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DaMuleRules
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PostPosted: Fri Nov 18, 2022 5:44 pm    Post subject:

jodeke wrote:
DaMuleRules wrote:
jodeke wrote:
DaMuleRules wrote:
jodeke wrote:

It's been said, "If we divided all the money in the world equally, in a short time the rich would be rich again, and the poor would be poor."


Yeah, maybe by a rich person to justify not sharing the wealth, because that is bullstuff.


I don't know who said it. It may be a stretch but it makes sense. You can take the money but you can't take the wherewithal.


Wherewithal? The idea of super wealthy getting there through hard work and pulling up their bootstraps is a myth. By far and away, they got their wealth through privilege and opportunity. The saying doesn't make sense. It's not like if all the money were distributed equally amongst the world's populace, the same 1%ers would just earn all their wealth back.


I'm not questioning how they got their wealth and I didn't say super wealthy. That's a different animal. I posted a hypothesis.

Not having any empirical proof I say the hypo is a stretch but it makes sense to me. You're adamant in your opinion. Do you have proof or is that an opinion?


I couldn't have been more clear about why the statement doesn't hold water. So I ask you, how does it make sense?

If the world's wealth was evenly distributed amongst everyone on the planet, how will the rich just become rich again while the poor just go beck to being poor? The clear implication is that those who are poor are destined to be poor because that's their natural inclination and unable to be otherwise, while the wealthy have a superior ability to amass wealth instead of the reality where wealth comes from privilege, opportunity and elitism. The concept you claim makes sense is classist nonsense and is offensive to the underprivileged.
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jodeke
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PostPosted: Fri Nov 18, 2022 6:34 pm    Post subject:

DaMuleRules wrote:
jodeke wrote:
DaMuleRules wrote:
jodeke wrote:
DaMuleRules wrote:
jodeke wrote:

It's been said, "If we divided all the money in the world equally, in a short time the rich would be rich again, and the poor would be poor."


Yeah, maybe by a rich person to justify not sharing the wealth, because that is bullstuff.


I don't know who said it. It may be a stretch but it makes sense. You can take the money but you can't take the wherewithal.


Wherewithal? The idea of super wealthy getting there through hard work and pulling up their bootstraps is a myth. By far and away, they got their wealth through privilege and opportunity. The saying doesn't make sense. It's not like if all the money were distributed equally amongst the world's populace, the same 1%ers would just earn all their wealth back.


I'm not questioning how they got their wealth and I didn't say super wealthy. That's a different animal. I posted a hypothesis.

Not having any empirical proof I say the hypo is a stretch but it makes sense to me. You're adamant in your opinion. Do you have proof or is that an opinion?


I couldn't have been more clear about why the statement doesn't hold water. So I ask you, how does it make sense?

If the world's wealth was evenly distributed amongst everyone on the planet, how will the rich just become rich again while the poor just go beck to being poor? The clear implication is that those who are poor are destined to be poor because that's their natural inclination and unable to be otherwise, while the wealthy have a superior ability to amass wealth instead of the reality where wealth comes from privilege, opportunity and elitism. The concept you claim makes sense is classist nonsense and is offensive to the underprivileged.


Wealthy people use given resources to enhance and build their wealth. They seem to have the wherewithal/drive. IMO poor people don't have that drive. I'm not all-encompassing. I'll narrow it down to a majority.
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PostPosted: Fri Nov 18, 2022 7:30 pm    Post subject:

Actually, if you divided all wealth equally and let nature take its course, yes, a few people would own almost everything again shortly. The key here is the role of government to both stem that tide and to redress it when it happens. That’s called regulation and taxation, which just happen to be the two things the wealthy fight hardest against.
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PostPosted: Sat Nov 19, 2022 12:54 am    Post subject:

DaMuleRules wrote:
jodeke wrote:
DaMuleRules wrote:
jodeke wrote:
DaMuleRules wrote:
jodeke wrote:

It's been said, "If we divided all the money in the world equally, in a short time the rich would be rich again, and the poor would be poor."


Yeah, maybe by a rich person to justify not sharing the wealth, because that is bullstuff.


I don't know who said it. It may be a stretch but it makes sense. You can take the money but you can't take the wherewithal.


Wherewithal? The idea of super wealthy getting there through hard work and pulling up their bootstraps is a myth. By far and away, they got their wealth through privilege and opportunity. The saying doesn't make sense. It's not like if all the money were distributed equally amongst the world's populace, the same 1%ers would just earn all their wealth back.


I'm not questioning how they got their wealth and I didn't say super wealthy. That's a different animal. I posted a hypothesis.

Not having any empirical proof I say the hypo is a stretch but it makes sense to me. You're adamant in your opinion. Do you have proof or is that an opinion?


I couldn't have been more clear about why the statement doesn't hold water. So I ask you, how does it make sense?

If the world's wealth was evenly distributed amongst everyone on the planet, how will the rich just become rich again while the poor just go beck to being poor? The clear implication is that those who are poor are destined to be poor because that's their natural inclination and unable to be otherwise, while the wealthy have a superior ability to amass wealth instead of the reality where wealth comes from privilege, opportunity and elitism. The concept you claim makes sense is classist nonsense and is offensive to the underprivileged.


If you distribute all the wealth equally right now, not all rich people will remain rich and not all poor people will go back to being poor. Factors like education and upbringing and character will always play a role. We all know stories of ex-athletes getting rich and blowing everything away. Or like that guy who was a homeless immigrant in Paris and now owns a chain of restaurants.
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PostPosted: Sat Nov 19, 2022 5:08 pm    Post subject:

He's reinstating Trump. Just announced.
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PostPosted: Sun Nov 20, 2022 9:09 am    Post subject:

Bloomberg: Trump Says He’ll Stick to Own Platform; Cites Twitter "Problems"
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PostPosted: Sun Nov 20, 2022 9:39 am    Post subject:

Trump’s Critics Openly Cast Him as ‘a Loser‘
November 19, 2022 at 10:49 am EST By Taegan Goddard 45 Comments

LINK

I don't think Trump will be the 2024 nominee and if he's not he'll burn the house down.
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ChefLinda
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PostPosted: Sun Nov 20, 2022 10:27 am    Post subject:

jodeke wrote:
Trump’s Critics Openly Cast Him as ‘a Loser‘
November 19, 2022 at 10:49 am EST By Taegan Goddard 45 Comments

LINK

I don't think Trump will be the 2024 nominee and if he's not he'll burn the house down.


I know there is crossover Trump talk in this thread related to Twitter, but I think the main Trump discussion belongs in the politics thread. Thanks.
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lakersken80
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PostPosted: Sun Nov 20, 2022 10:29 am    Post subject:

The traffic must be going way down if he needs 45 back on the platform.
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jodeke
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PostPosted: Sun Nov 20, 2022 10:50 am    Post subject:

ChefLinda wrote:
jodeke wrote:
Trump’s Critics Openly Cast Him as ‘a Loser‘
November 19, 2022 at 10:49 am EST By Taegan Goddard 45 Comments

LINK

I don't think Trump will be the 2024 nominee and if he's not he'll burn the house down.


I know there is crossover Trump talk in this thread related to Twitter, but I think the main Trump discussion belongs in the politics thread. Thanks.


My bad CL. That's where I meant to post it. I claim a senior citizen mulligan.
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PostPosted: Sun Nov 20, 2022 10:53 am    Post subject:

No problem.
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PostPosted: Sun Nov 20, 2022 11:06 am    Post subject:

ChefLinda wrote:
Bloomberg: Trump Says He’ll Stick to Own Platform; Cites Twitter "Problems"


He must have thought Trump would be running toward Twitter right away. This is actually savvy from Trump's perspective as he can't allow the perception that Elon is controlling events and that he's somehow grateful to Musk.
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PostPosted: Sun Nov 20, 2022 11:29 am    Post subject:

Wilt wrote:
ChefLinda wrote:
Bloomberg: Trump Says He’ll Stick to Own Platform; Cites Twitter "Problems"


He must have thought Trump would be running toward Twitter right away. This is actually savvy from Trump's perspective as he can't allow the perception that Elon is controlling events and that he's somehow grateful to Musk.


Observing two egotistical, narcissistic trolls on the same platform vying for attention would be worthy of popcorn if it weren't so dangerous. I predicted this earlier as it would be an admission by Trump that his own social media platform is less worthy. But of course he will post on Twitter again when he thinks it's to *his* advantage.
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PostPosted: Mon Nov 21, 2022 12:21 am    Post subject:

Omar Little wrote:
Actually, if you divided all wealth equally and let nature take its course, yes, a few people would own almost everything again shortly. The key here is the role of government to both stem that tide and to redress it when it happens. That’s called regulation and taxation, which just happen to be the two things the wealthy fight hardest against.

This. But the poor wouldn't necessarily be poor again. If we had the regulation and taxation you mentioned, plus ample resources and opportunity for all regardless of background, the "poor" would be better off and at least be able to have some dignity.

What we need to do as a society is raise the floor. The way it is, "average" really just means poor. There are many households that make $100,000 a year that live paycheck to paycheck, which simply means they're poor at a higher level.
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PostPosted: Tue Nov 22, 2022 10:33 am    Post subject:

slavavov wrote:
Omar Little wrote:
Actually, if you divided all wealth equally and let nature take its course, yes, a few people would own almost everything again shortly. The key here is the role of government to both stem that tide and to redress it when it happens. That’s called regulation and taxation, which just happen to be the two things the wealthy fight hardest against.

This. But the poor wouldn't necessarily be poor again. If we had the regulation and taxation you mentioned, plus ample resources and opportunity for all regardless of background, the "poor" would be better off and at least be able to have some dignity.

What we need to do as a society is raise the floor. The way it is, "average" really just means poor. There are many households that make $100,000 a year that live paycheck to paycheck, which simply means they're poor at a higher level.


Just give me my --- damn 40 acres and my --- damn mule.😡 🤬
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PostPosted: Thu Nov 24, 2022 4:43 pm    Post subject:

Elon fires those twitter employees that signed up for hardcore twitter.
https://www.yahoo.com/finance/news/elon-musk-fired-dozens-more-172906651.html
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PostPosted: Thu Dec 01, 2022 10:51 am    Post subject:

If you aren't liking how Twitter is evolving, I recently signed up for Mastodon and find it refreshing. If you aren't familiar with it, it's an open source alternative to Twitter...aka, no advertising. There are some weird quirks to it that take a little getting used to...like you need to choose a server when you sign up. Each server has a brief description. It's decentralized in that way, and each server has its own moderator. Kind of like how each subreddit on Reddit has its own moderator? By default, you will get feeds from your local server, but you can then click a button which will open up the entire feed across all servers which is more similar to how Twitter works.

So far, it appears to have far less trash content and is a more positive environment. They appear to be growing exponentially since Musk took over...with millions of new sign-ups. Last note on this...my experience is that the desktop version is far superior to the app version...which is weird. Try it on desktop.
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DaMuleRules
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PostPosted: Thu Dec 01, 2022 12:25 pm    Post subject:

Omar Little wrote:
Actually, if you divided all wealth equally and let nature take its course, yes, a few people would own almost everything again shortly. The key here is the role of government to both stem that tide and to redress it when it happens. That’s called regulation and taxation, which just happen to be the two things the wealthy fight hardest against.


I disagree completely. The reason that wealth distribution is so severely disparate today is due to literally thousands of years of the powerful elite amassing their wealth and utilizing immeasurable power to hoard it away from a populace who had no real way to combat it. Starting from square one in modern times, with the resources that the masses now have, there would be a huge restriction on any one group being to exploit the rest of the world to reach the type of stratification we see now. To say otherwise would be to ignore how different the world has become in even just the last 50 years.

Of course, there is no way a such a purely equitable redistribution would ever be able to occur, but if it did, there are too many factors involved that would prevent the the level of wealth inequity that currently exists.
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PostPosted: Thu Dec 01, 2022 3:05 pm    Post subject:

DaMuleRules wrote:
Omar Little wrote:
Actually, if you divided all wealth equally and let nature take its course, yes, a few people would own almost everything again shortly. The key here is the role of government to both stem that tide and to redress it when it happens. That’s called regulation and taxation, which just happen to be the two things the wealthy fight hardest against.


I disagree completely. The reason that wealth distribution is so severely disparate today is due to literally thousands of years of the powerful elite amassing their wealth and utilizing immeasurable power to hoard it away from a populace who had no real way to combat it. Starting from square one in modern times, with the resources that the masses now have, there would be a huge restriction on any one group being to exploit the rest of the world to reach the type of stratification we see now. To say otherwise would be to ignore how different the world has become in even just the last 50 years.

Of course, there is no way a such a purely equitable redistribution would ever be able to occur, but if it did, there are too many factors involved that would prevent the the level of wealth inequity that currently exists.


I don’t think our premises disagree. I believe in redistribution and regulation, but ongoing, not just once, because if you gave everyone the same amount of money and left the market to its own devices, yes, very few people would own most of the money pretty quickly. That’s the nature of markets. You have to fix both things.
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DaMuleRules
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PostPosted: Thu Dec 01, 2022 7:44 pm    Post subject:

Omar Little wrote:
DaMuleRules wrote:
Omar Little wrote:
Actually, if you divided all wealth equally and let nature take its course, yes, a few people would own almost everything again shortly. The key here is the role of government to both stem that tide and to redress it when it happens. That’s called regulation and taxation, which just happen to be the two things the wealthy fight hardest against.


I disagree completely. The reason that wealth distribution is so severely disparate today is due to literally thousands of years of the powerful elite amassing their wealth and utilizing immeasurable power to hoard it away from a populace who had no real way to combat it. Starting from square one in modern times, with the resources that the masses now have, there would be a huge restriction on any one group being to exploit the rest of the world to reach the type of stratification we see now. To say otherwise would be to ignore how different the world has become in even just the last 50 years.

Of course, there is no way a such a purely equitable redistribution would ever be able to occur, but if it did, there are too many factors involved that would prevent the the level of wealth inequity that currently exists.


I don’t think our premises disagree. I believe in redistribution and regulation, but ongoing, not just once, because if you gave everyone the same amount of money and left the market to its own devices, yes, very few people would own most of the money pretty quickly. That’s the nature of markets. You have to fix both things.


Sure. I totally agree that market system is going see some of the finances return to residing with those who provide goods and services.

The point is that once the extreme corporate wealth is stripped away and you don't have a handful of ultra-billionaires using their amassed personal wealth too manipulate the system, the mechanisms that have been used throughout time to hoard that wealth are far less effective. As I said, the current state obscene wealth being held by a tiny handful of people while extreme poverty and the decline of a middle class is profound is the basis of many centuries of disparity based on the exploitation of that wealth and the power that comes with it. The people that are in that top 1% are there because of a direct connection to those centuries of greed and oppression. There are no self-made mega billionaires. They have all benefited from the privilege that comes from access to the societal machine that allows the select few to hoard wealth. While greed will certainly never go away, a leveling of the playing field by literally spreading the wealth equitably amongst When the billionaires, corporations, the Vatican and mega churches are stripped of their obscene wealth, their ability to oppress and exploit to further their ill gotten gains becomes extremely hard, particularly in the modern society that the world has reached in the 21st century. The populace of the world is far more able to communicate and unite against it than they were even 100 years ago, especially once the financial power has been removed from the equation.

So I disagree completely that society would quickly return to the extreme disparity that we currently experience. That's not to say it could never happen. But it wouldn't do so quickly in relative terms, much less in the sense that the quote I originally addressed claimed—that the rich will always be rich and that the poor will always go back to being poor because that is their predetermined lot in life, as if circumstance and privilege play no part as too why the rich are rich and the poor are poor.
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You thought God was an architect, now you know
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goes up in flames
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