I would have loved to be on a site like this when Kobe got drafted.
This site would have melted down in despair with the combined 1-8 record vs Utah in 1997 and 1998.
Definitely. It would be hilarious watching all the people talk about he wasn't the right pick, trade him, and so forth.
Im sure there would have been posters coming up with fake trades to get rid of Kobe and Campbell to get a power forward that fits with Shaq better: oh I know why not Orlando for Horace Grant???? We already have a backcourt set with Van Exel and Jones, we need to maximize Shaq and dump Campbell and if that means including Kobe so be it. There would have been a lot of this talk going on for sure.
He has the same measurements as Devin Booker. Devin Booker 2.0?
Interesting you say this because he said right now he is watching Jayson Tatum and Devin Booker because he think he is similar to both of them, but more so Tatum because he plays both sides.
I would have loved to be on a site like this when Kobe got drafted.
This site would have melted down in despair with the combined 1-8 record vs Utah in 1997 and 1998.
Definitely. It would be hilarious watching all the people talk about he wasn't the right pick, trade him, and so forth.
Im sure there would have been posters coming up with fake trades to get rid of Kobe and Campbell to get a power forward that fits with Shaq better: oh I know why not Orlando for Horace Grant???? We already have a backcourt set with Van Exel and Jones, we need to maximize Shaq and dump Campbell and if that means including Kobe so be it. There would have been a lot of this talk going on for sure.
People would try to think of ridiculous trade scenarios, such as proposing Corie Blount, Elden Campbell and Frankie King for Marcus Camby, or some other top 5 pick. Something totally unrealistic and fabricated.
There would be at least a few clowns here trying to tell us that Tony Delk was better than Kobe.
People be calling Jerry West an idiot for not acquiring another draft pick as John Wallace was falling down the draft board. Some would say the Knicks got the biggest steal and an A+ for picking Wallace
There would be an epic meltdown when Fisher’s name was announced for the 24th pick.
By like 2004, somebody would call Jerry West an absolute idiot for missing out on drafting Ben Wallace, even though everybody else missed out on it and hindsight is 20/20
Vlade Divac fans would be heartbroken, and end up trolling LG for many years to come under various disguises
Joined: 03 Oct 2003 Posts: 8347 Location: Santa Monica
Posted: Fri Jun 24, 2022 7:31 pm Post subject:
j-dawg wrote:
1995Lakers wrote:
Outspoken wrote:
1995Lakers wrote:
Outspoken wrote:
I would have loved to be on a site like this when Kobe got drafted.
This site would have melted down in despair with the combined 1-8 record vs Utah in 1997 and 1998.
Definitely. It would be hilarious watching all the people talk about he wasn't the right pick, trade him, and so forth.
Im sure there would have been posters coming up with fake trades to get rid of Kobe and Campbell to get a power forward that fits with Shaq better: oh I know why not Orlando for Horace Grant???? We already have a backcourt set with Van Exel and Jones, we need to maximize Shaq and dump Campbell and if that means including Kobe so be it. There would have been a lot of this talk going on for sure.
People would try to think of ridiculous trade scenarios, such as proposing Corie Blount, Elden Campbell and Frankie King for Marcus Camby, or some other top 5 pick. Something totally unrealistic and fabricated.
There would be at least a few clowns here trying to tell us that Tony Delk was better than Kobe.
People be calling Jerry West an idiot for not acquiring another draft pick as John Wallace was falling down the draft board. Some would say the Knicks got the biggest steal and an A+ for picking Wallace
There would be an epic meltdown when Fisher’s name was announced for the 24th pick.
By like 2004, somebody would call Jerry West an absolute idiot for missing out on drafting Ben Wallace, even though everybody else missed out on it and hindsight is 20/20
Vlade Divac fans would be heartbroken, and end up trolling LG for many years to come under various disguises
This board would've went crazy when Eddie Jones was traded for Glen Rice.
I would have loved to be on a site like this when Kobe got drafted.
This site would have melted down in despair with the combined 1-8 record vs Utah in 1997 and 1998.
Definitely. It would be hilarious watching all the people talk about he wasn't the right pick, trade him, and so forth.
Im sure there would have been posters coming up with fake trades to get rid of Kobe and Campbell to get a power forward that fits with Shaq better: oh I know why not Orlando for Horace Grant???? We already have a backcourt set with Van Exel and Jones, we need to maximize Shaq and dump Campbell and if that means including Kobe so be it. There would have been a lot of this talk going on for sure.
People would try to think of ridiculous trade scenarios, such as proposing Corie Blount, Elden Campbell and Frankie King for Marcus Camby, or some other top 5 pick. Something totally unrealistic and fabricated.
There would be at least a few clowns here trying to tell us that Tony Delk was better than Kobe.
People be calling Jerry West an idiot for not acquiring another draft pick as John Wallace was falling down the draft board. Some would say the Knicks got the biggest steal and an A+ for picking Wallace
There would be an epic meltdown when Fisher’s name was announced for the 24th pick.
By like 2004, somebody would call Jerry West an absolute idiot for missing out on drafting Ben Wallace, even though everybody else missed out on it and hindsight is 20/20
Vlade Divac fans would be heartbroken, and end up trolling LG for many years to come under various disguises
This board would've went crazy when Eddie Jones was traded for Glen Rice.
I agree with you, but I would offer this counter argument:
Lots of people here are enamored with established big names and stat stuffers like Westbrook. Glen Rice had nice numbers, was a perennial all star, was coming off of elbow surgery, but he was also coming off of a career year where he shot a very high percentage from 3’s. There would be people here that would be totally blinded by his elbow surgery and fixated on the numbers he put up, just like the people who were fully inboard the Westbrook train.
And I’m sure Glen Rice had at least an 87 rating in the NBA game back then. That would’ve been a selling point to some on this board as well because.. video game ratings matter to some. I bet Eddie Jones was a stink in’ 82 overall or something.. so screw him
I think all the people comparing him to Booker or other former star players, need to lower their expectations. This is the 35th pick. We will be lucky if he becomes a KCP-like player.
I think all the people comparing him to Booker or other former star players, need to lower their expectations. This is the 35th pick. We will be lucky if he becomes a KCP-like player.
Oh really?
Nicolas Jokic 41 st pick
Isiah Thomas 60th pick
Malcolm Brogdon 36th pick
Chris Middleton 39th pick
Draymond Green 35th pick
Lou Williams 45th pick
Marc Gasol 48th pick
Goran Dragic 45th pick
Deandre Jordan 35th pick
Paul Milsap 47th pick
Manu Ginobili 57th pick
Monta Ellis 40th pick
I think all the people comparing him to Booker or other former star players, need to lower their expectations. This is the 35th pick. We will be lucky if he becomes a KCP-like player.
Oh really?
Nicolas Jokic 41 st pick
Isiah Thomas 60th pick
Malcolm Brogdon 36th pick
Chris Middleton 39th pick
Draymond Green 35th pick
Lou Williams 45th pick
Marc Gasol 48th pick
Goran Dragic 45th pick
Deandre Jordan 35th pick
Paul Milsap 47th pick
Manu Ginobili 57th pick
Monta Ellis 40th pick
Plenty more...but I am going to sleep now.
Very tired of this kind of argument. Most of the 2nd round rookies don't have a long NBA career. This is a fact. I appreciate your time to find those rare exceptions which I already knew.
I think all the people comparing him to Booker or other former star players, need to lower their expectations. This is the 35th pick. We will be lucky if he becomes a KCP-like player.
Oh really?
Nicolas Jokic 41 st pick
Isiah Thomas 60th pick
Malcolm Brogdon 36th pick
Chris Middleton 39th pick
Draymond Green 35th pick
Lou Williams 45th pick
Marc Gasol 48th pick
Goran Dragic 45th pick
Deandre Jordan 35th pick
Paul Milsap 47th pick
Manu Ginobili 57th pick
Monta Ellis 40th pick
Plenty more...but I am going to sleep now.
Very tired of this kind of argument. Most of the 2nd round rookies don't have a long NBA career. This is a fact. I appreciate your time to find those rare exceptions which I already knew.
Rare exceptions? Dont think so...I could go on and on. But sleeping now.
More from the 80's. Steve Kerr (50th pick), Jerome Kersey 46th pick, Rick Mahorn 35th pick, Michael Redd 43rd pick, Nick Van Exel 37th pick, Clifford Robinson 36th pick and so on. Good night!
I think all the people comparing him to Booker or other former star players, need to lower their expectations. This is the 35th pick. We will be lucky if he becomes a KCP-like player.
Oh really?
Nicolas Jokic 41 st pick
Isiah Thomas 60th pick
Malcolm Brogdon 36th pick
Chris Middleton 39th pick
Draymond Green 35th pick
Lou Williams 45th pick
Marc Gasol 48th pick
Goran Dragic 45th pick
Deandre Jordan 35th pick
Paul Milsap 47th pick
Manu Ginobili 57th pick
Monta Ellis 40th pick
Plenty more...but I am going to sleep now.
Very tired of this kind of argument. Most of the 2nd round rookies don't have a long NBA career. This is a fact. I appreciate your time to find those rare exceptions which I already knew.
Rare exceptions? Dont think so...I could go on and on. But sleeping now.
More from the 80's. Steve Kerr (50th pick), Jerome Kersey 46th pick, Rick Mahorn 35th pick, Michael Redd 43rd pick, Nick Van Exel 37th pick, Clifford Robinson 36th pick and so on. Good night!
So... that's like what? In average, one out of the twenty-nine to thirty 2nd rounders becomes a good NBA player every year or every few years? How does that affect my general statement that most 2nd round rookies don't have a long NBA career and we would be lucky if he becomes a KCP-like player?
This is like how last year people were saying Kidd became a good 3-point shooter at the end of his career so RW would be the same and he would make us a championship contender. Nothing is 100%. You can always find exceptions to counter an argument but often, those exceptions won't happen.
Anyway, I don't want to wake you up from your dream where Lakers build a championship contender with Booker 2.0, Tatum 2.0, Kobe 2.0 and KD 2.0 from our multiple 2nd rounds picks in the future. Sweet dream.
I think all the people comparing him to Booker or other former star players, need to lower their expectations. This is the 35th pick. We will be lucky if he becomes a KCP-like player.
Oh really?
Nicolas Jokic 41 st pick
Isiah Thomas 60th pick
Malcolm Brogdon 36th pick
Chris Middleton 39th pick
Draymond Green 35th pick
Lou Williams 45th pick
Marc Gasol 48th pick
Goran Dragic 45th pick
Deandre Jordan 35th pick
Paul Milsap 47th pick
Manu Ginobili 57th pick
Monta Ellis 40th pick
Plenty more...but I am going to sleep now.
Very tired of this kind of argument. Most of the 2nd round rookies don't have a long NBA career. This is a fact. I appreciate your time to find those rare exceptions which I already knew.
Rare exceptions? Dont think so...I could go on and on. But sleeping now.
More from the 80's. Steve Kerr (50th pick), Jerome Kersey 46th pick, Rick Mahorn 35th pick, Michael Redd 43rd pick, Nick Van Exel 37th pick, Clifford Robinson 36th pick and so on. Good night!
So... that's like what? In average, one out of the twenty-nine to thirty 2nd rounders becomes a good NBA player every year or every few years? How does that affect my general statement that most 2nd round rookies don't have a long NBA career and we would be lucky if he becomes a KCP-like player?
This is like how last year people were saying Kidd became a good 3-point shooter at the end of his career so RW would be the same and he would make us a championship contender. Nothing is 100%. You can always find exceptions to counter an argument but often, those exceptions won't happen.
Anyway, I don't want to wake you up from your dream where Lakers build a championship contender with Booker 2.0, Tatum 2.0, Kobe 2.0 and KD 2.0 from our multiple 2nd rounds picks in the future. Sweet dream.
Uhmmm. I am having trouble trying to comprehend your post. Good night.
I watched two full games of Michigan State, against Duke and Nebraka.
Positive
1. maturity; very smooth; does not force things on both ends; not many rookie mistakes
2. shooting; very good catch and shoot
3. a pleasant surprise defensively; move well
improvement area
1. strength
2. move aggressively without the ball
3. create his own shot; ability to attack the paint
expectation
could get minutes in year one simply because he can shoot. veterans would attack rookies like Austin Reaves and AR was able to hold his ground most of the time. Max is not ready for that.
I intentionally did not watch any scouting video before the full games which I think is the better way to evaluate a player.
I think all the people comparing him to Booker or other former star players, need to lower their expectations. This is the 35th pick. We will be lucky if he becomes a KCP-like player.
Oh really?
Nicolas Jokic 41 st pick
Isiah Thomas 60th pick
Malcolm Brogdon 36th pick
Chris Middleton 39th pick
Draymond Green 35th pick
Lou Williams 45th pick
Marc Gasol 48th pick
Goran Dragic 45th pick
Deandre Jordan 35th pick
Paul Milsap 47th pick
Manu Ginobili 57th pick
Monta Ellis 40th pick
Plenty more...but I am going to sleep now.
Very tired of this kind of argument. Most of the 2nd round rookies don't have a long NBA career. This is a fact. I appreciate your time to find those rare exceptions which I already knew.
A lot of 1st rounders don't have long NBA careers neither, as well as a lot of higher picks don't meet expectations.
All of that to me is based on:
Ability - some players are naturally physically gifted than others, quicker, more athletic.
Mentality - how much does a player study the game and wanna improve.
Work ethic - how hard a player trains on their game and body.
Then we could look at what is that 1 thing they are great at?
After we understand what they are great at, what is the need and system of a team? The right system can have a role player looking like a superstar because it fits their make up.
But believe it or not, work ethic and discipline is a reason for most NBA players downfall. A lot of NBA players get caught up in the life style, don't work hard enough, not focused on the game, doing ignorant outside activities. That's why it is also good to understand the character of a player.
<snip>
So... that's like what? In average, one out of the twenty-nine to thirty 2nd rounders becomes a good NBA player every year or every few years? How does that affect my general statement that most 2nd round rookies don't have a long NBA career and we would be lucky if he becomes a KCP-like player?
This is like how last year people were saying Kidd became a good 3-point shooter at the end of his career so RW would be the same and he would make us a championship contender. Nothing is 100%. You can always find exceptions to counter an argument but often, those exceptions won't happen.
Anyway, I don't want to wake you up from your dream where Lakers build a championship contender with Booker 2.0, Tatum 2.0, Kobe 2.0 and KD 2.0 from our multiple 2nd rounds picks in the future. Sweet dream.
.. or we could attempt to get a better handle on vague terms like "rare exceptions" by looking at actual data
A Study of NBA 2nd rounder success
According to which about:
- 2.5% (1 out of 40 roughly) of 2nd rounders reach all-star status
- 20% of 2nd rounders (1 out of 5 roughly) reach "useful" status i.e. play 3 or more years in the NBA
Now depending on your perspective these may or may not be acceptable odds.
If you looks at the last 10 yrs of all stars. Number on 2nd to undrafted.
2013 - 0
2014 - 1
2015 - 2
2016 - 3
2017 - 5
2018 - 2
2019 - 2
2020 - 2
2021 - 1
2022 - 3
That means 2 of the 24 All Stars are from the second round or undrafted. Yes it’s harder to get but it’s still doable in the second round. It’s all about how the player develop and fire.
I think all the people comparing him to Booker or other former star players, need to lower their expectations. This is the 35th pick. We will be lucky if he becomes a KCP-like player.
Oh really?
Nicolas Jokic 41 st pick
Isiah Thomas 60th pick
Malcolm Brogdon 36th pick
Chris Middleton 39th pick
Draymond Green 35th pick
Lou Williams 45th pick
Marc Gasol 48th pick
Goran Dragic 45th pick
Deandre Jordan 35th pick
Paul Milsap 47th pick
Manu Ginobili 57th pick
Monta Ellis 40th pick
Plenty more...but I am going to sleep now.
Very tired of this kind of argument. Most of the 2nd round rookies don't have a long NBA career. This is a fact. I appreciate your time to find those rare exceptions which I already knew.
A lot of 1st rounders don't have long NBA careers neither, as well as a lot of higher picks don't meet expectations.
All of that to me is based on:
Ability - some players are naturally physically gifted than others, quicker, more athletic.
Mentality - how much does a player study the game and wanna improve.
Work ethic - how hard a player trains on their game and body.
Then we could look at what is that 1 thing they are great at?
After we understand what they are great at, what is the need and system of a team? The right system can have a role player looking like a superstar because it fits their make up.
But believe it or not, work ethic and discipline is a reason for most NBA players downfall. A lot of NBA players get caught up in the life style, don't work hard enough, not focused on the game, doing ignorant outside activities. That's why it is also good to understand the character of a player.
Sure, I agree with everything you said. But it doesn't mean I will project every 2nd rounder to all star players
<snip>
So... that's like what? In average, one out of the twenty-nine to thirty 2nd rounders becomes a good NBA player every year or every few years? How does that affect my general statement that most 2nd round rookies don't have a long NBA career and we would be lucky if he becomes a KCP-like player?
This is like how last year people were saying Kidd became a good 3-point shooter at the end of his career so RW would be the same and he would make us a championship contender. Nothing is 100%. You can always find exceptions to counter an argument but often, those exceptions won't happen.
Anyway, I don't want to wake you up from your dream where Lakers build a championship contender with Booker 2.0, Tatum 2.0, Kobe 2.0 and KD 2.0 from our multiple 2nd rounds picks in the future. Sweet dream.
.. or we could attempt to get a better handle on vague terms like "rare exceptions" by looking at actual data
A Study of NBA 2nd rounder success
According to which about:
- 2.5% (1 out of 40 roughly) of 2nd rounders reach all-star status
- 20% of 2nd rounders (1 out of 5 roughly) reach "useful" status i.e. play 3 or more years in the NBA
Now depending on your perspective these may or may not be acceptable odds.
Insightful.
But again, based on your article, 74% of the 2nd rounders are out of the NBA in 3 years and 26.1% of them never made it to the NBA.
Back to my original post about people saying Christie is the next Booker or Tatum, I don't think all the 2.5% (all-star status 2nd rounders) are at Book or Tatum's level.
I am not a statistician so maybe labelling it "rare" is not the correct term. But the ratio of 74% of them are gone in year 3 versus <2.5% becoming multiple all-star status, is kind of the point I wanted to make.
preparation is different today than it was 5-10 years ago. The GLeague has better competition better science behind training and financial support to allow guys to focus.
Does anyone expect Christie to play much next season?
I'm expecting he will spend most of the season in the G-League, similar to THT's first season with the Lakers.
It depends on whether it is by design or necessity.
Maybe the young man works hard on defense, hits shots and earns 10+mpg during the season. I am hoping for this outcome. Hell, I am rooting for him to be ROY!
Or maybe roster construction and depth is so bad that they are forced to play him before he is ready because Ham has no other options.
As an example I would point out this past season where Ariza was expected to potentially start, or at least have impact. Then Bazemore had his turn. Both disappointed.
Eventually, Lakers had to scrounge up Stanley Johnson. To his credit he played well all things considered. But part of the reason his energy stood out was because of how uninspired the rest of the roster played. Same point can be made for Reaves.
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