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AFireInside619 Franchise Player
Joined: 11 Dec 2015 Posts: 11447
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Posted: Mon Sep 07, 2020 5:07 am Post subject: |
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cencio_999 wrote: | He is basically the same player he was as a rookie.
Not a bust considering his draft position, but still a disappointment. |
Are we watching the same game? You know he’s been solid inside the bubble right? Find someone else who does what he does for 3 million a year. _________________ “You have to dance beautifully in the box that you are comfortable dancing in.” - Kobe Bryant |
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cencio_999 Starting Rotation
Joined: 12 Nov 2019 Posts: 264
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Posted: Mon Sep 07, 2020 5:13 am Post subject: |
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AFireInside619 wrote: | cencio_999 wrote: | He is basically the same player he was as a rookie.
Not a bust considering his draft position, but still a disappointment. |
Are we watching the same game? You know he’s been solid inside the bubble right? Find someone else who does what he does for 3 million a year. |
I'm looking at his development over the last three years, not just at a bunch of games inside the bubble.
Last summer our front office (and most of us) clearly supposed/hoped he could have became a reliable 3rd scoring option in a championship team, but he's not. |
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RG73 Franchise Player
Joined: 14 Jul 2001 Posts: 11508
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Posted: Mon Sep 07, 2020 5:23 am Post subject: |
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cencio_999 wrote: | He is basically the same player he was as a rookie.
Not a bust considering his draft position, but still a disappointment. |
What exactly are your expectations for 27th picks in the draft? Yes, in the last decade Gobert, Siakam, Bogdanovic all 27th...but so were Jajuan Johnson and Arnett Moultrie. 27th is a crap shoot (as is the entire draft, btw...). You get a rotation player there and you've done well. |
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AFireInside619 Franchise Player
Joined: 11 Dec 2015 Posts: 11447
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Posted: Mon Sep 07, 2020 5:24 am Post subject: |
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cencio_999 wrote: | AFireInside619 wrote: | cencio_999 wrote: | He is basically the same player he was as a rookie.
Not a bust considering his draft position, but still a disappointment. |
Are we watching the same game? You know he’s been solid inside the bubble right? Find someone else who does what he does for 3 million a year. |
I'm looking at his development over the last three years, not just at a bunch of games inside the bubble.
Last summer our front office (and most of us) clearly supposed/hoped he could have became a reliable 3rd scoring option in a championship team, but he's not. |
I think you’re expecting a lot from a guy coming off the bench, who plays behind two of the best generational talents ever. If Kuzma was on NOLA, he’d be scoring 20+ points a game. He’s in a very tough position, because he hears all the talk. He sees what BI is doing. He’s basically our Ariza in 09. The most we can ask of him is to make corner 3’s, play great defense, move without the ball on offense, and clean up the glass. _________________ “You have to dance beautifully in the box that you are comfortable dancing in.” - Kobe Bryant |
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cencio_999 Starting Rotation
Joined: 12 Nov 2019 Posts: 264
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Posted: Mon Sep 07, 2020 5:32 am Post subject: |
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Fine, clearly we have diffent memory about which were the expectations on him, starting from his rookie year (i.e. the steal of the draft and possible ROY) until the beginning of this season (i.e. possible 6th MOY or at least a >15 ppg player).
As I said, he didn't fail his draft position, but what could be (more or less) reasonable to assume being his development given a very good rookie year. |
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FrankUnderwood Starting Rotation
Joined: 23 Oct 2019 Posts: 257
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Posted: Mon Sep 07, 2020 5:37 am Post subject: |
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cencio_999 wrote: | AFireInside619 wrote: | cencio_999 wrote: | He is basically the same player he was as a rookie.
Not a bust considering his draft position, but still a disappointment. |
Are we watching the same game? You know he’s been solid inside the bubble right? Find someone else who does what he does for 3 million a year. |
I'm looking at his development over the last three years, not just at a bunch of games inside the bubble.
Last summer our front office (and most of us) clearly supposed/hoped he could have became a reliable 3rd scoring option in a championship team, but he's not. |
He’s wayyyy better in all aspects except shooting since his rookie year. Especially his defense and ball handling. |
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cencio_999 Starting Rotation
Joined: 12 Nov 2019 Posts: 264
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Posted: Mon Sep 07, 2020 5:51 am Post subject: |
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FrankUnderwood wrote: | cencio_999 wrote: | AFireInside619 wrote: | cencio_999 wrote: | He is basically the same player he was as a rookie.
Not a bust considering his draft position, but still a disappointment. |
Are we watching the same game? You know he’s been solid inside the bubble right? Find someone else who does what he does for 3 million a year. |
I'm looking at his development over the last three years, not just at a bunch of games inside the bubble.
Last summer our front office (and most of us) clearly supposed/hoped he could have became a reliable 3rd scoring option in a championship team, but he's not. |
He’s wayyyy better in all aspects except shooting since his rookie year. Especially his defense and ball handling. |
I remember him attacking the rim more in his rookie year than now.
It surely depends on his different role in the team and the different roster, but I don't see how you can see an improvement in his ball handling.
Now, almost half of his FGA are 3 pointers, and if his shooting got worse, clearly his offensive contribution got worse.
Re defense, he's clearly putting into more effort in it (at least in the last games), but he's still the weak link that any offense tries to exploit and his defense almost never makes uncomfortable his matchup. |
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Ksig Star Player
Joined: 03 Dec 2016 Posts: 2098
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Posted: Mon Sep 07, 2020 7:28 am Post subject: |
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Im pretty sure he's been our best 3pt shooter (besides maybe Lebron/AD) in the bubble on good volume (25/64 for 39%), so he's actually turning into a very good shooter with elite defense. |
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Ziggy Franchise Player
Joined: 10 Feb 2005 Posts: 12722
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Posted: Mon Sep 07, 2020 8:55 am Post subject: |
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cencio_999 wrote: | Fine, clearly we have diffent memory about which were the expectations on him, starting from his rookie year (i.e. the steal of the draft and possible ROY) until the beginning of this season (i.e. possible 6th MOY or at least a >15 ppg player).
As I said, he didn't fail his draft position, but what could be (more or less) reasonable to assume being his development given a very good rookie year. |
I remember warning people about his projections when they were through the roof his rookie year. He was a 3 year college player and one of the older draft picks of that draft. It's rare for players like that to have a steep development curve their first few years in the league. |
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MJST Retired Number
Joined: 06 Jul 2014 Posts: 26409
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Posted: Mon Sep 07, 2020 9:08 am Post subject: |
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Ksig wrote: | Im pretty sure he's been our best 3pt shooter (besides maybe Lebron/AD) in the bubble on good volume (25/64 for 39%), so he's actually turning into a very good shooter with elite defense. |
Elite is a very big stretch. _________________ How NBA 2K18 failed the All-Time Lakers:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kxMBYm3wwxk |
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Ksig Star Player
Joined: 03 Dec 2016 Posts: 2098
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Posted: Mon Sep 07, 2020 11:35 am Post subject: |
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MJST wrote: | Ksig wrote: | Im pretty sure he's been our best 3pt shooter (besides maybe Lebron/AD) in the bubble on good volume (25/64 for 39%), so he's actually turning into a very good shooter with elite defense. |
Elite is a very big stretch. |
He's much closer to elite than what you give him credit for. And the stats in the bubble and what we're seeing backs it up; aside from one bad game in game 1. |
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cencio_999 Starting Rotation
Joined: 12 Nov 2019 Posts: 264
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Posted: Mon Sep 07, 2020 11:45 am Post subject: |
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Ksig wrote: | MJST wrote: | Ksig wrote: | Im pretty sure he's been our best 3pt shooter (besides maybe Lebron/AD) in the bubble on good volume (25/64 for 39%), so he's actually turning into a very good shooter with elite defense. |
Elite is a very big stretch. |
He's much closer to elite than what you give him credit for. And the stats in the bubble and what we're seeing backs it up; aside from one bad game in game 1. |
If the opponent offense is purposely switching/not switching just for attacking you, you're far from an elite defender. |
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ahaider Star Player
Joined: 21 Feb 2012 Posts: 3501
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Posted: Mon Sep 07, 2020 12:21 pm Post subject: |
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MJST wrote: | Ksig wrote: | Im pretty sure he's been our best 3pt shooter (besides maybe Lebron/AD) in the bubble on good volume (25/64 for 39%), so he's actually turning into a very good shooter with elite defense. |
Elite is a very big stretch. |
During the season - sure I would agree with you.
Since entering the bubble - he's held opponents to 43.5% fg shooting.
He's gone from waxing energy levels and bouncing on the balls of his feet to in the bubble - much superior footwork and energy. He doesn't bounce, he shuffles, maintaining both proper balance and a full range of motion. He doesn't struggle to change directions or move laterally anywhere near as much as he used to.
His range of motion and length are certainly valuable tools for us. On offense - I'd like to see him continue his effort & rolling as he did last night. He's also good at corner 3's we need to play more to his strengths offensively. _________________ Author of James Harden and the Strip Club
"The key to good decision making is not knowledge. It is understanding. We are swimming in the former. We are desperately lacking in the latter." - Malcom Gladwell |
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Ksig Star Player
Joined: 03 Dec 2016 Posts: 2098
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Posted: Mon Sep 07, 2020 12:23 pm Post subject: |
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cencio_999 wrote: | Ksig wrote: | MJST wrote: | Ksig wrote: | Im pretty sure he's been our best 3pt shooter (besides maybe Lebron/AD) in the bubble on good volume (25/64 for 39%), so he's actually turning into a very good shooter with elite defense. |
Elite is a very big stretch. |
He's much closer to elite than what you give him credit for. And the stats in the bubble and what we're seeing backs it up; aside from one bad game in game 1. |
If the opponent offense is purposely switching/not switching just for attacking you, you're far from an elite defender. |
If you want to focus on just game 1 I guess. I'm talking about what hes done in the bubble as a whole. He doesn't have the reputation as a good defender yet but thats good for us. |
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epic_ Franchise Player
Joined: 23 Jan 2020 Posts: 11310
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Posted: Mon Sep 07, 2020 12:24 pm Post subject: |
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Quote: | Playoff Faigen
@hmfaigen
Kyle Kuzma said that an adjustment from Game 1 to Game 2 for him was making sure he didn't just get "stuck in the corner" on offense.
"Just trying to move around more and punish them." |
This was big.
Kuz got some nice offensive rebound opportunities by coming off the corners too, like pj Tucker does. _________________ 💜💛 🏆 👀 🍖 #18!!! |
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pjiddy Retired Number
Joined: 12 Dec 2005 Posts: 29078
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Posted: Mon Sep 07, 2020 2:15 pm Post subject: |
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Ksig wrote: | MJST wrote: | Ksig wrote: | Im pretty sure he's been our best 3pt shooter (besides maybe Lebron/AD) in the bubble on good volume (25/64 for 39%), so he's actually turning into a very good shooter with elite defense. |
Elite is a very big stretch. |
He's much closer to elite than what you give him credit for. And the stats in the bubble and what we're seeing backs it up; aside from one bad game in game 1. |
He’s been good on D. Elite? No. |
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jonnybravo Retired Number
Joined: 21 Sep 2007 Posts: 30722
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Posted: Mon Sep 07, 2020 2:51 pm Post subject: |
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cencio_999 wrote: | FrankUnderwood wrote: | cencio_999 wrote: | AFireInside619 wrote: | cencio_999 wrote: | He is basically the same player he was as a rookie.
Not a bust considering his draft position, but still a disappointment. |
Are we watching the same game? You know he’s been solid inside the bubble right? Find someone else who does what he does for 3 million a year. |
I'm looking at his development over the last three years, not just at a bunch of games inside the bubble.
Last summer our front office (and most of us) clearly supposed/hoped he could have became a reliable 3rd scoring option in a championship team, but he's not. |
He’s wayyyy better in all aspects except shooting since his rookie year. Especially his defense and ball handling. |
I remember him attacking the rim more in his rookie year than now.
It surely depends on his different role in the team and the different roster, but I don't see how you can see an improvement in his ball handling.
Now, almost half of his FGA are 3 pointers, and if his shooting got worse, clearly his offensive contribution got worse.
Re defense, he's clearly putting into more effort in it (at least in the last games), but he's still the weak link that any offense tries to exploit and his defense almost never makes uncomfortable his matchup. |
He'd mainly attack the rim off the ball. It feels like Lonzo was really the guy that got the best out of Kuz. _________________ KOBE |
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jonnybravo Retired Number
Joined: 21 Sep 2007 Posts: 30722
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Posted: Mon Sep 07, 2020 2:54 pm Post subject: |
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Ksig wrote: | cencio_999 wrote: | Ksig wrote: | MJST wrote: | Ksig wrote: | Im pretty sure he's been our best 3pt shooter (besides maybe Lebron/AD) in the bubble on good volume (25/64 for 39%), so he's actually turning into a very good shooter with elite defense. |
Elite is a very big stretch. |
He's much closer to elite than what you give him credit for. And the stats in the bubble and what we're seeing backs it up; aside from one bad game in game 1. |
If the opponent offense is purposely switching/not switching just for attacking you, you're far from an elite defender. |
If you want to focus on just game 1 I guess. I'm talking about what hes done in the bubble as a whole. He doesn't have the reputation as a good defender yet but thats good for us. |
It's worse for us imo. Dude's that have a reputation for their defense usually get away with murder. _________________ KOBE |
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hype Star Player
Joined: 19 Nov 2007 Posts: 4378 Location: Lake Nacimiento
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Posted: Mon Sep 07, 2020 4:18 pm Post subject: |
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pjiddy wrote: | Ksig wrote: | MJST wrote: | Ksig wrote: | Im pretty sure he's been our best 3pt shooter (besides maybe Lebron/AD) in the bubble on good volume (25/64 for 39%), so he's actually turning into a very good shooter with elite defense. |
Elite is a very big stretch. |
He's much closer to elite than what you give him credit for. And the stats in the bubble and what we're seeing backs it up; aside from one bad game in game 1. |
He’s been good on D. Elite? No. |
I agree shooting wise he has a ways to go before we give him the elite status. But as far as defense if we're talking just since the bubble started he has absolutely been playing elite defense (I will say game 1 was rough like I said earlier though). I clearly see the improvement while watching the game and the numbers all back it up. I'm still in wait and see mode for the rest of the Playoffs but the turn around he has made is pretty insane from just earlier this season and he gets nothing but props for me up until this point at least. |
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mhan00 Retired Number
Joined: 13 Apr 2001 Posts: 32071
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Posted: Tue Sep 08, 2020 1:30 pm Post subject: |
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It would be wonderful to see a second consecutive great game from Kuzma. He got picked on relentlessly in the fourth quarter of game one and was helpless. Much better job in game two with the Lakers defensive adjustments and Westbrook playing some of the worst basketball of his life. Houston is going to be adjusting and we need Kuzma to keep up his growth on D and to hit open shots and make opportune cuts. Game three is probably going to be a very difficult game for us with Westbrook in particular foaming at the mouth to prove himself after all the talk about his performance in game two. |
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AD23 Star Player
Joined: 15 Jul 2019 Posts: 3069
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Posted: Tue Sep 08, 2020 5:46 pm Post subject: |
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Definitely not a 3rd option on this team. His offensive game is relegated to shooting 3’s or dives to the basket. It’s painful to watch him try and take his man off the dribble. |
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kikanga Retired Number
Joined: 15 Sep 2012 Posts: 29381 Location: La La Land
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Posted: Tue Sep 08, 2020 5:53 pm Post subject: |
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Needs to get lower on defense. A little to upright for my liking. We're playing a small and strong team. Gotta lower that center of gravity. _________________ "Every hurt is a lesson, and every lesson makes you better” |
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lakersboy Star Player
Joined: 20 Jul 2006 Posts: 8518 Location: Left coast
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Posted: Tue Sep 08, 2020 7:46 pm Post subject: |
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cencio_999 wrote: | [
If the opponent offense is purposely switching/not switching just for attacking you, you're far from an elite defender. |
Yeah, they still try to target him, but the results haven't been good. It'll be a while before they stop trying.
I am watching him in rd 2 game 3, and it's interesting that he doesn't have nervous feet. He stays still and reacts when the time is right. He's quick enough to stay with or in front of players big and small. Nobody gets anything free off him. You can tell he's confident. Call it elite or not, this guy is playing VERY GOOD d right now. |
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dood23 Franchise Player
Joined: 16 Jun 2010 Posts: 12084
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Posted: Tue Sep 08, 2020 7:48 pm Post subject: |
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he was in the right place every time tonight _________________ "There's only 2 dudes better than me, and I'm BOTH OF THEM." |
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yinoma2001 Retired Number
Joined: 19 Jun 2010 Posts: 119487
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Posted: Tue Sep 08, 2020 7:52 pm Post subject: |
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His off ball cutting was on 🔥 _________________ From 2-10 to the Western Conference Finals |
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