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gng930
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Joined: 13 Apr 2001
Posts: 11484
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 Posted: Thu Aug 10, 2006 12:36 pm Post subject: |
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| wolfpaclaker wrote: |
You have Bynum, Kwame, Odom, Radmanovic and Bryant. 51 million. You are under the cap.
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Boy I'm not gonna even address the blunder it is to trade away a possible future starting PG for an extra 1 million in cap-space. YIKES!
Nice try though. You forgot the 2007 pick (in what might be the deepest draft ever...you want to trade that away too) and the roster charge (the minimum) for all of those empty roster spaces. That puts us in excess of 54mil. The cap won't exceed 60mil (that's a VERY generous estimate BTW). So, basically you've put us in position to offer...DRUMROLL PLEASE...the MLE!
Please insert another coin. |
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THE_SHOES
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Joined: 12 Apr 2001
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Location: Taiwan
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| Posted: Thu Aug 10, 2006 12:37 pm Post subject: |
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| wolfpaclaker wrote: |  Shoes - This thread needed that post !!!
Lakers will be ready this season. Especially Lamar and Kobe. They both want to get one back on Miami  |
It is amazing how damned near every thread gets highjacked in here isn't it?
I just thought I would adress the question before poor 999 thought that nobody agreed with him
At this time I would like to borrow a phrase from an announcer second only to Chick. I used to love to hear Dodger announcer Vin Scully say it right around the 7th inning as the Dodgers were making a run after trailing most of the game.
We'll just substitute the Laker name for the Dodgers and....
Aaaaaaannndddddd hhhhheeeerrrrreeeee ccccoooommmeeesss the LLLLLLlllaaakkkkkeeeerrrrrssssss!!!!!
OOOOOhhhh how I love to hear Vinny say that!!!!
_________________
"According to ESPN.com's conference projections, the Lakers will finish 12th in the West, which prompted Bryant to tweet earlier this offseason, "12th I see.." |
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gng930
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Joined: 13 Apr 2001
Posts: 11484
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| Posted: Thu Aug 10, 2006 12:38 pm Post subject: |
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| Wino wrote: |
And really, you shouldn't give each other a bunch of krap all the time.
Agree to disagree and move on. |
Hey as long as we keep it to basketball, it's all good right? |
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wolfpaclaker
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| Posted: Thu Aug 10, 2006 12:41 pm Post subject: |
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You know what's going to happen. You'll have that pressure defense forcing all those TO's. Now the Lakers will have Vlade to shoot all those bombs. I can't wait to see Cookie, Vlade and Sasha out there with Kobe and Lamar. It be raining 3's
It's going to be alot of fun. I don't expect a ring - but I know that Kobe and Lamar are aiming for one this season. The fact that Miami won one is only going to burn their behinds like never before. They are going to bust their asses to get one.
Wade a MVP before Kobe :roll: :roll: :roll:
Lamar's going to show em why he's a better player to have than Shaq. Yes - Damn right !!!
Ok , back to bashing the Lakers .... |
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gng930
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Joined: 13 Apr 2001
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| Posted: Thu Aug 10, 2006 12:45 pm Post subject: |
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| wolfpaclaker wrote: | Cook is better than Anderson. That is fact. When you have Shooting Brian smoke teams with his J from the 4 spot, the Laker needs shift perspective.
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Are you kidding me? I guess we'll have to agree to disagree. We'll have our answer when these guys are up for a new contract.
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When it came down to 2004, they were about to lose Fisher. They needed another peskly little shooter that can play in the Triangle. Vujacic is that.
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That MIGHT hold water if they were EXPECTING him to start right away.
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Walton was brought into help faciliate the offense and at the same time be a poorman's Kukoc for this team. He is doing that.
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Never complained about Walton. In fact I've commended Mitch on his ability to dig up gems in the 2nd. Where's the fire?
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I don't see anyone apart from Rush in the last 3 years that was a bad pick for this team. They all fit and will have a role. Jackson's teams always have those bits and pieces.
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And very limited roles at that when we could have had starters.
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As for Sky's hindsight - the dude's ball knowledge is excellent. However he has no experience in NBA situations and has no idea what the pressures are financially and from a coaching standpoint.
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And you do? The hindsight argument doesn't fly, he made these calls before they happened. And there was no pressure to draft Sasha and Cook of all people.
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You put a roster out there that meets the financial demands of the owner and the players that your coach will actually play. Didn't Kiki try to do hiw own thing? Guess what? He got fired because Karl and him had totally different visions. Karl was the bigger name and so guess who's side ownership takes?
Same thing with Buss, Mitch and Phil. |
People want pin everything on Phil and his obsession with the triangle. Guess what...the cat got out of the bag when it was revealed he barely knew anything about Rush when they drafted him. Mitch shouldn't escape accountability. |
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ocho
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| Posted: Thu Aug 10, 2006 12:45 pm Post subject: |
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| wolfpaclaker wrote: |
Lamar's going to show em why he's a better player to have than Shaq. Yes - Damn right !!!. |
Wow. This statement is incredible. I mean I like LO and everything but come on dude. |
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gng930
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Joined: 13 Apr 2001
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| Posted: Thu Aug 10, 2006 12:47 pm Post subject: |
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| wolfpaclaker wrote: |
You know what's going to happen. You'll have that pressure defense forcing all those TO's. Now the Lakers will have Vlade to shoot all those bombs. I can't wait to see Cookie, Vlade and Sasha out there with Kobe and Lamar. It be raining 3's
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Didn't we try this once already? *cough* Rudy-T |
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wolfpaclaker
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| Posted: Thu Aug 10, 2006 12:48 pm Post subject: |
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| da ocho wrote: | | wolfpaclaker wrote: |
Lamar's going to show em why he's a better player to have than Shaq. Yes - Damn right !!!. |
Wow. This statement is incredible. I mean I like LO and everything but come on dude. |
Shaq is on his way to being a 15/8 player. Lamar is on his way to being better than that.
If his head's ok after the tragedy - Lamar will be a better player than Shaq this coming season.
(I am not saying Lamar will be better than dominant Shaq, but I expect him to be better than Shaq this coming season - as I see Shaq getting older, slower, fatter and not being able to play more than 32 mpg) |
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wolfpaclaker
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| Posted: Thu Aug 10, 2006 12:48 pm Post subject: |
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| gng930 wrote: | | wolfpaclaker wrote: |
You know what's going to happen. You'll have that pressure defense forcing all those TO's. Now the Lakers will have Vlade to shoot all those bombs. I can't wait to see Cookie, Vlade and Sasha out there with Kobe and Lamar. It be raining 3's
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Didn't we try this once already? *cough* Rudy-T |
Difference is that now they actuallly have the sharpshooters to do so.
Cough Seattle the same year Cough |
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magic_bryant
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| Posted: Thu Aug 10, 2006 12:48 pm Post subject: |
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| wolfpaclaker wrote: | If you think Varejao is better than Radmanovic, I don't know what to say. I much rather have Radmanovic - who is 6'10 and pretty damn big himself - who can actually maxamize Bryant and Odom. Anderson would have trouble starting on this team because he's still learning the NBA game and doesn't meet the biggest offensive demands from Phil Jackson - shooting/ballhandling.
If you are saying AV is better than Sasha, you are right. I saw him the other day playing for Brazil - he's a good player. Not more than a role player - but a role playing big is more valuable than Sasha Vujacic. No arguments - AV would probably be the better pick.
Can't we do that every year though? Pick a player in the draft that is better than another one drafted higher?
That team is no contender though. You are kidding yourself if you think Barbosa + Varejao in place of Parker and Radmanovic puts the Lakers over the top.
What do I ask of the draft? That a team draft players that actually end up working out for the Lakers.
Not happy with Rush. He failed.
Happy with Cook and Walton. Both became the players that the Lakers envisioned them as. Would have been even more effective with Shaq.
Time will tell about Vujacic, Bynum and Farmar.
Barbosa worked out for the Suns. Cook shot over 50% for us last season. Both players worked out well for their teams. Don't see the big issue. You can do that every year and say "X" player drafted lower is actually better individually that this player drafted higher. It's about team needs and wants - Cook filled what the Lakers were looking for and Barbosa filled what the Suns were looking for. |
Not to nitpick, but Varejao is just the kind of PF you'd want beside of Kwame. Has a nice jumper and good ball-handling for a PF.
_________________
Stephon Marbury on Kobe: "He's the only person on 'dis earth that can do 'dat. He guards people, like shuts 'em down. Then, to do 'dat on 'da offensive end. It's like 'Damn, I can't score on him AND he about to bust my ass." |
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gng930
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| Posted: Thu Aug 10, 2006 12:49 pm Post subject: |
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| Wino wrote: |
Who's gng930????
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The same guy who has more posts than you! BOO-YAH!  |
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wolfpaclaker
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| Posted: Thu Aug 10, 2006 12:51 pm Post subject: |
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Anderson is better at perimeter defense than interior defense. Bynum had an and 1 play off him with such ease when they matched up in Cleveland.
Most good interior defenders wouldn't allow that Bynum to handle him like that.
He's a good role player - but a backup. |
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gng930
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| Posted: Thu Aug 10, 2006 12:53 pm Post subject: |
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| wolfpaclaker wrote: | | gng930 wrote: | | wolfpaclaker wrote: |
You know what's going to happen. You'll have that pressure defense forcing all those TO's. Now the Lakers will have Vlade to shoot all those bombs. I can't wait to see Cookie, Vlade and Sasha out there with Kobe and Lamar. It be raining 3's
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Didn't we try this once already? *cough* Rudy-T |
Difference is that now they actuallly have the sharpshooters to do so.
Cough Seattle the same year Cough |
I coulda sworn Cook and Sasha were on that team too. The only difference is Vlad versus Chucky. Chucky shot 38.6% that year. Vlad shot 39%.
And BTW that Seattle team was a fluke in a year in which half of their roster was playing for a new contract. How far did they get this year with that formula? |
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magic_bryant
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Joined: 16 Oct 2002
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| Posted: Thu Aug 10, 2006 12:56 pm Post subject: |
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| wolfpaclaker wrote: | Anderson is better at perimeter defense than interior defense. Bynum had an and 1 play off him with such ease when they matched up in Cleveland.
Most good interior defenders wouldn't allow that Bynum to handle him like that.
He's a good role player - but a backup. |
No. Varejao is good enough to play defense on the secondary post player. Kwame takes the dominant player inside. When you have your Dirk's, Pau's, etc Varejao guards them. It allows you to move Odom to 3.
Cook better than Varejao? Come on wolf. Please. You know better than that, man.
_________________
Stephon Marbury on Kobe: "He's the only person on 'dis earth that can do 'dat. He guards people, like shuts 'em down. Then, to do 'dat on 'da offensive end. It's like 'Damn, I can't score on him AND he about to bust my ass." |
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gng930
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| Posted: Thu Aug 10, 2006 12:57 pm Post subject: |
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I think Wino's right...what's say you just make any closing argument you need to and we agree to call it a day. Cool? 
The prosecution rests.
Last edited by gng930 on Thu Aug 10, 2006 1:00 pm; edited 1 time in total |
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THE_SHOES
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Location: Taiwan
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| Posted: Thu Aug 10, 2006 12:58 pm Post subject: |
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Memo to Laker fans:
The Lakers closed out the season labled as overachievers...
They were undermanned, young and still running the triangle in remedio
fashion...
Well, guess what?
They've gotten older, wiser, bigger,stronger, faster,and above it all...
Look out NBA.
The Lakers now know what they are doing...
_________________
"According to ESPN.com's conference projections, the Lakers will finish 12th in the West, which prompted Bryant to tweet earlier this offseason, "12th I see.." |
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wolfpaclaker
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| Posted: Thu Aug 10, 2006 12:58 pm Post subject: |
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Seattle didn't have the coaching last season. Nate is a much better coach, especially for that kind of system. He also cares about defense, something the other guys don't.
The difference is that they just won't be shooting 3's. They will be playing within a system. It's not like they will just go upcourt and start jacking. The shots will come through the Triangle. Cook is also a great mid-range shooter and he's more effective from there than the 3 point line.
You can really spread the floor out with that lineup and allow Kobe/Odom to attack freely.
Radmanovic is a pure shooter. Atkins wasn't. |
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wolfpaclaker
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| Posted: Thu Aug 10, 2006 1:01 pm Post subject: |
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| Quote: | | Cook better than Varejao? Come on wolf. Please. You know better than that, man. |
He is.
Cook - 7.9 points. 51.1 % in under 19 minutes.
He is twice the scorer that AV is.
Cook's got issues defensively, but when he's shooting well (which is more often than not) his +/- is positive. |
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magic_bryant
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Joined: 16 Oct 2002
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| Posted: Thu Aug 10, 2006 1:08 pm Post subject: |
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| wolfpaclaker wrote: | | Quote: | | Cook better than Varejao? Come on wolf. Please. You know better than that, man. |
He is.
Cook - 7.9 points. 51.1 % in under 19 minutes.
He is twice the scorer that AV is.
Cook's got issues defensively, but when he's shooting well (which is more often than not) his +/- is positive. |
OMG!!!
This is exactly my problem with you. You site offensive stats. +/- stats don't take into account who is and who isn't on the court with him. Cook is rarely on the court without Kobe and his game feeds off Kobe's.
And if Cook's shooting is off, then what? His ass gets glued to the bench.
Varejao? His DEFENSE, that thing that you never site in your player assessments, allows him to stay on the court and contribute.
Varejao's ability to shoot elbow and baseline from 12-15' and go off the dribble, ALONG with his defense, would make him a VERY good fit at 4 with the guys in our starting lineup.
Cook better than Vareajo? :roll:
As gng said, we'll see when each player's contracts run out.
_________________
Stephon Marbury on Kobe: "He's the only person on 'dis earth that can do 'dat. He guards people, like shuts 'em down. Then, to do 'dat on 'da offensive end. It's like 'Damn, I can't score on him AND he about to bust my ass." |
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Dennis_D
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Location: North Dallas
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| Posted: Thu Aug 10, 2006 1:21 pm Post subject: |
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| MIMLaker wrote: | Thanks, I appreciate the response. But here's where i'm really starting to get annoyed with management.
I feel like they aimed low in the alst 2 off-seasons. They shook things up by signing Phil, true, but they seemingly didn't want to "rebuild on the fly." In the past two eyars, what talents have they added on the floor?
Sasha
Mihm*
Atkins
Jones
McKie
Bynum
Turiaf
Von Wafer
Kwame
Profit
Smush
Out of all of those additions, only Mihm and Kwame are probably capable of producing heavy minutes for the team this year, and Mihm is repeatedly injured. Sasha is still a wildcard, given his shaky shot and thin frame.
Why didn't they sign/ acquire moderately-priced talent in the MLE to $9M range to start, rather than go for the cheap or the brittle? A LOT can be pinned on the 2007/08/10 plans.
MIM |
I hate to jump in someone else's argument, but what the @#@$ are you talking about, MIM? "[T]hey seemingly didn't want to 'rebuild on the fly.'"? What does that mean? The Lakers had one season out of the playoffs and they were on a pace to possibly make the playoffs but things feel apart after Rudy quit and Odom was injured. I would consider that "rebuilding on the fly". Why don't you?
Were you really expecting the Lakers to draft someone "capable of producing heavy minutes for the team" with the 27th pick in 2004 and the 37th and 39th pick in 2005? Profit was a throw in on the Kwame trade and that did much better than expectations. Atkins was acquired because the Lakers were trading their PG to get Mihm and he was traded the next off-season.
Look, each off-season since the Shaq trade, Mitch has targeted one player who wanted to acquired. In 2004, it was Mihm. In 2005, it was Kwame. In 2006, it was Radmanovic. In the 2005 draft, Mitch opted to take a project C because he felt was the best prospect long-term available when he would pick. All the rest of the players on your list (except McKie) were acquired with late draft picks, as throw-ins in trades or as undrafted free agents (you left out Green). Rather than praising Mitch for getting something useful out of next to nothing, you are bashing him.
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<-- My avatar is Margaret Nolan from one of the Carry On films. She was the girl who got painted gold in "Goldfinger". Thanks to CaliRyderX for identifying her. |
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Luke
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| Posted: Thu Aug 10, 2006 1:38 pm Post subject: |
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| wolfpaclaker wrote: | | Quote: | | Cook better than Varejao? Come on wolf. Please. You know better than that, man. |
He is.
Cook - 7.9 points. 51.1 % in under 19 minutes.
He is twice the scorer that AV is.
Cook's got issues defensively, but when he's shooting well (which is more often than not) his +/- is positive. |
Try to trade for Varejao and you'll see how he is better than Cook !
Varejao is the second best player in Cleveland, , if you speak about playoff impact, I saw it clearly this spring. Not kidding, he had more impact than Z, Gooden, Hughes or every other player on the Cavs ' roster not named Lebron. |
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wolfpaclaker
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| Posted: Thu Aug 10, 2006 2:11 pm Post subject: |
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Cook is better than AV because he can do that with Kobe. How many times does a player have to be out there without Kobe?
This is Kobe's team. Cook plays well with Kobe. He is a good pick for that reason alone.
It's not like we expect to build our franchise through the low 1st round draft. The Lakers have the cornerstone guys in Kobe and Lamar. What they need are complimentary players. A truck load of them.
Kwame
Radmanovic
Parker
Mihm
Cook
Walton
We have 6 complimentary players that can be relied upon. It will take some time but this team has a number of pieces ready. What we need from the complimentary players
Kwame: Dunking, Post defense, Screen and roll Defense, Layups, Rebounding, Willing to use 6 Hard fouls.
Radmanovic: Shooting, 2nd/3rd option aggressiveness, Rebounding.
Parker: Perimeter defense, Spot shooting, Sharp cuts, Quicly on to the wings on the break, Pressure defense.
Mihm: Shotblocking, Post scoring.
Cook: Mid-range shooting, Perimeter shooting, Rebounding.
Walton: Passing, Post up play, Rebounding.
Some of you guys act as if these guys have no ability whatsoever. We have atleast 6 complimentary players that can help Kobe and Lamar RIGHT NOW. |
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Luke
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| Posted: Thu Aug 10, 2006 2:19 pm Post subject: |
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Unfortunately for Cook, he is not playing well enough to be on the Laker roster in the future.
They are expecting him to improve significantly or he will be treated like devean George, not good enough to remain... |
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wolfpaclaker
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| Posted: Thu Aug 10, 2006 2:25 pm Post subject: |
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| Luke wrote: | Unfortunately for Cook, he is not playing well enough to be on the Laker roster in the future.
They are expecting him to improve significantly or he will be treated like devean George, not good enough to remain... |
The Lakers are pretty high on Cook. You have to look hard in the league for players like him. He's 6'10 and can shoot from anywhere from the court.
Next summer he will get a decent contract. Everyone's raving about Barbosa's K - but experts expect Cook to get a pretty hefty amount of money too in FA.
If he doesn't stay a Laker, it's more to do with the fact that they just don't like paying players money for basically being bench players. |
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Wino
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| Posted: Thu Aug 10, 2006 2:45 pm Post subject: |
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| gng930 wrote: | | Wino wrote: |
Who's gng930????
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The same guy who has more posts than you! BOO-YAH! |
OK, now I feel bad!  
And of course by that ??LOGIC?? you should have a LOT MORE respect for wolfpaclaker!!
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Never argue with stupid people! They will drag you down to their level and then beat you with experience!! - Twain
Last edited by Wino on Thu Aug 10, 2006 2:53 pm; edited 1 time in total |
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