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adkindo Retired Number
Joined: 16 Jun 2005 Posts: 40345 Location: Dirty South
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Posted: Wed Mar 21, 2018 1:13 pm Post subject: |
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ChickenStu wrote: | ^
Basically, it's the price of doing business. If you lose him, you're pretty much in a clear re-tooling, if not an outright rebuild of your team. With Pop at his age, do they want to do that? But I get the thought, as to why some teams/GM's/owners may simply feel it's not worth it. |
can you imagine if someone tears their Achilles in year 2 of a Super Max deal? or gets diagnosed with some rapid deterioration knee issue like Brandon Roy, Greg Oden or Penny Hardaway on one of those deals. It would destroy a franchise for years. |
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adkindo Retired Number
Joined: 16 Jun 2005 Posts: 40345 Location: Dirty South
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Posted: Wed Mar 21, 2018 1:14 pm Post subject: |
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lonzobryant wrote: | Inspector Gadget wrote: | noahp45 wrote: | It's possible Lakers could have a team of
Ball
Pg13
Leonard
Randle
BI |
Yep, I feel like if LeBron doesn’t come we will try getting Leonard.... just imagine the havoc a PG/Leonard duo can do defensively... and add in Ball and Ingram... that’s scary. |
Kawhi should be plan A. I'm taking a 26 yo Leonard over 33 yo LeBron easily. I'm also not worried about Kawhi's injury as I think he's sitting out to spite the Spurs. |
how can it be plan A when he may never even become a FA? |
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lonzobryant Starting Rotation
Joined: 05 Sep 2017 Posts: 594
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Posted: Wed Mar 21, 2018 1:15 pm Post subject: |
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adkindo wrote: | lonzobryant wrote: | Inspector Gadget wrote: | noahp45 wrote: | It's possible Lakers could have a team of
Ball
Pg13
Leonard
Randle
BI |
Yep, I feel like if LeBron doesn’t come we will try getting Leonard.... just imagine the havoc a PG/Leonard duo can do defensively... and add in Ball and Ingram... that’s scary. |
Kawhi should be plan A. I'm taking a 26 yo Leonard over 33 yo LeBron easily. I'm also not worried about Kawhi's injury as I think he's sitting out to spite the Spurs. |
how can it be plan A when he may never even become a FA? |
I was responding to his post where he says if we don't Lebron he thinks the team will go after Kawhi...I'm assuming he meant trade talks...just saying they should be doing that anyway. |
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durden-tyler Star Player
Joined: 22 Dec 2003 Posts: 1266
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Posted: Wed Mar 21, 2018 1:16 pm Post subject: |
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adkindo wrote: | lonzobryant wrote: | Inspector Gadget wrote: | noahp45 wrote: | It's possible Lakers could have a team of
Ball
Pg13
Leonard
Randle
BI |
Yep, I feel like if LeBron doesn’t come we will try getting Leonard.... just imagine the havoc a PG/Leonard duo can do defensively... and add in Ball and Ingram... that’s scary. |
Kawhi should be plan A. I'm taking a 26 yo Leonard over 33 yo LeBron easily. I'm also not worried about Kawhi's injury as I think he's sitting out to spite the Spurs. |
how can it be plan A when he may never even become a FA? |
Yeah, something who is highly unlikely to happen should never be your plan A... |
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Jesusdelonla Franchise Player
Joined: 24 Jan 2018 Posts: 15430
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Posted: Wed Mar 21, 2018 1:17 pm Post subject: |
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adkindo wrote: | Jesusdelonla wrote: | adkindo wrote: | durden-tyler wrote: | 32 wrote: | If KL turns down an extension will he be a UFA in 2019? Or will he still be a RFA? |
UFA I think... |
correct....but until someone actually turns the designated veteran extension down....my assumption will continue to be every player will accept the extension.....it is just too much money to say no to in my opinion. |
i don't know so asking. whats the difference between regular max from other team to a super max contract? |
Spurs can offer him a 5 year contract starting @ 35% of cap, with maximum annual increases (8%), and any other team could only offer him a 4 year contract starting @ 30% of cap with 5% annual increases.
Rough estimates....someone correct me if I am wrong.
Spurs - over $205 Million over 5 years
Year 1 - $35,000,000
Year 2 - $37,800,000
Year 3 - $40,824,000
Year 4 - $44,090,000
Year 5 - $47,617,000
Another Team - near $130 Million over 4 years
Year 1 - $30,000,000
Year 2 - $31,500,000
Year 3 - $33,075,000
Year 4 - $34,725,000 |
thanks, so we removed the 5th year(not raise) the difference is around 27m. thats significant |
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adkindo Retired Number
Joined: 16 Jun 2005 Posts: 40345 Location: Dirty South
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Posted: Wed Mar 21, 2018 1:20 pm Post subject: |
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Jesusdelonla wrote: | thanks, so we removed the 5th year(not raise) the difference is around 27m. thats significant |
yeah, roughly...my numbers are probably off a little bit....but if your Kawhi and you have any long term concerns about your recent injury....that 5th year is huge.....especially for a guy like Kawhi who does not pull in the endorsement money of similar stars. |
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defense Retired Number
Joined: 12 Jan 2010 Posts: 39608
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Posted: Wed Mar 21, 2018 1:35 pm Post subject: |
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Jesusdelonla wrote: | adkindo wrote: | Jesusdelonla wrote: | adkindo wrote: | durden-tyler wrote: | 32 wrote: | If KL turns down an extension will he be a UFA in 2019? Or will he still be a RFA? |
UFA I think... |
correct....but until someone actually turns the designated veteran extension down....my assumption will continue to be every player will accept the extension.....it is just too much money to say no to in my opinion. |
i don't know so asking. whats the difference between regular max from other team to a super max contract? |
Spurs can offer him a 5 year contract starting @ 35% of cap, with maximum annual increases (8%), and any other team could only offer him a 4 year contract starting @ 30% of cap with 5% annual increases.
Rough estimates....someone correct me if I am wrong.
Spurs - over $205 Million over 5 years
Year 1 - $35,000,000
Year 2 - $37,800,000
Year 3 - $40,824,000
Year 4 - $44,090,000
Year 5 - $47,617,000
Another Team - near $130 Million over 4 years
Year 1 - $30,000,000
Year 2 - $31,500,000
Year 3 - $33,075,000
Year 4 - $34,725,000 |
thanks, so we removed the 5th year(not raise) the difference is around 27m. thats significant |
Crazy that the league allows the max to be over 1/3 of the salary cap. You would think it would be lower. |
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Jesusdelonla Franchise Player
Joined: 24 Jan 2018 Posts: 15430
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Posted: Wed Mar 21, 2018 1:36 pm Post subject: |
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adkindo wrote: | Jesusdelonla wrote: | thanks, so we removed the 5th year(not raise) the difference is around 27m. thats significant |
yeah, roughly...my numbers are probably off a little bit....but if your Kawhi and you have any long term concerns about your recent injury....that 5th year is huge.....especially for a guy like Kawhi who does not pull in the endorsement money of similar stars. |
yeah agre,
they didnt sign extension with the Jordan brand this summer.
in LA, we don't have a big dog(both teams), so if he comes here, the shoe deal might ballon up. |
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pjiddy Retired Number
Joined: 12 Dec 2005 Posts: 29078
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Posted: Wed Mar 21, 2018 1:39 pm Post subject: |
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Jesusdelonla wrote: | adkindo wrote: | Jesusdelonla wrote: | thanks, so we removed the 5th year(not raise) the difference is around 27m. thats significant |
yeah, roughly...my numbers are probably off a little bit....but if your Kawhi and you have any long term concerns about your recent injury....that 5th year is huge.....especially for a guy like Kawhi who does not pull in the endorsement money of similar stars. |
yeah agre,
they didnt sign extension with the Jordan brand this summer.
in LA, we don't have a big dog(both teams), so if he comes here, the shoe deal might ballon up. |
Highly doubt being in LA makes up all the money he'd be losing as a Spur. |
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venturalakersfan Retired Number
Joined: 14 Apr 2001 Posts: 144475 Location: The Gold Coast
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Posted: Wed Mar 21, 2018 1:51 pm Post subject: |
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lonzobryant wrote: | Inspector Gadget wrote: | noahp45 wrote: | It's possible Lakers could have a team of
Ball
Pg13
Leonard
Randle
BI |
Yep, I feel like if LeBron doesn’t come we will try getting Leonard.... just imagine the havoc a PG/Leonard duo can do defensively... and add in Ball and Ingram... that’s scary. |
Kawhi should be plan A. I'm taking a 26 yo Leonard over 33 yo LeBron easily. I'm also not worried about Kawhi's injury as I think he's sitting out to spite the Spurs. |
It might be worth worrying about, it could be degenerative _________________ RIP mom. 11-21-1933 to 6-14-2023. |
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adkindo Retired Number
Joined: 16 Jun 2005 Posts: 40345 Location: Dirty South
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Posted: Wed Mar 21, 2018 1:51 pm Post subject: |
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Jesusdelonla wrote: | adkindo wrote: | Jesusdelonla wrote: | thanks, so we removed the 5th year(not raise) the difference is around 27m. thats significant |
yeah, roughly...my numbers are probably off a little bit....but if your Kawhi and you have any long term concerns about your recent injury....that 5th year is huge.....especially for a guy like Kawhi who does not pull in the endorsement money of similar stars. |
yeah agre,
they didnt sign extension with the Jordan brand this summer.
in LA, we don't have a big dog(both teams), so if he comes here, the shoe deal might ballon up. |
I was surprised that in general, the Jordan Brand pays less than Nike/Adidas. |
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babyskyhook Franchise Player
Joined: 15 Jul 2009 Posts: 18492 Location: The Garden Island
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Posted: Wed Mar 21, 2018 2:14 pm Post subject: |
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adkindo wrote: | Jesusdelonla wrote: | adkindo wrote: | durden-tyler wrote: | 32 wrote: | If KL turns down an extension will he be a UFA in 2019? Or will he still be a RFA? |
UFA I think... |
correct....but until someone actually turns the designated veteran extension down....my assumption will continue to be every player will accept the extension.....it is just too much money to say no to in my opinion. |
i don't know so asking. whats the difference between regular max from other team to a super max contract? |
Spurs can offer him a 5 year contract starting @ 35% of cap, with maximum annual increases (8%), and any other team could only offer him a 4 year contract starting @ 30% of cap with 5% annual increases.
Rough estimates....someone correct me if I am wrong.
Spurs - over $205 Million over 5 years
Year 1 - $35,000,000
Year 2 - $37,800,000
Year 3 - $40,824,000
Year 4 - $44,090,000
Year 5 - $47,617,000
Another Team - near $130 Million over 4 years
Year 1 - $30,000,000
Year 2 - $31,500,000
Year 3 - $33,075,000
Year 4 - $34,725,000 |
My understanding of the DPE is that it's for players with 8 or 9 years of experience, so it's not as extreme of a difference in money as it would seem. the big difference is having that money guaranteed.
KL will have 8 years of experience after next season, so that's when the extension would kick in, as Westbrook's does next year for the extension he signed last summer/fall.
If KL rejects the extension and opts out next summer, he could sign a 2+1 at 30% of the cap and in 2022, do a 5 year deal at 35% of the cap with his new team. So he'd really be looking at 2 years of 5% less money (and smaller raises), assuming he later signed the 5 year max with the new team.
It's really a matter of guaranteed money, not so much the absolute difference between what he could make in the two scenarios. |
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babyskyhook Franchise Player
Joined: 15 Jul 2009 Posts: 18492 Location: The Garden Island
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Posted: Wed Mar 21, 2018 2:18 pm Post subject: |
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^^^ To add to the above:
KL could easily offset two years at approx $5-7m in lost money by joining the Lakers through increased endorsement $$$.
The question really becomes how concerned is he about his injury and his long-term health.
The proof will be in the pudding this summer, one way or the other. |
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Jesusdelonla Franchise Player
Joined: 24 Jan 2018 Posts: 15430
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Posted: Wed Mar 21, 2018 2:21 pm Post subject: |
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pjiddy wrote: | Jesusdelonla wrote: | adkindo wrote: | Jesusdelonla wrote: | thanks, so we removed the 5th year(not raise) the difference is around 27m. thats significant |
yeah, roughly...my numbers are probably off a little bit....but if your Kawhi and you have any long term concerns about your recent injury....that 5th year is huge.....especially for a guy like Kawhi who does not pull in the endorsement money of similar stars. |
yeah agre,
they didnt sign extension with the Jordan brand this summer.
in LA, we don't have a big dog(both teams), so if he comes here, the shoe deal might ballon up. |
Highly doubt being in LA makes up all the money he'd be losing as a Spur. |
yes it does:
lebron james: 1 billion Nike
Harden: 200million Addidas
K Durant: 300million - Nike
The “Greek Freak” kicks of a new four-year, $100 million deal with the Milwaukee Bucks next season
Damian Lillard 10-year deal more than $100 million
on and on. thats just shoe deal.
if he wants he can get all other commercials as CP3 (state farm ) as well, he will earn morel |
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Jesusdelonla Franchise Player
Joined: 24 Jan 2018 Posts: 15430
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Posted: Wed Mar 21, 2018 2:28 pm Post subject: |
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adkindo wrote: | Jesusdelonla wrote: | adkindo wrote: | Jesusdelonla wrote: | thanks, so we removed the 5th year(not raise) the difference is around 27m. thats significant |
yeah, roughly...my numbers are probably off a little bit....but if your Kawhi and you have any long term concerns about your recent injury....that 5th year is huge.....especially for a guy like Kawhi who does not pull in the endorsement money of similar stars. |
yeah agre,
they didnt sign extension with the Jordan brand this summer.
in LA, we don't have a big dog(both teams), so if he comes here, the shoe deal might ballon up. |
I was surprised that in general, the Jordan Brand pays less than Nike/Adidas. |
yeah, if he wants he can go sign with Adidas or whoever pays more |
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noahp45 Star Player
Joined: 23 Apr 2006 Posts: 6572 Location: Oceanside Ca
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Posted: Wed Mar 21, 2018 3:04 pm Post subject: |
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Jesusdelonla wrote: | adkindo wrote: | Jesusdelonla wrote: | adkindo wrote: | Jesusdelonla wrote: | thanks, so we removed the 5th year(not raise) the difference is around 27m. thats significant |
yeah, roughly...my numbers are probably off a little bit....but if your Kawhi and you have any long term concerns about your recent injury....that 5th year is huge.....especially for a guy like Kawhi who does not pull in the endorsement money of similar stars. |
yeah agre,
they didnt sign extension with the Jordan brand this summer.
in LA, we don't have a big dog(both teams), so if he comes here, the shoe deal might ballon up. |
I was surprised that in general, the Jordan Brand pays less than Nike/Adidas. |
yeah, if he wants he can go sign with Adidas or whoever pays more |
I don't get why anyone would sign with Jordan brand, unless they are J'S they are ugly. I would sign with Adidas or Nike alone. |
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venturalakersfan Retired Number
Joined: 14 Apr 2001 Posts: 144475 Location: The Gold Coast
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Posted: Wed Mar 21, 2018 3:11 pm Post subject: |
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babyskyhook wrote: | ^^^ To add to the above:
KL could easily offset two years at approx $5-7m in lost money by joining the Lakers through increased endorsement $$$.
The question really becomes how concerned is he about his injury and his long-term health.
The proof will be in the pudding this summer, one way or the other. |
Leonard would lose 5% of the cap and 3% raises for two years. Using projected cap numbers, he would lose approximately $12-13 mil. _________________ RIP mom. 11-21-1933 to 6-14-2023. |
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pjiddy Retired Number
Joined: 12 Dec 2005 Posts: 29078
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Posted: Wed Mar 21, 2018 3:17 pm Post subject: |
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Jesusdelonla wrote: | pjiddy wrote: | Jesusdelonla wrote: | adkindo wrote: | Jesusdelonla wrote: | thanks, so we removed the 5th year(not raise) the difference is around 27m. thats significant |
yeah, roughly...my numbers are probably off a little bit....but if your Kawhi and you have any long term concerns about your recent injury....that 5th year is huge.....especially for a guy like Kawhi who does not pull in the endorsement money of similar stars. |
yeah agre,
they didnt sign extension with the Jordan brand this summer.
in LA, we don't have a big dog(both teams), so if he comes here, the shoe deal might ballon up. |
Highly doubt being in LA makes up all the money he'd be losing as a Spur. |
yes it does:
lebron james: 1 billion Nike
Harden: 200million Addidas
K Durant: 300million - Nike
The “Greek Freak” kicks of a new four-year, $100 million deal with the Milwaukee Bucks next season
Damian Lillard 10-year deal more than $100 million
on and on. thats just shoe deal.
if he wants he can get all other commercials as CP3 (state farm ) as well, he will earn morel |
Not sure how this proves your point. None of those guys play in LA, let alone a large market, and yet they still got those deals. Kinda proves my point that the city doesn't matter anymore, no? And that a player's personality and play style has a bigger effect on endorsement opportunities. |
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yinoma2001 Retired Number
Joined: 19 Jun 2010 Posts: 119487
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Posted: Wed Mar 21, 2018 3:39 pm Post subject: |
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Could also mean that you get an enhanced endorsement earning though if they were in the La market. Many shoe companies offer such enhancements if you’re in LA/NY for example.
If you’re making THAT much in Clev or Portland it will be enhanced in LA. _________________ From 2-10 to the Western Conference Finals |
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babyskyhook Franchise Player
Joined: 15 Jul 2009 Posts: 18492 Location: The Garden Island
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Posted: Wed Mar 21, 2018 3:50 pm Post subject: |
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venturalakersfan wrote: | babyskyhook wrote: | ^^^ To add to the above:
KL could easily offset two years at approx $5-7m in lost money by joining the Lakers through increased endorsement $$$.
The question really becomes how concerned is he about his injury and his long-term health.
The proof will be in the pudding this summer, one way or the other. |
Leonard would lose 5% of the cap and 3% raises for two years. Using projected cap numbers, he would lose approximately $12-13 mil. |
Correct. That's what I was figuring, but I realize that my post was unclear. I was saying two years at approx $5-7m per year would be easily offset by increased endorsements, but failed to put in "per year".
So we agree on what that lost money would look like. |
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babyskyhook Franchise Player
Joined: 15 Jul 2009 Posts: 18492 Location: The Garden Island
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Posted: Wed Mar 21, 2018 3:57 pm Post subject: |
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yinoma2001 wrote: | Could also mean that you get an enhanced endorsement earning though if they were in the La market. Many shoe companies offer such enhancements if you’re in LA/NY for example.
If you’re making THAT much in Clev or Portland it will be enhanced in LA. |
The shoe companies are a huge driver behind the scenes that don't get talked about that much. My understanding is that Nike wanted KD in GS badly for his increased exposure, bigger market and to offset Steph/UA.
He didn't go to GS because of that, but knowing that Nike was going to increase his endorsement deal made it a wash in terms of taking less money to sign there.
Adidas could do something similar in a Kawhi to LA move. If they gave him enough to offset two years of lesser salary and cover the cost of an insurance policy that would protect him against career-ending injury, the move becomes a lot easier to make.
He could also use the threat of Adidas to get Nike/Jordan to step up. He'd be a lot more valuable to any company as the face of the Lakers than as the face of the Spurs, who are as low-profile as any team in the NBA, despite their success over the last two decades. |
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yinoma2001 Retired Number
Joined: 19 Jun 2010 Posts: 119487
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Posted: Wed Mar 21, 2018 4:00 pm Post subject: |
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babyskyhook wrote: | yinoma2001 wrote: | Could also mean that you get an enhanced endorsement earning though if they were in the La market. Many shoe companies offer such enhancements if you’re in LA/NY for example.
If you’re making THAT much in Clev or Portland it will be enhanced in LA. |
The shoe companies are a huge driver behind the scenes that don't get talked about that much. My understanding is that Nike wanted KD in GS badly for his increased exposure, bigger market and to offset Steph/UA.
He didn't go to GS because of that, but knowing that Nike was going to increase his endorsement deal made it a wash in terms of taking less money to sign there.
Adidas could do something similar in a Kawhi to LA move. If they gave him enough to offset two years of lesser salary and cover the cost of an insurance policy that would protect him against career-ending injury, the move becomes a lot easier to make.
He could also use the threat of Adidas to get Nike/Jordan to step up. He'd be a lot more valuable to any company as the face of the Lakers than as the face of the Spurs, who are as low-profile as any team in the NBA, despite their success over the last two decades. |
I would imagine PG13 would get a sizeable bump in his Nike deal and increased shoe sales (I pledge to buy one of his dope shoes if he signs). _________________ From 2-10 to the Western Conference Finals |
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babyskyhook Franchise Player
Joined: 15 Jul 2009 Posts: 18492 Location: The Garden Island
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Posted: Wed Mar 21, 2018 4:04 pm Post subject: |
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yinoma2001 wrote: | babyskyhook wrote: | yinoma2001 wrote: | Could also mean that you get an enhanced endorsement earning though if they were in the La market. Many shoe companies offer such enhancements if you’re in LA/NY for example.
If you’re making THAT much in Clev or Portland it will be enhanced in LA. |
The shoe companies are a huge driver behind the scenes that don't get talked about that much. My understanding is that Nike wanted KD in GS badly for his increased exposure, bigger market and to offset Steph/UA.
He didn't go to GS because of that, but knowing that Nike was going to increase his endorsement deal made it a wash in terms of taking less money to sign there.
Adidas could do something similar in a Kawhi to LA move. If they gave him enough to offset two years of lesser salary and cover the cost of an insurance policy that would protect him against career-ending injury, the move becomes a lot easier to make.
He could also use the threat of Adidas to get Nike/Jordan to step up. He'd be a lot more valuable to any company as the face of the Lakers than as the face of the Spurs, who are as low-profile as any team in the NBA, despite their success over the last two decades. |
I would imagine PG13 would get a sizeable bump in his Nike deal and increased shoe sales (I pledge to buy one of his dope shoes if he signs). |
It will put PG into a different category if he joins the Lakers, and especially if it's just him (no Lebron). I'd think Nike would help incentivize him to make the move.
They're not selling any extra PG shoes as long as he's in OKC, but his signature shoes will get a massive sales spike if he's the new face of the Lakers next year. For Nike, that would be found money. |
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yinoma2001 Retired Number
Joined: 19 Jun 2010 Posts: 119487
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Posted: Wed Mar 21, 2018 4:17 pm Post subject: |
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His shoes are nice but I never see any ads for him. It’s always WB and will be if he’s there. _________________ From 2-10 to the Western Conference Finals |
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yinoma2001 Retired Number
Joined: 19 Jun 2010 Posts: 119487
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Posted: Wed Mar 21, 2018 4:35 pm Post subject: |
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Crazy how LBJ’s possible last stand in Clev is with KLove and a bunch of role players. That went downhill pretty fast. _________________ From 2-10 to the Western Conference Finals |
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