Post subject: |
|
|
| charlotte deal seems ok if we can avoid heyward. however none put us close to contention. but may that's ok for a few more years. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
cthroatgtr
Star Player
Joined: 21 Aug 2005
Posts: 1375
|
| Posted: Tue Apr 19, 2022 10:41 am Post subject: |
|
|
| Just a reminder of how stupid that trade was to begin with. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
A Mad Chinaman
Star Player
Joined: 07 Apr 2005
Posts: 6148
|
| Posted: Tue Apr 19, 2022 2:28 pm Post subject: |
|
|
| gng930 wrote: | | Hanging from Rafters wrote: | | gng930 wrote: | | Yup we'll get murdered by big wings with that squad. |
Oubre at 6’7”, Garbriel at 6’9” (didn’t he guard Clay Thompson in a game this year as the primary match up?) and Stanley at 6’6” makes it look as if we would not get destroyed by big wings. Can’t win on paper tho so would have to see how it works out. Neither knows, we’re both just speculating but not sure where you are coming from with the assessment. |
I guess I should provide some context. I can imagine those guys hanging with some of the better wings but if we're depending on Stanley and Gabriel to play extended minutes against the likes of Tatum, Kawahi, and PG again then we're in trouble. I'll give you Kelly Oubre though but even then you have to consider the possibility of mismatch hunting. Rozier will be slim pickings and doesn't nearly enough have the offensive game to compensate for it. I guess you could send him to the bench in favor of Oubre but is having $20 million sitting on your bench really a wise strategy? I guess I'm not really in favor of any trade involving Rozier for that reason. |
There are not many players that can effectively guard Tatum, Kwahi and PG13 over an entire game. The tried and true axiom is that one has to make these players work hard to entire game on both sides of court with an effective set of everchanging defensive scheme (see how the Celtics limit the output of Kyrie and KD, of which most - including myself - are better than the players previously mentioned.
Maybe we can consider players that made LBJ work hard for his points who are available
Does good offense create good defense - no. Bad offense makes any team look bad when playing defense
Does good defense create good offense - yes. Steals, tips and rebounds will lead to easy baskets
IMHO |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
ThePageDude
Star Player
Joined: 25 Jul 2002
Posts: 2589
|
| Posted: Tue Apr 19, 2022 5:38 pm Post subject: |
|
|
| A Mad Chinaman wrote: |
<snip>
Does good offense create good defense - no.
<snip>
|
Actually it can: great offensive execution limits defensive rebounds, increases offensive rebounds, limits outlet passes, reduces opportunities for the defense to run fast breaks, allows the offensive team to get back on defense since all 5 players are well-positioned at the time of the (clean) shot. It's the mirror case of what you said about great defense fueling good offense. Both are true.
Last edited by ThePageDude on Wed Apr 20, 2022 4:36 am; edited 1 time in total |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
DShotMaker1824
Star Player
Joined: 16 Feb 2012
Posts: 8769
|
| Posted: Tue Apr 19, 2022 5:50 pm Post subject: |
|
|
| emplay wrote: | | If there's intel that the Lakers are looking to trade LeBron, I will - if my editors want me to write that - I will. But if LeBron was going to be traded, he would dictate the team and the Lakers wouldn't have much say in that. What happened with Harden and Philly re: the Nets |
Fair point. I have a gut feeling that things might open up as certain teams get eliminated from the playoffs.
_________________
"Through the legs to the left, through the legs to the right, we don't run them Laker plays, we just Kobe fadeaway..."
|
|
| Back to top |
|
|
A Mad Chinaman
Star Player
Joined: 07 Apr 2005
Posts: 6148
|
| Posted: Tue Apr 19, 2022 9:48 pm Post subject: |
|
|
| Hanging from Rafters wrote: | | A Mad Chinaman wrote: | | Hanging from Rafters wrote: | Turner/Oubre/Rozier provides an almost optimum fit for not only a starting 5 but also a great bench plus injury insurance.
Turner/Cousins/Dwight
AD/Melo/Gabriel
LBJ/Oubre/Stanley
Monk/(Heild or Hayward or THT)/Reeves
Rozier/Nunn/Avery
Elite rim protection with ok (not great) 3pt capability, rebounding, playmaking
Defense and 3pt capability with depth at the wing
Nice shooters in the back court, with some defense capabilities |
Not an elite team.
LBJ at the 3 is a stretch
AD would play a lot at the 5 with Dwight playing when AD injured
Boogie doesn’t play any D
Hield doesn’t play D |
"We disagree about LeBron being a stretch as SF and that’s ok. A Look at the starters and core rotation more than the reserves may give you a different impression of the team. We didn’t have three NBA quality starters at C, PF, SF and that flawed roster construction may have been our biggest problem. This roster proposal increases the starting potential at those positions from 2 to 4. Turner can start at C or Oubre can start at SF depending on where AD and LBJ plays.
You omitted mentioning Turner who leads the league in Blocks per game and failed to mention that Turner would play a lot at the 5, presumably more than AD who would spend most of his time at the 4 providing two of the top 5 shot blockers in the league rim protecting.
Turner would be the C whether AD is injured or not. If AD was out then LeBron would play PF and Oubre SF.
Boogie as a back up 3rd C behind Turner and AD would not be relied upon for significant minutes and not for D anyway.
The core 7 relied upon to win games:
Turner
AD
LeBron Oubre
Monk
Rozier Nunn
Agree about Heild, said don’t want him or Hayward but if we have to take either to get the deal done there is some use for them if required. Notice I have Monk as the starter, not Heild. |
"Turner said he thought they saw him as nothing more than a "glorified role player," telling The Athletic's Jared Weiss that he wanted to "be a more prominent night-in, night-out guy on the offensive side of the ball instead of someone who is asked to be a floor spacer and hide in the shadows.""
"Turner is a very good player. He defends near an All-Defensive level. His 3-point shooting provides critical floor spacing. He scores efficiently both from beyond the arc and at the rim – though on a limited number of attempts."
"However, that’s part of his value. Many stars dominate the ball. Turner is the rare high-level player who contributes plenty without the ball in his hands.
Of course, there are egos involved, and Turner doesn’t sound content to average just 12.9 points per game. As much as people can talk about his value, there’s a prestige tied to scoring. Peripheral contributions don’t boost status the same way.
Could Turner handle a bigger load? Probably. But that isn’t quite the right question. The right question: Could Turner be good enough in a larger role for a winning team to justify taking the ball from other players and giving it to him significantly more often?
That’s less clear."
(https://www.cbssports.com/nba/news/myles-turner-injury-update-pacers-star-to-be-out-another-couple-weeks-with-foot-issue/)
~ Will Turner be willing to be the third option behind LBJ and AD?
What's more important is who will be the next head coach
"A lot of coaches with options also saw how the Lakers treated Frank Vogel — short contract at below market value price, he was treated like an interchangeable piece who was lucky to coach for this franchise — and will have a lot more demands in their deal. If the Lakers want a coach of that caliber, they will have to pay the going rate and give that coach a say in personnel issues."
https://nba.nbcsports.com/2022/04/15/brad-stevens-im-definitely-not-leaving-to-go-to-the-lakers-i-know-that-for-a-fact/
As shared by Laker media pundits - LBJ/AD didn't talk very much to Westbrook and Russ states that LBJ/AD very rarely "let Russ be Russ."
One wonders what happened between the time that LBJ/AD aggresively pursued/recruited and "The Great Disconnect?"
How was Vogel suppose to coach these three players that are making 5-6 times more money per year?
https://clutchpoints.com/lakers-news-russell-westbrook-calls-out-lebron-james-anthony-davis-1-big-lie-during-2021-22-season/ |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
|
