Something is wrong with this team!!!
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Hanging from Rafters
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PostPosted: Wed Feb 08, 2023 1:26 am    Post subject: Something is wrong with this team!!!

I can’t put my finger on it. Does anyone else have a better idea of what it could be?

We should be disappointed at not having a top 4 seed, not disappointed that we can’t maintain the 12th seed. At worst it should be disgust that the team is fighting to avoid the play-in like last year until the wheels completely fell off, not disgusted that we can’t even make the play-in.

Is it as simple as poor coaching rotations? Improper roster construction? The Lakers with LBJ/AD/WB and supporting players like Bryant, Troy BrownJR, Walker, Reeves, Schroeder plus back-ups like Gabriel and Christie along with Pat Bev and Hachi should be enough for at least the play-in shouldn’t it?

Is it supernatural like a curse as payment for the 2020 title if you believe in that kind of stuff? Is it scientific like lack of buy-in to analytics? Could there be some culture problems with back lash from family in-fighting with ownership?

Does Utah, OKC, and Portland really have a better team?

I don’t get it?
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Last edited by Hanging from Rafters on Wed Feb 08, 2023 1:39 am; edited 1 time in total
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Black Sheep
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PostPosted: Wed Feb 08, 2023 1:29 am    Post subject:

We got LeBron his help in Rui and tried for Kyrie.

But yes I agree. This team isn't that good. Reminds me of my Bucs and how we all thought we would somehow turn it around. But unfortunately we were as bad as our record suggested.
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Hanging from Rafters
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PostPosted: Wed Feb 08, 2023 1:35 am    Post subject:

Black Sheep wrote:
We got LeBron his help in Rui and tried for Kyrie.

But yes I agree. This team isn't that good. Reminds me of my Bucs and how we all thought we would somehow turn it around. But unfortunately we were as bad as our record suggested.


…but why? I just don’t understand how THIS team could be THAT bad.
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scout_0
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PostPosted: Wed Feb 08, 2023 2:07 am    Post subject:

Hanging from Rafters wrote:
Black Sheep wrote:
We got LeBron his help in Rui and tried for Kyrie.

But yes I agree. This team isn't that good. Reminds me of my Bucs and how we all thought we would somehow turn it around. But unfortunately we were as bad as our record suggested.


…but why? I just don’t understand how THIS team could be THAT bad.


It is a coaching issue.

Go look at the performance of Ham's favorite dish: 3 guard line up

Throughout our season the only consistent thing has been:

1) Bricks minutes
2) Beverlys minutes
3) Dennis minutes

All these guys are dead last in eFG
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Black Sheep
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PostPosted: Wed Feb 08, 2023 2:14 am    Post subject:

scout_0 wrote:
Hanging from Rafters wrote:
Black Sheep wrote:
We got LeBron his help in Rui and tried for Kyrie.

But yes I agree. This team isn't that good. Reminds me of my Bucs and how we all thought we would somehow turn it around. But unfortunately we were as bad as our record suggested.


…but why? I just don’t understand how THIS team could be THAT bad.


It is a coaching issue.

Go look at the performance of Ham's favorite dish: 3 guard line up

Throughout our season the only consistent thing has been:

1) Bricks minutes
2) Beverlys minutes
3) Dennis minutes

All these guys are dead last in eFG


I agree. For the Bucs it was definitely the OC byron leftwich. We went from 13-4 to 8-9 after Bruce Arians left because Brady had issues with him

Definitely a coaching issue.
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levon
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PostPosted: Wed Feb 08, 2023 2:16 am    Post subject:

They've given up. The fans care more than they do.
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scout_0
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PostPosted: Wed Feb 08, 2023 3:24 am    Post subject:

levon wrote:
They've given up. The fans care more than they do.


Fool me once......

I went to sleep half time
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RashardA
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PostPosted: Wed Feb 08, 2023 5:19 am    Post subject:

You are who your best players are.
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troy
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PostPosted: Wed Feb 08, 2023 6:29 am    Post subject:

We have good enough players on this team, so the only thing left if the coaching.

There is something not functioning right with the culture of the Lakers, and that starts with Mr. Ham.
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dont_be_a_wuss
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PostPosted: Wed Feb 08, 2023 6:55 am    Post subject:

No trust, no system, no plays, no cohesion. There are a couple two-man relationships like LeBron and AD, but otherwise there’s no love, no respect. Everybody is looking to get their own and blame the other guy for every mistake he makes. It seems like most of the coaches who come to the Lakers have this problem of not being able to get enough guys rowing in the same direction. Maybe it’s something about this city and the egos players gain by wearing the purple and gold.
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lar9149
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PostPosted: Wed Feb 08, 2023 6:58 am    Post subject:

for one thing the defense is very bad despite AD being back
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Four Decade Bandwagon
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PostPosted: Wed Feb 08, 2023 7:03 am    Post subject:

Allowed 133 pts and had 20 turnovers. No focus or efficiency.

Not sure how you can see anything wrong with this team. (Sarcasm!)
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PostPosted: Wed Feb 08, 2023 8:36 am    Post subject:

A fish rots from the head down.
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BandwagonLBJhopper
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PostPosted: Wed Feb 08, 2023 8:39 am    Post subject:

I honestly think coaching is a big part of it. Ham is just putting out stunted lineups, it has to be frustrating to see him continually force these small ball three point guard lineups out there.

And it's not like you are playing small for spacing purposes, you are playing small guards who are also non-shooters.

In general his rotations and usage of guys is just all over the place, including running Lebron into the ground. If he was better at managing the pieces he does have, we would be in a much better place. Coaching is a big deal.
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PostPosted: Wed Feb 08, 2023 8:48 am    Post subject:

venturalakersfan wrote:
A fish rots from the head down.

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PostPosted: Wed Feb 08, 2023 9:17 am    Post subject:

https://twitter.com/TheNBACentral/status/1623170326405214209?s=20&t=fXwoN5kyAwTj2Ef8SHj75Q
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Treble Clef
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PostPosted: Wed Feb 08, 2023 10:09 am    Post subject:

The Lakers have a lot of things wrong with them. The games are consistently ugly and frustrating. But they’re consistently able to put themselves in a position to win.

Their opponents are almost dead last in three point shooting, free throw shooting, free throw attempts, fouls, and fouls/free throw differential. All of that stuff gives the Lakers a big advantage in close games. Teams just simply don’t play well against them.

Looking at the Lakers record, they don’t look like a contender at all. But they have the best player in the game and all of the top teams in the NBA look very mediocre against them head to head. The games against Boston, Denver, Philly, Memphis, Milwaukee, etc have all been wins or games they should have won.
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Kobe_Is_King13
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PostPosted: Wed Feb 08, 2023 10:58 am    Post subject:

We dont have enough defensive and rebounding. In our championship run we weren't a lights out shooting team. People identified that as our issue but it never was.

We can shoot good enough and have guys that come up clutch when needed. The percentages arent pretty but they are passable.

The area we always hung our hats on was defensive and rebounding. We had guys willing to do the dirty work like McGee, Dwight, KCP, Caruso, Kuz, Danny Green and Rondo. Guys had their flaws but there was a commitment to being a great defensive team night in night out. Add two bonafide superstars and it was a recipe for a championship.

Since then we've consistently pawned off key pieces and replaced them with guys who are marginal improvements in other areas but massive steps back in that vital defensive commitment category.

We're left now with a team that has no identity. We have peices of the puzzle but too many mismatch parts to be cohesive
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lakersken80
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PostPosted: Wed Feb 08, 2023 11:00 am    Post subject:

Team looks OK on paper but just doesn't mesh. Everyone keeps saying they will get better but they are running out of time and games.
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KindCrippler2000
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PostPosted: Wed Feb 08, 2023 11:02 am    Post subject:

When star players are disinterested, it percolates down to the rest of the team. It really starts with both Lebron and AD setting an example on defense. The offense will come but defending has to be the priority.
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activeverb
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PostPosted: Wed Feb 08, 2023 11:08 am    Post subject:

We are a team based on two stars (Lebron, AD), with mismatched parts cobbled around them.

The FO has continually sacrificed cohesive in the pursuit of names/stars.

This team really depends on AD playing at a high level and being able to cover the other mistakes, primarily on defense. When AD is hobbled, as he seems to be now, the flaws of the team become more apparent.
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troy
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PostPosted: Wed Feb 08, 2023 11:24 am    Post subject:

activeverb wrote:
We are a team based on two stars (Lebron, AD), with mismatched parts cobbled around them.

The FO has continually sacrificed cohesive in the pursuit of names/stars.

This team really depends on AD playing at a high level and being able to cover the other mistakes, primarily on defense. When AD is hobbled, as he seems to be now, the flaws of the team become more apparent.


Then it's up to the coach to make the pieces work. Front office won't take the blame on this one. You have NBA players. You have three future Hall of Famers. You have one player many will say is the best that ever played. You have to do better than 13th place, behind teams that have a fraction of the talent we have.
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PostPosted: Wed Feb 08, 2023 11:27 am    Post subject:

Kobe_Is_King13 wrote:
We dont have enough defensive and rebounding. In our championship run we weren't a lights out shooting team. People identified that as our issue but it never was.

We can shoot good enough and have guys that come up clutch when needed. The percentages arent pretty but they are passable.

The area we always hung our hats on was defensive and rebounding. We had guys willing to do the dirty work like McGee, Dwight, KCP, Caruso, Kuz, Danny Green and Rondo. Guys had their flaws but there was a commitment to being a great defensive team night in night out. Add two bonafide superstars and it was a recipe for a championship.

Since then we've consistently pawned off key pieces and replaced them with guys who are marginal improvements in other areas but massive steps back in that vital defensive commitment category.

We're left now with a team that has no identity. We have peices of the puzzle but too many mismatch parts to be cohesive


KCP is the current league leader in three point field goal percentage at 46.3% and an elite defender. Green is the most consequential 3 and D role player of his generation. Shooting on the championship team was fine.
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Laker_Jocker
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PostPosted: Wed Feb 08, 2023 12:39 pm    Post subject:

Seems pretty apparent to me, it's roster construction:

Pushed all chips in with 3 guys at 40+m a piece that don't have enough collectively to beat good teams.

LBJ - end of career and not laser focused on winning as in past
AD - called street clothes Davis for a reason. Plenty of evidence that he cannot (as the featured player) get/keep a team at .500. Has shown to be a 1b or 2a type of player going forward.

WB - always was a questionable fit with the 2 real stars and has always been a net negative player in terms of winning
BEV - same issues as WB

RUI - bench player given a starting role but coach is limiting his minutes for a reason. His presence has seemed to have negated Wenyen who actually was contributing to wins.

DS, LW4, Bryant, Brown all are bench players but forced into big minutes/starting because of injuries and lack of depth.

Reeves and Christie are second round picks who are nice but lack consistant impact.

JTA and DJ alwasy have been "break in case of emergency" type players

So........that is the "low margin for error" type of roster LBJ keeps talking about

What exactly was the expectation? To me its not surprising that the outcome will be likely be somewhere between 33-40 win team in the West.

The season had "barely squeek into the playoffs" outcome written all over it at the beginning and still does unless something changes,
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Hanging from Rafters
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PostPosted: Wed Feb 08, 2023 12:42 pm    Post subject:

Can it be as simple as poor coaching rotations and/or improper roster construction? The Lakers should be still be good still enough despite those two problems for at least the play-in shouldn’t they?

Coaching along with poor defense is a major problem…but shouldn’t that be the reason the team is only the 6th seed? Or just in the play-in? Not being able to hold on to 12th place seems like it would take more problems to be that bad.

Maybe it’s the constant trade rumors with a turnstile roster with constant turnover. I imagine it could be difficult to have any meaningful team chemistry. Players may be unwilling to commit fully to a team with a culture where you or your teammates are continually made to feel unwanted.
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